What's your religion ???

[Thundercrack85]

Harris' argument about free will actually reminds me of the religious issue of predestination.

But personally, I believe we have free will, at least, to the extent our environment, and the own constraints of our limited human minds allow us to have it.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

That's rich coming from a Christian. Did you know that the majority of the prison population in the States is religious? Very few atheists in prison.

So, for you to say that many atheists are decent, normal people is a bit of an insult given that they're the least represented in prison.

Well, that's not so strange, most americans identify as christians

Insult? Exactly how is that an insult? If I say nice things about atheists, then that is wrong too... Is this Bizarro world?

 

[Doctor Evo]

Well, that's not so strange, most americans identify as christians

They're disproportionately represented in prison systems is what he meant.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

But personally, I believe we have free will, at least, to the extent our environment, and the own constraints of our limited human minds allow us to have it.

What if your beliefs are predetermined?

 

[Snow Queen]

I'll get back to it, have to find it first. But if you're curious, check out Sam Harris' book on free will. I believe that's the title of the book as well. He's one of the "four horsemen". Or "three horsemen, now that Hitchens has passed away.

I didn't mean that all atheists have the same beliefs. Maybe I didn't make that clear, but I was always talking about the hardcore atheists. The ones with the same philosophy ss Dawkins, Provine, Hamilton etc.

Alright. And I think I'll pass on the book mostly because I don't want to bother spending money on that since I just have better things to spend my money on and the nearest library's rather far away since the close one shut down.

Well, what is a hardcore atheist? Since, if atheist means not believing in a deity, then wouldn't a hardcore atheist just be someone who really doesn't believe in a deity? I understand what you mean by people with the same philosophy as them but I'm a bit lost on why you chose to call them hardcore atheists.

 

[Doctor Evo]

Every time I see your name I keep thinking of Doctor Nemesis from X-Men.

I don't know who that is.

 

[Thundercrack85]

What if your beliefs are predetermined?

Predetermined by God? Or by my environment?

I believe the latter (well, obviously I wouldn't believe the former, being an atheist), but that still leaves room for some free will.

Our nature and nurturing will inevitably bias us considerably.

For the record, I haven't actually read Harris' book, so, I don't actually know what he said. I've been meaning to get around to reading his work. Really more of a Hitchens man myself.

 

[KevanG]

I don't know who that is.

He's hilarious and amazing.

Spoiler

 

[Thundercrack85]

He even has a thing for sharks.

 

[Feenix]

Predetermined by God? Or by my environment?

I believe the latter (well, obviously I wouldn't believe the former, being an atheist), but that still leaves room for some free will.

Our nature and nurturing will inevitably bias us considerably.

For the record, I haven't actually read Harris' book, so, I don't actually know what he said. I've been meaning to get around to reading his work. Really more of a Hitchens man myself.

As am I. I love "god is not Great." His writings about Mother Teresa and that she's a vicious fraud were fantastic.

The more the religious revere someone, the more suspicious I am about that person's motives.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

I believe the latter (well, obviously I wouldn't believe the former, being an atheist), but that still leaves room for some free will.

Our nature and nurturing will inevitably bias us considerably.

For the record, I haven't actually read Harris' book, so, I don't actually know what he said. I've been meaning to get around to reading his work. Really more of a Hitchens man myself.

Alright, there are some who deny it completely. William Provine is one example. I find that a bit frightening, if that view becomes the dominant one... One of them (can't remember the name right now) came with the suggestion that we abolish prisons.

But I like to believe that people are smarter than that.

 

[Doctor Evo]

He's hilarious and amazing.

Spoiler

I already love him. For so many reasons. :heart:

 

[KevanG]

Look for the X-Club series. It's only five issues but it's chock full of him being awesome.

 

[Feenix]

Alright, there are some who deny it completely. William Provine is one example. I find that a bit frightening, if that view becomes the dominant one... One of them (can't remember the name right now) came with the suggestion that we abolish prisons.

But I like to believe that people are smarter than that.

