Who could take the Maestro?

[Elijya]

I think when you're dealing with things empowered by God himself, they go beyond the scope of simply "magic".

If nothing else, it's more than reasonable to assume the effects of the decree would be from the decree's intent and not literal meaning.

For instance "nor would their hammers fall on empty chambers". Nowhere in that sentence does it say that the hammers would actually fall on bullets, it just says the chambers would not be empty. He could pull the trigger one day and the hammer would fall on chambers full of bubble gum. That would fall within the guidelines of the decree, now wouldn't it? That's if the decree is taken literally, which it's not, it's based on the intention of the decree, and the intention of "nor would their hammers fall on empty chambers" is that there would always be bullets in the chambers.

 

[Vanguard07]

heh. Clever.
You know what man. I like you.
I like your arguments.
and I'm even gonna go so far as admitting that you're probably right on this one just cause I'm in a good mood and you know more about the comics that make up the context of this argument.

I dont agree with your opinion on the matter but you've actually argued it well enough for me concede anyway and as of yet you're the first on the hype that's done that.
Well done sir.

 

[Elijya]

Thank you, thank you very much. This is definitely one of the better arguments I've had here.

And I was actually just about to comment on the ridiculous, yet impressive, length we've taken this conversation to. Oh sure, some people have argued for weeks over Superman vs. Goku or whetever, but this was so much more... esoteric

 

[yahman]

I find it very hard to believe he beat the surfer, but like all marvel 'power houses' his powers fluctuate drastically.

Sentry's performances in the recent New Avengers run, suggest he is nowhere near a Surfer level in power. With the exception of the Terrax beating, I have yet to see Sentry do anything impressive.

If we are referring to the Squadron Sinister version of Hyperion, i can't see him doing any better than Sentry. He was recently allocated with level 6 strength in the most recent Handbook, that suggests that he is certainly not up for the task.

Based on recent performances, the only earth based being capable of beating the maestro is probably photon (the ex gennis vehl), although hes currently deceased. Hyper dimensional powers, and in exhaustible energy tend to given anyone a big advantage in a fight.

 

[Elijya]

just get Gravitron. You suspend Maestro in the air, he's got nothing to get his hands on, nothing to push off of, he's stuck

 

[yahman]

just get Gravitron. You suspend Maestro in the air, he's got nothing to get his hands on, nothing to push off of, he's stuck

Agreed .... Graviton is very mush underestimated , even by the marvel writers. He was recently taken down with one shot, by Iron man. (And i don think there was any 'Hole' distracting him).

 

[Elijya]

actually, I don't think there's really anything to keep Graviton from just flinging all of his opponents into space. Is there really?

 

[DBM]

actually, I don't think there's really anything to keep Graviton from just flinging all of his opponents into space. Is there really?

I'm pretty sure in THunderbolts vol. 1 he lifted a whole bunch of cities into the air and was going to destroy them or something before he was stopped. He's really frickin' powerful.

 

[yahman]

I'm pretty sure in THunderbolts vol. 1 he lifted a whole bunch of cities into the air and was going to destroy them or something before he was stopped. He's really frickin' powerful.

Some much potential with Grravity powers ;
Time Dilation
Worm Hole Creation
Manipulation of the other forces ...

IMO he should be developed into the Avengers version of Magneto ...

 

[Elijya]

yeah, I know, and I don't think he uses his full potential all the time.

The Thunderbolts beat him because they went to Aaron Stack and got some kind of device which negated gravity for the wearer, so they could get to him. But even if you can't repel the person, all you have to do is throw a big enough object in their direction. Like, say, Oregon.

 

[yahman]

yeah, I know, and I don't think he uses his full potential all the time.

The Thunderbolts beat him because they went to Aaron Stack and got some kind of device which negated gravity for the wearer, so they could get to him. But even if you can't repel the person, all you have to do is throw a big enough object in their direction. Like, say, Oregon.

