• The upgrade to XenForo 2.3.7 has now been completed. Please report any issues to our administrators.

Why is there a legal push against vaping?

whether it be smoking or vaping, the only reason for it is for those people who indulge in those habits to cover up the taste and odor of the s**t that comes out of their mouth when they spout off on defending the use of either one...
 
Depending on the source you have (typically the vapers cite "safe" ones) they are as or more dangerous than regular cigarettes.

Being a new technology and new health hazard means there is a lot of uncertainty on how to handle them. Obviously the government is going to be heavy handed and do whatever the politicians are told to do by whoever pays them the most money to do it (typically corporate and/or rich interests).

Vaping is not contrary to what vapheads think, completely or even mostly safe. Maybe safer for other people around them but it might be more dangerous for them personally and despite that "it's my body, my choice" rhetoric the moment they get cancer guess who helps foot that bill? A hint to that: everyone else who pays taxes.
 
Depending on the source you have (typically the vapers cite "safe" ones) they are as or more dangerous than regular cigarettes.

Being a new technology and new health hazard means there is a lot of uncertainty on how to handle them. Obviously the government is going to be heavy handed and do whatever the politicians are told to do by whoever pays them the most money to do it (typically corporate and/or rich interests).

Vaping is not contrary to what vapheads think, completely or even mostly safe. Maybe safer for other people around them but it might be more dangerous for them personally and despite that "it's my body, my choice" rhetoric the moment they get cancer guess who helps foot that bill? A hint to that: everyone else who pays taxes.

Why would vaping be more dangerous than cigarettes?

"Cigarette smoke contains over 4,000 chemicals, including 43 known cancer-causing (carcinogenic) compounds and 400 other toxins. These cigarette ingredients include nicotine, tar, and carbon monoxide, as well as formaldehyde, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, arsenic, and DDT."
 
As someone who's married to a nurse, it's like Teelie said about new technology. They don't allow people to vape in hospitals because they don't know what in those e-cigarettes.

Even I'm not sure if the thing can be tampered or stuff can be put in.
 
Why would vaping be more dangerous than cigarettes?

"Cigarette smoke contains over 4,000 chemicals, including 43 known cancer-causing (carcinogenic) compounds and 400 other toxins. These cigarette ingredients include nicotine, tar, and carbon monoxide, as well as formaldehyde, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, arsenic, and DDT."
The main reason off the bat I can think of is there is no telling what chemicals are in them (don't be foolish enough to believe they don't put other kinds of **** in them besides nicotine) and as I recall, at least one research paper suggested the vapor from these things increased the dosage of nicotine (and whatever other chemicals are present) than just smoking the old fashioned cigarette so it increased the likelyhood of addiction and health problems.

There is a lot that has yet to be discovered on these things so assuming it's safe because the people selling them to you say so isn't reliable.
 
The main reason off the bat I can think of is there is no telling what chemicals are in them (don't be foolish enough to believe they don't put other kinds of **** in them besides nicotine) and as I recall, at least one research paper suggested the vapor from these things increased the dosage of nicotine (and whatever other chemicals are present) than just smoking the old fashioned cigarette so it increased the likelyhood of addiction and health problems.

There is a lot that has yet to be discovered on these things so assuming it's safe because the people selling them to you say so isn't reliable.

But surely they could do a study to determine what percentage of popular vapes are more dangerous than cigarettes.
 
It can take years for studies to play out and for effects to become known.
 
Vaping: e-cigarettes safer than smoking, says Public Health England

Government body says vaping can make ‘significant contribution to endgame of tobacco’ and raises concerns about length of licensing process

Kevin Fenton, director of health and wellbeing at Public Health England, explains why e-cigarettes are better for smokers than tobacco James Meikle
Wednesday 19 August 2015 01.57 EDT Last modified on Wednesday 19 August 2015 10.26 EDT

Vaping is safer than smoking and could lead to the demise of the traditional cigarette, Public Health England (PHE) has said in the first official recognition that e-cigarettes are less damaging to health than smoking tobacco.

The health body concluded that, on “the best estimate so far”, e-cigarettes are about 95% less harmful than tobacco cigarettes and could one day be dispensed as a licensed medicine in an alternative to anti-smoking products such as patches.