Well, prisons don't help. I guess it's more the specific type of prisons. In America, for instance, they have one of the highest incarceration rates of any other country, yet their crime rates aren't dropping. If prisons worked, there would be less crime, no? Add to that the lack of socialist policies in place, and you have a recipe for a never-ending cycle of crime and re-offending.

The fact is that prisons make it worse. Once prisoners are released, they tend to re-offend because they learned nothing in prison other than how to act like an animal.

The most successful prisons in the world (see Norway) are the ones that treat their prisoners like human beings. You may not like it, but isn't the point of prison to make sure these people don't commit more crimes? But, North America is so individualistic that it wouldn't matter if the person that robbed you ended up robbing your next door neighbour after he was released from jail, as long as the robber went to jail for the crime he committed against you.


Of course, there are exceptions. I'm taking about the general population.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

As am I. I love "god is not Great." His writings about Mother Teresa and that she's a vicious fraud were fantastic. .

Mother Theresa did more good things for poor people than Hitchens. That book was full of distortions and speculations.

While it was sometimes fun watching him debate, he was very a angry and hateful man. I don't know why many otherwise liberal people could be fans of this man, with him supporting the Iraq war and all.

 

[Doctor Evo]

Mother Theresa did more good things for poor people than Hitchens. That book was full of distortions and speculations.

While it was sometimes fun watching him debate, he was very a angry and hateful man. I don't know why many otherwise liberal people could be fans of this man, with him supporting the Iraq war and all.

He was a truly independent thinker. I can disagree with some of his philosophy and still admire the man.

Is this concept truly that foreign to you?

 

[Piper Maru]

Christopher Hitchens Tribute (Great Minds)

[YT]BnoH95tITic[/YT]

 

[Marvolo]

That's rich coming from a Christian. Did you know that the majority of the prison population in the States is religious? Very few atheists in prison.

So, for you to say that many atheists are decent, normal people is a bit of an insult given that they're the least represented in prison.

For the record many inmates find religion after incarceration.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

The most successful prisons in the world (see Norway) are the ones that treat their prisoners like human beings. You may not like it, but isn't the point of prison to make sure these people don't commit more crimes? But, North America is so individualistic that it wouldn't matter if the person that robbed you ended up robbing your next door neighbour after he was released from jail, as long as the robber went to jail for the crime he committed against you.

So... Where did I call for harsh punishment of criminals? I'm against capital punishment and so on. My faith teaches that forgiveness is important. I believe that every person has the potential to become a better person.

I like America, and I like Americans. But there are many things I don't like about the country. The way criminals are treated, its wars, factory farming and extreme forms of capitalism. But no country is perfect.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I probably missed it, but what is your faith?

 

[Just_Human]

I'm Muslim





Except during the month of Ramadan

 

[BestGirl]

Well, prisons don't help. I guess it's more the specific type of prisons. In America, for instance, they have one of the highest incarceration rates of any other country, yet their crime rates aren't dropping. If prisons worked, there would be less crime, no? Add to that the lack of socialist policies in place, and you have a recipe for a never-ending cycle of crime and re-offending.

The fact is that prisons make it worse. Once prisoners are released, they tend to re-offend because they learned nothing in prison other than how to act like an animal.

The most successful prisons in the world (see Norway) are the ones that treat their prisoners like human beings. You may not like it, but isn't the point of prison to make sure these people don't commit more crimes? But, North America is so individualistic that it wouldn't matter if the person that robbed you ended up robbing your next door neighbour after he was released from jail, as long as the robber went to jail for the crime he committed against you.


Of course, there are exceptions. I'm taking about the general population.

Actually, the US crime rate has been dropping for years. The 2012 American homicide rate, for example, was the lowest it's been since the mid-1950s. I'd prefer a prison system more like Norway's, too, since I find it more reasonable and humane, and I think we could lower crime rates even further with it, but the causes of criminality are highly complex.

 

[Warhammer]

I'm Muslim





Except during the month of Ramadan

Not sure if srs, but if you are...

 

[Lunar_Wolf]

I bought 'The God Delusion'. Looking forward to reading it.

 

[KevanG]

I just noticed we have three Scientology votes. I'm curious if those are real or just people messing around.