LOL ... I haven't read many of his appearances, but that Thunderbolts issue seems very Ex machina esque ....

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

I'd say Black Bolt might be able to take Maestro..Double B defeated the Savage Hulk on two occasions, pretty easily imo....He can, after all re-arrange molecules, and nevermind what would happen if he screamed into Maestro's face..

Ghost Rider as well. The Pennance Stare might reduce the Maestro to a babbling mental case....

Maybe Professor X as well...?

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

If we are referring to the Squadron Sinister version of Hyperion, i can't see him doing any better than Sentry. He was recently allocated with level 6 strength in the most recent Handbook, that suggests that he is certainly not up for the task.

Oh, heck no. The savage Hulk has fought the Squadron Sinister Hyperion twice and completely demolished him both times.

Hyperion wouldnt have a PRAYER against The Maestro...

 

[Elijya]

yeah, but that's the Squadron Sinister version

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Wasn't the Squadron Sinister version comparable in power to the Gruenwald version?

 

[Elijya]

I'm not sure, but the Gruenwald version (if you wanna call him that, Gruenwald didn't create him or the SS, just did their most memorable story) could go toe-to-toe with Thor. Granted, Thor usually won, but it was a close match. And we know how Thor stacks up to Hulk, so I'd say the Gruenwald Hyperion is at least in his class, although he wouldn't win. I just don't think it'd be a pushover match

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Given Thor's record against the Hulk and his record against the 712 (I think that's the number for the original Squadron's world) Hyperion, I'd say any match Hyperion has against the Maestro would be a pushover match. Thor rarely manages to break even against the Hulk. He puts up about as even a fight as anyone can hope to against the Hulk, but ultimately his losses just keep piling up. If the 712 Hyperion can't manage to beat Thor, I doubt he'd stand much of a chance against the Maestro. Plus, look at the recent Exiles. Power Princess was the closest being to Hyperion in power on their world and the Maestro tore through her and the other Exiles with ease once they'd pissed him off.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Im sorry to say i havent read Gruenwald's Squadron Supreme in years, but i seem to recall his version fighting the Squadron Sinister version...the SS version ambushed him and sent him to exile in space (iirc), then took his place in the Squadron Supreme (which included banging Power Princess, lol)...Gruenwald's version finally returned after, like, three months, extremely pissed off, and beat the Sinister version nearly to death....

 

[TheCorpulent1]

The 712 Hyperion melts the Squadron Sinister version with his atomic vision, actually. That's why the 712 Hyperion started wearing the stylish green shades--he was blind afterwards from straining his eyes with so much atomic vision. But before that, they were physically fighting each other pretty much blow for blow. Even in the atomic vision battle, the two beams met and each Hyperion struggled desperately, pushing as hard as he could until the 712 Hyperion finally, slowly, pushed his atomic vision back to the other's eyes, melting him. It was very much an even fight, it just turned out in the end that the 712 Hyperion had that much more power than the imposter.

Either way, there must be a new Squadron Sinister Hyperion around because that's obviously someone working with the Squadron in Thunderbolts, and the 712 Hyperion has been seen on Earth-712 alongside the other Squadron Supreme members in the present in Exiles.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Black Bolt (as I mentioned earlier) the more I think about it, should be able to take out Maestro rather soundly.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

The 712 Hyperion melts the Squadron Sinister version with his atomic vision, actually. That's why the 712 Hyperion started wearing the stylish green shades--he was blind afterwards from straining his eyes with so much atomic vision. But before that, they were physically fighting each other pretty much blow for blow. Even in the atomic vision battle, the two beams met and each Hyperion struggled desperately, pushing as hard as he could until the 712 Hyperion finally, slowly, pushed his atomic vision back to the other's eyes, melting him. It was very much an even fight, it just turned out in the end that the 712 Hyperion had that much more power than the imposter.

Either way, there must be a new Squadron Sinister Hyperion around because that's obviously someone working with the Squadron in Thunderbolts, and the 712 Hyperion has been seen on Earth-712 alongside the other Squadron Supreme members in the present in Exiles.