While stressing that e-cigarettes are not free from risk, PHE now believes that e-cigarettes “have the potential to make a significant contribution to the endgame for tobacco”.
The message was backed by the government’s chief medical officer, Dame Sally Davies, who nevertheless cautioned that “there continues to be a lack of evidence on the long-term use of e-cigarettes”. She said they should only be used as a means to help smokers quit.
“I want to see these products coming to the market as licensed medicines. This would provide assurance on the safety, quality and efficacy to consumers who want to use these products as quitting aids, especially in relation to the flavourings used, which is where we know least about any inhalation risks.”
The 111-page review raises concerns about the length and cost of the the government’s licensing process, which is a key part of the revised strategy to cut tobacco use.
No e-cigarettes have yet been licensed, unlike other nicotine-replacement therapies such as gums, lozenges and patches. Pilot schemes in Leicester and the City of London allow stop-smoking specialists to offer free e-cigarette starter kits, but smokers elsewhere cannot be offered e-cigarettes on prescription.
The Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency began its work in this area more than two years ago, and manufacturers have complained that it costs them millions to go through the process.
Jane Ellison, the public health minister in England, reminded smokers that the best thing they could do to avoid falling victim to the country’s number one killer was to quit completely.
“Although we recognize the e-cigarettes may help adults to quit, we still want to protect children from the dangers of nicotine, which is why we have made it illegal for under-18s to buy them,” she said.

The review found that almost all of the 2.6 million adults in the UK now thought to be using e-cigarettes are current or former conventional smokers, most using them to help them quit tobacco or to prevent them going back to smoking.
There was no suggestion that the products were a gateway into tobacco smoking, with less than 1% of adults or young people who had never smoked becoming regular cigarette users.
The PHE decision comes after carefully choreographed moves by anti-tobacco campaigners and public health specialists to help move the NHS towards offering better smoking cessation support and to be less negative about e-cigarettes.
Services are being urged to follow those in the north-east of England in offering behavioural support to those wanting to quit tobacco and using e-cigarettes to try to do so.
Smoking kills about 100,000 people a year in the UK, most of those in England where there are thought to be eight million tobacco users. But official figures suggest smoking is now at its lowest prevalence since records started in the 1940s.

Rates are highest in many of the most deprived areas of England, and getting smokers off tobacco is increasingly seen as one of the best ways of reducing health inequalities.
Worryingly for many of those behind the policy change, increasing numbers of people – up to 22%, compared with 8% two years ago – think e-cigarettes are equally or more harmful than tobacco. This is leading some smokers to avoid switching, studies have suggested.
Tobacco reduction campaigners say the public needs to be educated to recognise that although e-cigarettes, like tobacco cigarettes, contain addictive nicotine, they do not contain more dangerous chemicals such as tar and arsenic.
PHE is also advocating careful monitoring of the e-cigarette market, particularly of companies closely involved with or part of big tobacco companies. It says the government must meet its obligations “to protect public health policy from commercial and other vested interests of the tobacco industry”.
Kevin Fenton, director of health and wellbeing at PHE, said: “E-cigarettes are not completely risk-free but when compared to smoking, evidence shows they carry just a fraction of the harm.
Cara-Delevingne-010.jpg

Vaping is ever more popular, but is it a smoking cure or a new hazard?



