Who could take the Maestro?

[bored]

I was thinking, Maestro took out most of his universes heroes, including Silver Surfer and the 'mighty' Thor, so I was thinking...who would be able to take him?

I have a few ideas....

The Sentry would trash him, I think, and probably Hyperion...but that's all I could personally think of.

It's simple, just put him in a Bendis title, then have him fight some ninjas.

 

[Shadowknight]

That's just it, we know that there was a war and that that reality's Hulk beat a bunch of heroes. /quote]
Not exactly. The novel "What Savage Beast" and Future Imperfect pretty much stated that he holed up in the Gamma Cave (now well stocked with food, supplies, and various pieces of technological equipment) and waited for the war to be over, and the war is what led to most/all of the other super-powered people dying.

As to the silver surfer - Marvel: Zombies had a zombie Hulk bite his head off, so I imagine the much stronger Maestro could rip his head off easily.

Saint of Killers - lame as I found this, enough Gamma Radiation allowed the Maestro to reconstitute his ATOMIZED ASHES and come back from the dead. The Saint could kill him, but as show with the much weaker Grey Hulk's battle with Wolverine, he can heal in seconds. So if he dies, he comes back to life. If he gets merely wounded, he heals almost instantly. The Saint survived a nuclear blast, but the Maestro could MAYBE come up with a device to negate his heavenly abilities (eventually) and kill him.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I would contend that Marvel Zombies was stupid and ill-conceived on the Silver Surfer's death, then. On paper, it's highly unlikely that any Hulk could take the Surfer. He has just about every conceivable advantage except strength, and strength doesn't count for much if the Hulk could never possibly touch him. The reason we accept that he killed the Surfer in Future Imperfect is simply because he's got his board and it's not shown how he beat him, so we can't really take issue with it.

 

[Elijya]

I still say that Marvel Zombies was an alternate reality wherein several differences were pointed out between it and the 616, and it's no great leap to suppose that many characters power levels could be different as well

 

[MJOILNIR]

It was pretty far out there wasnt it

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Phoenix could probably kill Maestro....that was lame....surely I can come up with something better than that....Maestro is pretty much the mightest mortal and smartest fighter the world has ever known, unless you are an insanely powerful quasi god you probably have no shot....although I suppose Black Bolt could beat him if he got to speak.

 

[Tropico]

Not exactly. The novel "What Savage Beast" and Future Imperfect pretty much stated that he holed up in the Gamma Cave (now well stocked with food, supplies, and various pieces of technological equipment) and waited for the war to be over, and the war is what led to most/all of the other super-powered people dying.

And then he beat the rest of the heroes. Not much difference from what I posted, isn't it?

As to the silver surfer - Marvel: Zombies had a zombie Hulk bite his head off, so I imagine the much stronger Maestro could rip his head off easily.

What Elijya said. The same applies to whatever other trophies indicating heros' deaths. For example, for all we know Mjolnir was sitting there because they killed Thor's human counterpart.

Saint of Killers - lame as I found this, enough Gamma Radiation allowed the Maestro to reconstitute his ATOMIZED ASHES and come back from the dead. The Saint could kill him, but as show with the much weaker Grey Hulk's battle with Wolverine, he can heal in seconds. So if he dies, he comes back to life. If he gets merely wounded, he heals almost instantly. The Saint survived a nuclear blast, but the Maestro could MAYBE come up with a device to negate his heavenly abilities (eventually) and kill him.

I found this in Wikipedia in regards to Saint Killer's guns: Any wound inflicted is always fatal regardless of circumstance. It's conceivable he wouldn't heal from those gunshots.

 

[Elijya]

yup. As decreed by God himself: "These guns would not misfire, nor would their hammers fall on empty chambers. No shot they fired would miss its mark, no wound they gave would be anything but fatal."

 

[SuperFerret]

yup. As decreed by God himself: "These guns would not misfire, nor would their hammers fall on empty chambers. No shot they fired would miss its mark, no wound they gave would be anything but fatal."

