Who's winning the Civil War/long term implications

[hippy fascist]

This weekend I was chatting with one of my best friends and he has pretty much the same opinion as Marvelman in regards to Hulk coming back and punishing those that wronged him. He went on and on on how they should be punished (including him impregnating Medusa to punish Black Bolt) to the point where he said that he should kill Tony. To which I replied: "Great! He should do all of those things to prove without a doubt that they were right in exiling him." He "watered down" the "punishments" so they wouldn't be so "severe".

I'll be honest in saying that I'm not much of a Hulk fan, but I've read Planet Hulk and found that it was pretty cool. The character has been WAY more interesting there than what he has been in a while. Like a lot of people have said: I fail to see what is the use of bringing him back to Earth. I know it's gonna be great for the Hulk zealots because Hulk is going to be pitted against the other heroes and he can smash them to their little zealot heart's content. To me, it's also great because it further solidifies that Hulk isn't a hero but an anti-hero on the edge. I can see why Marvel would take away Hulk from his ruling position, there are very few characters that DON'T become boring when they reach that status and I doubt Hulk would be one to achieve it.

Are you forgetting the worldbreaker? The planet is doomed hence he'll have no choice but to return.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Out of character because, eventhough he wants to be left alone, he still holds grudges and he doesnt forget. Plus I have already stated in an earlier post that, I think he will come to earth but not intendeing to start a war or fight, but that the Government will just attack because he is the Hulk, and the Government wont care if he wants to be left alone, they will just see him show up out of nowhere and they will see him as nothing but a threat.

"come to earth"?

For what?

He finally has everything he ever asked for.

Right where he is.

 

[Tropico]

Are you forgetting the worldbreaker? The planet is doomed hence he'll have no choice but to return.

What more glorious thing for Hulk fans than if he even defied the prophecies? They should do that. And leave him there. It'll be interesting to see if he has to pass the same warp and see how it affects him when he comes back to Earth.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Are you forgetting the worldbreaker? The planet is doomed hence he'll have no choice but to return.

Did you read the current issue?

The Hulk wasnt the worldbreaker.

 

[Darthphere]

Did you read the current issue?

The Hulk wasnt the worldbreaker.

Exactly, so clearly something else is....

 

[Darthphere]

INCREDIBLE HULK #105

Written by GREG PAK
Penciled by CARLO PAGULAYAN
Cover by LADRÖNN
PLANET HULK CONCLUSION
Sons of Sakaar, remember their names! Korg, Miek, Hiroim, Elloe, the Brood Creature and Caiera the Oldstrong! These are the heroes of Sakaar, the Green Scar's Warbound allies and the Hulk's greatest friends. As they face the terrifying conclusion to the PLANET HULK epic, who will live? Who will die? And who will pay when the Worldbreaker reveals his true face? Don't miss the shocking end to PLANET HULK -- and the launching pad for Marvel's WORLD WAR HULK summer blockbuster.
32 PGS./Rated A …$2.99

 

[Eros]

I will pick that Hulk issue up, but i still think Marvel needs to cut down on the big Earth shattering events. Isn't their some kind of down time for superheros in the marvel U?

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

I'm f*****g telling you guys. It's GALACTUS.

If the Silver Surfer wasn't enough for you guys to figure it out, THERE you go. Me, saying it again.

(I'm wondering who's memory reigns supreme in this one, because only they will not get the post I already have thought up in response.)

 

[hippy fascist]

Exactly, so clearly something else is....

Finally, someone gets it

 

[BrianWilly]

Joss Whedon supposedly came up with the end of this series. And no one knows that man as intimately -- and I do mean intimately -- as I.

Going by that clearly infallible logic, anything I conjecturize as the ending of Civil War is obviously the actual ending of Civil War. Obviously.

And I conjecturate that Phoenix comes back and rapes everyone.

There. No one saw it coming. No one but me.

 

[Darthphere]

Joss Whedon supposedly came up with the end of this series. And no one knows that man as intimately -- and I do mean intimately -- as I.

Going by that clearly infallible logic, anything I conjecturize as the ending of Civil War is obviously the actual ending of Civil War. Obviously.

And I conjecturate that Phoenix comes back and rapes everyone.

There. No one saw it coming. No one but me.