Read more



“The problem is people increasingly think they are at least as harmful and this may be keeping millions of smokers from quitting. Local stop-smoking services should look to support e-cigarette users in their journey to quitting completely.”
Peter Hajek, of Queen Mary University, London, one of the independent authors of the review, said: “My reading of the evidence is that smokers who switch to vaping remove almost all the risks smoking poses to their health. Smokers differ in their needs and I would advise them not to give up on e-cigarettes if they do not like the first one they try. It may take some experimentation with different products and e-liquids to find the right one.”
Ecita, a trade association of e-cigarette manufacturers, said: “There could be huge long-term benefits to taxpayers and the NHS as well as to former smokers and their families. The proposed ban in public places across Wales is very worrying, as are many of the bans in pubs and restaurants across the UK. This appears to be driving a growing number of people to think the harm is the same, deterring smokers from moving to e-cigarettes, and damaging public health.”
The smokers group Forest questioned whether prescribing e-cigarettes on the NHS would be a justifiable use of taxpayers’ money. Simon Clark, its director, said promoting them “as a state-approved smoking cessation aid ignores the fact that many people enjoy vaping in its own right and use e-cigs as a recreational not a medicinal product.”
He said e-cigarettes had been successful because the consumer, not the state, was in charge. “If they want more smokers to switch to e-cigarettes, public health campaigners should embrace consumer choice and oppose unnecessary restrictions on the sale, marketing and promotion of this potentially game-changing product.”
The switch in policy towards e-cigarettes coincided with publication in the Journal of the American Medical Association of research from Los Angeles suggesting that high school students who had use e-cigarettes are more likely to go on to try tobacco.
But Hajek said this did not show that vaping leads to smoking. “It just shows that people who are attracted to e-cigarettes are the same people who are attracted to smoking. People who drink white wine are more likely to try red wine than people who do not drink alcohol.”
http://www.theguardian.com/society/...igarettes-safer-than-smoking?CMP=share_btn_tw

As someone who is a regular smoker of hookah, I don't understand the distaste for vaping; especially considering how much worse and scientifically proven how much cigarettes do harm.
 
And it directly contradicts what the World Health Organization said. As I pointed out before, you can cherry pick your results to get your desired conclusions.
 
And it directly contradicts what the World Health Organization said. As I pointed out before, you can cherry pick your results to get your desired conclusions.

The difference is the WHO doesn't cite any specific study that suggest e-cigg are more dangerous or equally dangerous as cigarettes.

Majik's post clear medical evidence that e-ciggs are far less toxic.
 
I'd rather believe a reliable source that's more current, than a reliable source from last year.
 
My brother used to smoke 2 packs a day, if having an E cig makes him smoke less then why should anyone care how it looks?
 
I'd rather believe a reliable source that's more current, than a reliable source from last year.
And what if something comes out later this year or next year that proves e-cigs are really worse? You'll just find an excuse to justify your belief e-cigs are safe then and ignore anyone who might have something damning to your case.
 
Maybe there's such a large push against vaping and I'm guessing here, is that there isn't a vaping conglomerate or lobbyist?
 
And what if something comes out later this year or next year that proves e-cigs are really worse? You'll just find an excuse to justify your belief e-cigs are safe then and ignore anyone who might have something damning to your case.
Depends on the reliability of the report.

And preferring to believe updated research is not an excuse. E-ciggs aren't said to be safe, they are being correctly classified as healthier than cigarettes.
 
Vaping, at least the kind people do to replace smoking cigarettes, is just so dumb to me. Like, I'm not attacking anybody that does it, do what you do. I just think it completely defeats the purpose of trying to quit smoking. I smoked over a pack of Marlboro Reds a day for over ten years and quit cold turkey in 2010. So, as somebody who has quit tobacco and all nicotine, I think it is just wrong for people to expect to be allowed to vape inside. You're still injesting the chemicals you did while smoking cigarettes and blowing it in people's faces. I hate being around either vaping or cigarettes. I'll tolerate it if I have to but I just do not like being around either. I don't want to have to breathe that stuff after I went through hell to quit injesting those chemicals.
 
Vaping, at least the kind people do to replace smoking cigarettes, is just so dumb to me. Like, I'm not attacking anybody that does it, do what you do. I just think it completely defeats the purpose of trying to quit smoking. I smoked over a pack of Marlboro Reds a day for over ten years and quit cold turkey in 2010. So, as somebody who has quit tobacco and all nicotine, I think it is just wrong for people to expect to be allowed to vape inside. You're still injesting the chemicals you did while smoking cigarettes and blowing it in people's faces. I hate being around either vaping or cigarettes. I'll tolerate it if I have to but I just do not like being around either. I don't want to have to breathe that stuff after I went through hell to quit injesting those chemicals.

It's like drinking Diet Coke. You're still drinking acid, just with some different ingredients.
 
It's like drinking Diet Coke. You're still drinking acid, just with some different ingredients.