Yeah, i think The Game Master may have restored the Sinister Hyperion, but im not sure if that's exactly where they're going with it...just a personal theory, as he was responsible for creating the Sinister version to begin with, iirc...

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, the Sinister Hyperion was just inert matter before the Gamemaster gave it life, right? I guess it's possible he simply created a new one. The one in Thunderbolts now appears more in line with the 712 version, though. The previous one was a bit of a thug.

 

[Fading]

I don't really post too much, but haven't been a member long. Usually just enjoy reading these, but wanted to say this is why I don't like Hulk or Superman vs.....well not pheonix ones either.

Simply because if you say well X could grind Maestro/Hulk to dust, someone can say "Well then the initial hit angers Maestro/Hulk and he gets stronger and wins" heh. Not saying anyone in this post is like that, just can go back and forth a lot, not that I don't like Maestro or the Hulk.

My personal opinion is 1v1 Maestro's very tough, and chances are it'd take teamwork. I'll prob get flamed as a fanboy but I say the X-men stand as good a chance as anyone. They do like they did in a previous hulk fight before hulk became war. They simply call up forge and have him come up with a hulk stopping gun, call in as many troups with the right powers they need and stall till forge arrives. Now if Hulk/Maestro busts in on them while they sleep their in trouble lol. It's like batman with prep time I guess, if he's confronted flat out with someone like spiderman or wolverine he'd probably lose, but given time and using the first fight as a test fight to gauge weaknesses and abilities he could prob make a gas to knockout spidey and wolvie, or an adamantium dissolvent. If Maestro was simply stomping around and whichever powerful hero's or teams knew where he was and had the time they could probably develop a good stratgey and take them, Maestro gets the first hit or the surprise and it's a different story.

If someone like surfer was out to kill maestro I think he could take him, I don't know everything about Surfers power (have read only a few of his comics), but I hear people talk about messing with particles and such (I should probably just have googled it lol), so I doubt he'd have to slug it out on the ground with Maestro. Thor in his prime using his powers and not devolving from a powerhouse to an average brick to enjoy a fist fight can prob take him. Prof X I think could mind wipe him. I also think Magneto like he was in Fatal Attractions and going all out could take him (I'm sure some will disagree with that). Just magneto at that point barely felt a prolonged kiss from rogue, and not only held avalon up but forced 30 or so + X-men on their knees and only reason they hit back was because bishop absorbed magneto's overload. I think he could probably land a few astoroids or cities on maestro at that lvl.

Last I'll say which more will disagree with, but possibly, possibly Apocolypse. I know hulk wasn't at his strongest from being separated from banner, but he was still powerful, and Apoc easily choked him out, and had him on his knees. Now 'if' he could do that to a savage hulk and he's just better against bricks than energy wielders and psychics like I think he is, then he might have a good fight with Maestro.

 

[Vanguard07]

Any of the Cosmics could do it pretty easilly.
Silver Surfer, Thanos, Sentry probably could from what i hear about him.
I'm convinced Black Bolt could with little difficulty and I refuse to hear otherwise.
Same with Dr Strange.
Cable at his prime or X-man could do it.
Rachel Grey could do it.

I dont know many who could take him in a straight up, knock down drag out type of deal but a lot of people could do it pretty easy with their more dynamic or tricky powers.
The trick is just not playing to his strengths.
He is the strongest after all.

 

[Horrorfan]

So how powerful exactly is the GOOD Hyperion? If Thor has lost to Superman, as has Hulk, and Hyperion is basically Superman, shouldn't that mean he would beat them with ease? I know someone said one sort of Hyperion lost to Thor but on the other hand I have seen a Hyperion crush HUlk and Thor (though it was an uber powerful version). All these hyperions are confusing

So Sentry, Blackbolt and a few others so far...

Never thought much about Ghost Rider. But would the penance stare work? That's assuming he could get close enough to use it....