Where can I read about this guy? He sounds very interesting.

 

[Elijya]

you need to read a series called Preacher, arguably the single greatest comic series of the past 10 years

just to give you a taste, check out the cover gallery:
http://milehighcomics.com/cgi-bin/backissue.cgi?action=list&title=63256394934&snumber=1

 

[Cyclops]

Gotta love it. Elijya, the comics industry's number one sales tool that they don't know about.

 

[Vanguard07]

yup. As decreed by God himself: "These guns would not misfire, nor would their hammers fall on empty chambers. No shot they fired would miss its mark, no wound they gave would be anything but fatal."

Do they have a particularly impressive muzzle velocity? cause it would take a lot more than a normal gun to inflict any kind of wound on Maestro.

I dont know anything about this guy but if those are the only enhancements to his guns (as impressive as they are) i dont think they'd do the trick. Even infinite ammo wouldnt damage Maestro and it wouldnt matter if you missed or not. the bullets would bounce off.

 

[Elijya]

Vanguard, lemme repeat: AS DECREED BY GOD HIMSELF

if God says those guns will kill you, they're gonna kill you

Wanna know where those guns came from? They were forged by Satan after melting down the Angel of Death's sword. Savvy?

 

[Tropico]

Do they have a particularly impressive muzzle velocity? cause it would take a lot more than a normal gun to inflict any kind of wound on Maestro.

I dont know anything about this guy but if those are the only enhancements to his guns (as impressive as they are) i dont think they'd do the trick. Even infinite ammo wouldnt damage Maestro and it wouldnt matter if you missed or not. the bullets would bounce off.

What do you fail to understand from God decreed no wound they gave would be anything but fatal?

The Saint of Killers (Warning - Link contains massive spoilers for one of the greatest comics series ever. Don't ruin it for yourselves, please - Elijya)possesses a pair of Walker Colt revolvers, which were made from the Angel of Death's sword. Because of this, the guns are of divine nature.

 

[Vanguard07]

yeah but "no wound they gave would be anything but fatal" to me still hinges on them leaving a wound. Even if it's just a tiny scratch it'd have to pierce the skin.

In terms of enchantments and such you usually have to take the wording pretty seriously. So these guns would never miss. they would never misfire. they would never run out of ammo. And any wound they left no matter how small would kill. but unless they have some seriously enhanced muzzle velocity they wouldnt leave any wound at all. And no wound at all, deffinitely doesnt fall under the "any wound" category.

 

[Elijya]

Vanguard, you're attempting to apply real world physics to a metaphysical object, it doesn't work that way.

 

[Tropico]

yeah but "no wound they gave would be anything but fatal" to me still hinges on them leaving a wound. Even if it's just a tiny scratch it'd have to pierce the skin.

In terms of enchantments and such you usually have to take the wording pretty seriously. So these guns would never miss. they would never misfire. they would never run out of ammo. And any wound they left no matter how small would kill. but unless they have some seriously enhanced muzzle velocity they wouldnt leave any wound at all. And no wound at all, deffinitely doesnt fall under the "any wound" category.

If they NEVER miss and he aims for his heart, not the chest area but his real beating heart, don't you think it would penetrate his skin? What am I saying? Of course you won't!

 

[Elijya]

this reminds me of when I had Jesse Custer in the DTL, and whoever I fought in my first match rationalized that his powers wouldn't work on Captain Britain because his will was too strong

 

[Diamondhead]

I was thinking, Maestro took out most of his universes heroes, including Silver Surfer and the 'mighty' Thor, so I was thinking...who would be able to take him?

I have a few ideas....

The Sentry would trash him, I think, and probably Hyperion...but that's all I could personally think of.