So when it sucks, remember: BLAME WHEDON.

 

[BrianWilly]

How can getting raped by Jean Grey suck? I mean, other than the literally.

 

[Dread]

So far it seems obvious that the SHRA will remain in some form, although the outright CIVIL WAR will end, probably in some tragic or Prryic way. Either the CW loses in their objectives or they suffer so devisitating a loss for victory that it seems pointless.

It doesn't seem impossible that Cap dies, although he could be faking it because LORD KNOWS Bendis needs FULL MARVEL EDITORIAL SUPPORT to have a prayer of having Ronin work when on his own it was underwhelming; he's like Bonds without "greenies". Many heroes are beloved but aside for Nick Fury I see few that would cause Wolverine to go on a fact finding quest, retcon or otherwise. And Nick Fury hasn't been seen much in this war, so it would seem tacky to have him emerge just to bite a bullet. It'd be SECRET WAR all over again (and that was an LMD). But there's a part of me that can't believe they'd REALLY off Rogers, and I am sticking to that a little.

But, yeah, it seems like Marvel is gunning for a pro-reg world where superheroes are federally monitered and those who aren't registered are full on rogues, who'd be arrested right along with the supervillians they stop. Again, just like the 70's. Joe Q's Marvel is a master at finding hip new ways to go backwards, although lord knows this aftermath is 150 times more interesting than Decimation was. The 50 state initiative thing makes sense and once things mellow I could see it working. Although if Spider-Man was meant to be a fugitive, why on Earth did they unmask him? They were returning him to hated underdog status (because, y'know, before NEW AVENGERS he was getting daily parades in NYC ) so if his identity was still secret he'd be closer to that everyman thing now. But with it exposed, Parker's an infamous celeb still. Boo.

Sure, it doesn't make sense for Hulk to come back and start tearing new ********s, but it didn't make sense for Mr. Fantastic to do a lot of things he did in CW and he did 'em anyway. It didn't make sense for Spider-Man to be such a sucker for so long but he did it anyway. Lord knows Iron Man went from justified to fascist *****e depending on the writer. For better or worse this is a Marvel where the objectives of the story are greater than the characters within, where "grim cynicism disguised as realism" trumps character development at times, and those characters will be bent or broken to fit those needs. Of course, to be fair, Hulk's made a career of being a little irrational and as PLANET HULK hasn't ended, maybe he gets a reason to return besides revenge. Besides, Hulk's been to other planets, dimentions, or so forth before and always comes back. It's his status quo. Marvel is also out to make Hulk more vicious and closer to Godzilla than he was before, as in someone who causes untold deaths and somehow the audience can root for him.

So I do see a pro-reg world emerging, and Marvel seeming to be serious about maintaining a post-event status quo for at least a year or two.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Only Sue and Johnny were revealed to be on the pardon list, I can't recall the Young Avengers being mentioned.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Joss Whedon supposedly came up with the end of this series. And no one knows that man as intimately -- and I do mean intimately -- as I.

Going by that clearly infallible logic, anything I conjecturize as the ending of Civil War is obviously the actual ending of Civil War. Obviously.

And I conjecturate that Phoenix comes back and rapes everyone.

There. No one saw it coming. No one but me.

In all seriousness. I actually do see Phoenix returning and being the one to destroy the Breakworld.

 

[Darthphere]

Its Joe Break It.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

How can getting raped by Jean Grey suck? I mean, other than the literally.

It wouldn't be rape.

 

[supermarvelman]

So far it seems obvious that the SHRA will remain in some form, although the outright CIVIL WAR will end, probably in some tragic or Prryic way. Either the CW loses in their objectives or they suffer so devisitating a loss for victory that it seems pointless.

It doesn't seem impossible that Cap dies, although he could be faking it because LORD KNOWS Bendis needs FULL MARVEL EDITORIAL SUPPORT to have a prayer of having Ronin work when on his own it was underwhelming; he's like Bonds without "greenies". Many heroes are beloved but aside for Nick Fury I see few that would cause Wolverine to go on a fact finding quest, retcon or otherwise. And Nick Fury hasn't been seen much in this war, so it would seem tacky to have him emerge just to bite a bullet. It'd be SECRET WAR all over again (and that was an LMD). But there's a part of me that can't believe they'd REALLY off Rogers, and I am sticking to that a little.