Yea, basically. I mean, it hasn't existed as long as smoking has so we don't know what different kind of long term effects will happen from vaping but, make no mistake, breathing that crap in, is effecting your lungs and cardiovascular sustenance very negatively. It probably does other stuff that cigarettes don't even do to you, we just don't know about it yet cuz nobody has vapid for decades and decades.
 
http://www.iflscience.com/health-an...-regular-smoking-according-independent-report

I don't care much for cigarettes, but this is interesting.

IFL Science said:
new report published in the U.K. has concluded that e-cigarettes are nowhere near as harmful as smoking. Carried out by Public Health England (PHE), the report found that e-cigarettes are “around 95% less harmful” than smoking tobacco, and that the National Health Service should consider recommending them to help people quit smoking all together. They have also concluded that there is “no evidence” that they offer young people a gateway into smoking.


The review suggests that e-cigarettes may be contributing to falling smoking rates in the U.K., as 2.6 million adults are now thought to be using the product. They also found that almost all of these adults are ex-smokers, providing evidence that many people are not starting to use the devices after having never smoked in the first place, and instead are using them to either quit or cut down on tobacco.


“E-cigarettes are not completely risk free but when compared to smoking, evidence shows they carry just a fraction of the harm,” explained Professor Kevin Fenton, Director of Health and Wellbeing at PHE. “The problem is people increasingly think they are at least as harmful and this may be keeping millions of smokers from quitting. Local stop smoking services should look to support e-cigarette users in their journey to quitting completely.”


Despite the high quit rates among those who start smoking e-cigarettes, interestingly the number of people who think they are more harmful than traditional smoking is also on the rise. The report details how this number has increased from 8.1% in 2013 to 22.1% in 2015. This goes against all the current scientific evidence that shows the opposite.


The report also goes some way to dismiss the fears that e-cigarettes act as a route into smoking for young people and non-smokers. This reasoning is partly behind the Welsh government's recent move to ban e-cigarettes from all places in which smoking tobacco is also banned, arguing that they normalize the habit, and could encourage young people to take it up.


“Fears that e-cigarettes have made smoking seem normal again or even led to people taking up tobacco smoking are not so far being realised based on the evidence assessed by this important independent review,” said Professor Linda Bauld from Cancer Research UK. “In fact, the overall evidence points to e-cigarettes actually helping people to give up smoking tobacco.”


It’s estimated that currently 80,000 people in England die each year as a result of smoking, but if everybody who does smoke were to switch to e-cigarettes, then this figure is predicted to drop to just 4,000. The evidence, according to the report, is clear: Smoking e-cigarettes is much less harmful than smoking tobacco cigarettes. And if used in conjunction with stop smoking support services, they offer a much better chance at quitting altogether.
 
Vaping, at least the kind people do to replace smoking cigarettes, is just so dumb to me. Like, I'm not attacking anybody that does it, do what you do. I just think it completely defeats the purpose of trying to quit smoking. I smoked over a pack of Marlboro Reds a day for over ten years and quit cold turkey in 2010. So, as somebody who has quit tobacco and all nicotine, I think it is just wrong for people to expect to be allowed to vape inside. You're still injesting the chemicals you did while smoking cigarettes and blowing it in people's faces. I hate being around either vaping or cigarettes. I'll tolerate it if I have to but I just do not like being around either. I don't want to have to breathe that stuff after I went through hell to quit injesting those chemicals.

People who have emphysema have gotten somewhat better after switching to e-ciggs.

It's not just slightly healthier, they're much healthier.
 
Chemical flavorings found in e-cigarettes linked to lung disease

And bam! That claim of "healthier" just went up in smoke.

Diacetyl, a flavoring chemical linked to cases of severe respiratory disease, was found in more than 75 percent of flavored electronic cigarettes and refill liquids tested by researchers at Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health.

Two other related, potentially harmful compounds were also found in many of the tested flavors, which included varieties with potential appeal to young people such as cotton candy, “Fruit Squirts,” and cupcake.

The study was published online today in Environmental Health Perspectives.

The Occupational Safety and Health Administration and the flavoring industry have warned workers about diacetyl because of the association between inhaling the chemical and the debilitating respiratory disease bronchiolitis obliterans, colloquially known as “popcorn lung” because it first appeared in workers who inhaled artificial butter flavor in microwave popcorn processing facilities.