Nobody !
The maestro would rip off the sentry and Hyperion spine to make necklaces to his war dogs
lol

 

[Elijya]

If I'm not mistaken, didn't Sentry go toe-to-toe with Galactus? I can't imagine the devourer of worlds, who can control the very energy that the universe itself is made of, would have a problem with a guy who's just really really strong

Galactus can probably control gravity to some degree or another, right? well here: gravitationally suspend Meastro in the air. Now what's he gonna do. He can't move if he has nothing to push off of, he'll just be stuck there. Done, fight's over.

And Meastro and Hulk are incredibly strong, no doubt, but they have Zero in the way of superspeed. So sure, they might be able to take Sentry in an arm wrestling match, but what's to stop Sentry/Superman/Hyperion/etc. from flying them into space in 0.000652 seconds, before they've even batted an eye?

 

[Vanguard07]

If they NEVER miss and he aims for his heart, not the chest area but his real beating heart, don't you think it would penetrate his skin? What am I saying? Of course you won't!

I dont appreciate that implication.
Although I will concede the point that if he had the presence of mind to aim for the heart (directly, not his chest) then it would penetrate his skin.
That thought had not previously occurred to me.
However I would just like to bring up the point that most people with guns like that would likely just be aiming for the person in general. Generally people dont aim for what they cant see so it's more likely he'd shoot for the chest area (which I dont think would work) and would give Maestro an opening (small difference it'd make though since the Maestro wouldnt be able to kill the saint of killers).

Also I disagree that my application of logic cant work on a metaphysical object. The enchantments you mentioned on these guns were in quotations. Which led me to believe that they were worded in specifically that way. And they were very specific enchantments. If they were vague then I'd agree that they're harder to interpret but they're not. They wont miss, they wont missfire, the hammers wont fall on empty chambers and any wound they inflict would kill. Which still requires a wound. It didnt say anything shot with them would die.

 

[Elijya]

Vanguard, in all fairness... you haven't read the series and seen the **** SoK is capable of. And, no offense, but you also seem to have a very limited concept of what THE ANGEL OF DEATH is capable of.

 

[Vanguard07]

Oh no. You misunderstood. I wasnt questioning the character. Just the guns. I hold no illusions that Maestro would stand any chance.
After the barest skimming of a bio i found on SoK I recognized he was far out of Maestro's league.
I was merely arguing to point out that specifically worded enchantments like that leave a lot of room for loopholes to be exploited.
I didnt mean to imply any belief that Maestro would survive such an encounter. I just asked the muzzle velocity thing out of genuine interest in the guns.... And then argued as to why I felt the specifics on those guns were important.

My questions and comments were gun specific.

 

[Elijya]

hehe, fair enough

but I still say it's a matter of applying real world physics to metaphysical objects.

let's say the Juggernaut was only a 90 pound skinny guy, but he still had the enchantment of being an unstoppable object. He'd still be an unstoppable object. It doesn't matter if a 90 pound skinny guy couldn't normally run through a wall.

When the Saint of Killers fires a bullet at you, he's not really just firing a bullet. He's firing death itself at you, metaphoricly speaking. Friction, wind, ricochet, stuff like that, they simply don't enter into it. That bullet is going where he wants it to go, and it WILL kill you.

I see where you're coming from since the holy decrees mentioned above don't say anything about the actual power of the gun, but that doesn't mean that it's just a regular gun outside of what's word-for-word literally said. Heck, we know it's not. The guns are Walker Colt revolvers from the 19th century, their real-world fire power is insignificant (compared to today's guns). But we've seen the Saint fire through a bradley tank hull like it was made of butter. So, there ya go.

 

[Vanguard07]

Heh. Yeah see I dont buy that. Everything has rules to it and the rules for those guns dont indicate that they fire death instead of bullets. They fire magic bullets.
Again you have to look at the specific wording they laid out.
Unless there's specific instances in Preacher where they indicated that these rules were open to interpretation then i'm gonna believe that something decreed by god should be taken pretty seriously/litterally.

I believe god would choose his phrasing carefully and if he wanted these guns to shoot pure death in physical form he'd be more specific about that. But i cant believe that since there was nothing vague about the way he put it.