But, yeah, it seems like Marvel is gunning for a pro-reg world where superheroes are federally monitered and those who aren't registered are full on rogues, who'd be arrested right along with the supervillians they stop. Again, just like the 70's. Joe Q's Marvel is a master at finding hip new ways to go backwards, although lord knows this aftermath is 150 times more interesting than Decimation was. The 50 state initiative thing makes sense and once things mellow I could see it working. Although if Spider-Man was meant to be a fugitive, why on Earth did they unmask him? They were returning him to hated underdog status (because, y'know, before NEW AVENGERS he was getting daily parades in NYC ) so if his identity was still secret he'd be closer to that everyman thing now. But with it exposed, Parker's an infamous celeb still. Boo.

Sure, it doesn't make sense for Hulk to come back and start tearing new ********s, but it didn't make sense for Mr. Fantastic to do a lot of things he did in CW and he did 'em anyway. It didn't make sense for Spider-Man to be such a sucker for so long but he did it anyway. Lord knows Iron Man went from justified to fascist *****e depending on the writer. For better or worse this is a Marvel where the objectives of the story are greater than the characters within, where "grim cynicism disguised as realism" trumps character development at times, and those characters will be bent or broken to fit those needs. Of course, to be fair, Hulk's made a career of being a little irrational and as PLANET HULK hasn't ended, maybe he gets a reason to return besides revenge. Besides, Hulk's been to other planets, dimentions, or so forth before and always comes back. It's his status quo. Marvel is also out to make Hulk more vicious and closer to Godzilla than he was before, as in someone who causes untold deaths and somehow the audience can root for him.

So I do see a pro-reg world emerging, and Marvel seeming to be serious about maintaining a post-event status quo for at least a year or two.

Cap will fake his death, Tony will ease up on his all out assualt on the anti-regs. Maybe Tony will help Cap fake his death?

 

[Tropico]

WTF is Captain Britain doing in that cover?!

 

[3dman27]

is that the complete cover or is something wrong wit the picture?

 

[Sloth7d]

That isn't going to happen at all.

- Cable told Captain America that he was going to lose the war. Cable's from the future so he'd know.

- Solicits for the Amazing Spider-Man say that Spider-Man is on the run from the law (for being against the SHRA most likely)

- The Immortal Iron-Fist is set in a SHRA world

- The Thunderbolts, the Suicide Squad rip-off is set in a SHRA world

- Avengers: The Initiative is the story that deals with the 50 State Initiative taking off having 50 superhero teams in all 50 states of the United States

- Omega Flight is a pro-reg team and is being set up in Canada

- The President has announced 12 pardons, it appears that they will be used on Invisible Woman, Human Torch, Arachne, Wiccan, Hulkling, Vision, Speed, Patriot, and Kate Bishop. No pardon for Spider-Man

Cable also told the President that in the long run SHRA would fail.
So, short termed the Pro-side definately will win.
In the long run however, ant-reg will win. Cable already said it would fail. And like you said, he's from the future. He would know.

 

[Fantasyartist]

I personally believe that the SHRA is bad law( much like segregation for African Americans and Prohibition in the 1920s) and a such will be struck down by the Supreme Court. In practical terms it will convert formerly independent groups of heroes into the US Governmental power structure as much as say, the armed forces, the DEA or CIA are. What the US Federal authorities gain they will lose. What if say Chavez's Venezuela or Mugabe's Zimbabwe(to say nothing of North Korea or Putin's Russia) refuse a group of "registered" heroes entry into their country?

Terry

 

[Sloth7d]

He wont die, he will fake his own death. Steve will do this because he will realize that as long as "Captain America" is leading the resistance, Tony will not let up, and will keep coming at them as hard as he can until he either makes Cap change his mind (which aint gon happen), brings him into custody, or Cap dies (which Tony would not want). So Cap will fake his own death for the greater good of the resistance, and then he will take up the guise of Ronin.

Cap is Ronin.

Agreed.

 

[3dman27]

cap is ronninII? sounds interesting

 

[Sloth7d]

Well, either Cap or Hawkeye would make the most sense(I'm hoping for Cap). But knowing Bendis and how he "surprised" us with Echo before, it could be Ben Urich for all we know.