“Recognition of the hazards associated with inhaling flavoring chemicals started with ‘popcorn lung’ over a decade ago. However, diacetyl and other related flavoring chemicals are used in many other flavors beyond butter-flavored popcorn, including fruit flavors, alcohol flavors, and, we learned in our study, candy-flavored e-cigarettes,” said lead author Joseph Allen, assistant professor of exposure assessment sciences.

There are currently more than 7,000 varieties of flavored e-cigarettes and e-juice (nicotine-containing liquid that is used in refillable devices) on the market. Although the popularity and use of e-cigarettes continues to increase, there is a lack of data on their potential health effects. E-cigarettes are not currently regulated, although the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has issued a proposed rule to include e-cigarettes under its authority to regulate certain tobacco and nicotine-containing products.

Allen and colleagues tested 51 types of flavored e-cigarettes and liquids sold by leading brands for the presence of diacetyl, acetoin, and 2,3-pentanedione, two related flavoring compounds that the Flavor and Extract Manufacturers Association lists as “high priority,” i.e., they may pose a respiratory hazard in the workplace. Each e-cigarette was inserted into a sealed chamber attached to a lab-built device that drew air through the e-cigarette for eight seconds at a time with a resting period of 15 or 30 second between each draw. The air stream was then analyzed.

At least one of the three chemicals was detected in 47 of the 51 flavors tested. Diacetyl was detected above the laboratory limit of detection in 39 of the flavors tested. Acetoin and 2,3-pentanedione were detected in 46 and 23 and of the flavors, respectively.

“Since most of the health concerns about e-cigarettes have focused on nicotine, there is still much we do not know about e-cigarettes. In addition to containing varying levels of the addictive substance nicotine, they also contain other cancer-causing chemicals, such as formaldehyde, and as our study shows, flavoring chemicals that can cause lung damage,” said study co-author David Christiani, Elkan Blout Professor of Environmental Genetics.

Other Harvard Chan School authors included Skye Flanigan, Mallory LeBlanc, Jose Vallarino, Piers MacNaughton, and James Stewart.

This study was supported by an NIH/NIEHS Center grant.
Harvard
 
But Black Dynamite, my cigarettes give millions of people lung cancer.
 
BS. None of my e-liquid has formaldehyde in it. And nicotine is no more dangerous than caffeine which is also highly addictive but no one's trying to take soft drinks off store shelves.

And it's not even up for debate. E-cigs by their very nature are far more healthy than inhaling burning chemicals and smoke.

And the vapor doesn't latch onto clothing which means it has a reduced chance of effecting other people. And vapor dissipates more easily and quickly than cigarette smoke.

I have asthma and I smoked for five years and quit then I started vaping and after 2 years of vaping the difference in how I feel is night and day and my last physical the doctor said my lungs sounded great. And I haven't had an asthma attack or any upper respiratory infections since I switched from tobacco cigarettes to e-cigs.

Nicotine use isn't going away. Just isn't going to happen. And smoking in some form is not going away anytime soon. Traditional tobacco cigarettes cause far more problems and significantly more lung damage. Does vaping effect the lungs? I'm sure. As much as cigarette smoke? Not even close.

So we can either have a healthier alternative to smoking or we can smother it in the crib, drive small businesses out of business, and drive people back to smoking traditional tobacco cigarettes, and paying big tobacco billions every year cause that makes all sorts of

The more we learn about cancer the more we realize that it's a matter of genetics and time. I'm not going to quit something just because some college student tells me it might give me cancer. News flash. Life itself apparently causes cancer. Risk of cancer wasn't even why I quit smoking. I quit smoking because it was exacerbating my asthma and I was continually getting lung infections. Two things that e-cigs aren't causing for me.

Besides, I breathe saw dust and gravel dust in at work, and I work outside 10 hours a day year round with no sunscreen. Do you really think Im afraid of a little vapor? If it's going to give me cancer it's going to have to get in line because a number of other things are likely to give me cancer before a little vapor.
 
Last edited:
^^^ :applaud


My wife also says she feels alot better when she replaces ciggs with vaping for long periods.

Probably not a coincidence.
 
Marvolo: Smarter than the scientists at Harvard.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"