Justice League Zack Snyder Directing Justice League - Part 6

[Micromind]

Doesn't BVS have a positive audience score on RT? And a positive Cinemascore? It's even dumber than appealing to the majority opinion as if it's objectively right. It's appealing to the opinion of 300 or so critics who happen to be certified to share their review on a specific website.

Batman V Superman was so bad that it sold more Blu-rays/ DVDs than Civil War, GotG2, Doctor Strange and X-men Apoclaypse !

If people 'hated' it then, why did they spend money again ? (after getting badly burned by watching the movie in theaters)

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (2016) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $77,177,492

Captain America: Civil War (2016) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $76,018,507

Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 (2017) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $65,630,307

Doctor Strange (2016) - Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $44,941,563

X-Men: Apocalypse (2016)-Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $32,663,890

I wonder why a 'Objectively Bad movie' sold as many DVD's.

 

[markjoedelonge]

BVS BR sales aren't a good indicator of whether people liked the movie so much that they wanted a copy of it though. Most probably bought it to watch the real version of the movie, with half an hour added back in. The reviews for the BVS UE were also significantly less harsh then the reviews for the TC.

 

[Micromind]

BVS BR sales aren't a good indicator of whether people liked the movie so much that they wanted a copy of it though. Most probably bought it to watch the real version of the movie, with half an hour added back in. The reviews for the BVS UE were also significantly less harsh then the reviews for the TC.

True, but I wouldn't be buying a copy of the movie I hated.

There are a few posters here on SHH who hated BvS (I wouldn't name them), wonder if they bought the Blu-Ray too.

 

[idiot09]

I like Spider-Man 3 too.

And yeah, it just speaks to how influential and profound the effect this film had that it trended 2 years after its release, just because the fans celebrated its anniversary.

 

[kguillou]

True, but I wouldn't be buying a copy of the movie I hated.

There are a few posters here on SHH who hated BvS (I wouldn't name them), wonder if they bought the Blu-Ray too.

I think a lot of fans, myself included, were shell shocked by what they saw in theaters that there was a desperate need to see the movie again and see the version that is supposedly the true movie in hopes of having a different experience than what they had in theater. It was the first ever Batman/Superman movie after all. And, hey, it half worked. I was let down by the theater version of BvS and the UE completely turned my opinion around. A lot of other fans, bloggers, and critics turned their opinion around too. The other half, it made no difference, it was just a longer version of a movie that they did not enjoy any aspect of.

 

[random_havoc]

I like Spider-Man 3.

Ahh... I'm glad you're able to enjoy those movies

 

[Spider-Fan]

I like Spider-Man 3.

Same

 

[Limonade]

Batman V Superman was so bad that it sold more Blu-rays/ DVDs than Civil War, GotG2, Doctor Strange and X-men Apoclaypse !

If people 'hated' it then, why did they spend money again ? (after getting badly burned by watching the movie in theaters)

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (2016) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $77,177,492

Captain America: Civil War (2016) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $76,018,507

Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 (2017) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $65,630,307

Doctor Strange (2016) - Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $44,941,563

X-Men: Apocalypse (2016)-Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $32,663,890

I wonder why a 'Objectively Bad movie' sold as many DVD's.

Uh... I think the Extended Cut had something to do with that and the buzz around it... that was the gimmick.

I highly doubt the Theatrical cut was ever going to make the same amount.

 

[random_havoc]

Batman V Superman was so bad that it sold more Blu-rays/ DVDs than Civil War, GotG2, Doctor Strange and X-men Apoclaypse !

If people 'hated' it then, why did they spend money again ? (after getting badly burned by watching the movie in theaters)

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (2016) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $77,177,492

Captain America: Civil War (2016) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $76,018,507

Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 (2017) -Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $65,630,307

Doctor Strange (2016) - Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $44,941,563

X-Men: Apocalypse (2016)-Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $32,663,890

I wonder why a 'Objectively Bad movie' sold as many DVD's.

The Transformers movies make billions, and Spider-Man 3 made a ton of money. Sales does not equal good quality.
That said it's obvious that Snyder has managed to get some rabidly loyal fans, many of which like to sit in this thread.

 

[random_havoc]

Uh... I think the Extended Cut had something to do with that and the buzz around it... that was the gimmick.

I highly doubt the Theatrical cut was ever going to make the same amount.

Also a good point

 

[random_havoc]

You sarcastically say this as if it somehow supports your argument.

I've asked you before to back up your claim that a movie can be objectively good or bad, but you haven't.

Passing off personal or popular opinion as objective is a fallacy.

I'm not saying that there is a hard line between good and bad movies. However I am saying that claiming there's nothing objective about good story telling, good writing of characters etc, IS completely wrong. And this movie has some very obvious markings of very bad story telling. So, again, feel free to like a movie that is in some ways objectively bad, glad that you can, but I'm not able to.

 

[Reel-Man]

The Transformers movies make billions, and Spider-Man 3 made a ton of money. Sales does not equal good quality.
That said it's obvious that Snyder has managed to get some rabidly loyal fans, many of which like to sit in this thread.

This sounds exactly like his haters i'd say.

 

[misslane38]

I'm not saying that there is a hard line between good and bad movies. However I am saying that claiming there's nothing objective about good story telling, good writing of characters etc, IS completely wrong. And this movie has some very obvious markings of very bad story telling. So, again, feel free to like a movie that is in some ways objectively bad, glad that you can, but I'm not able to.

In my experience, often when people elaborate on how it's objectively bad according to storytelling standards, their understanding of good storytelling and their explanations, reasoning, or analysis are flawed. Moreover, when one applies similar scrutiny to other "approved" works, it's often obvious double standards are being applied.

 

[Micromind]

Uh... I think the Extended Cut had something to do with that and the buzz around it... that was the gimmick.

I highly doubt the Theatrical cut was ever going to make the same amount.

Gimmicks don't work if the product is bad.

The Transformers movies make billions, and Spider-Man 3 made a ton of money. Sales does not equal good quality.
That said it's obvious that Snyder has managed to get some rabidly loyal fans, many of which like to sit in this thread.

Moving the goal posts, I see. I was talking about how general audience were buying DVD's /Blurays , they wouldn't if the movie is bad.

Looking at sales figures of Transformers: The Last Knight (2017) answers your question.

Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $33,714,898

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Transformers-The-Last-Knight#tab=summary

 

[Limonade]

Gimmicks don't work if the product is bad.

I never said gimmicks work or doesn't... I said it was simply a gimmick. No negativity or positive vibes inferred.

If the narrative is that the Theatrical was bad but the Extended Cut was better... then you see my point, in regard to sales.

In this very Hype... you have people who praise the UC for the additions to the movie that made it less crap than when sitting in the theater.

Theatrical Cut wasn't received well and didn't have any legs after. And in order to sell more BD/DVD they released an Ultimate Edition that padded out the plot better. Therefore, I can see the interest in spending more money to see a slightly better quality of film in Blu-Ray Special Edition. It's also more expensive than the theatrical cut of the film in Blu-Ray--to boot.

 

[The Guard]

I seem to recall the theatrical cut selling pretty well on home release.

 

[GothamBat]

edit

 

[heatvision38]

I'm not saying that there is a hard line between good and bad movies. However I am saying that claiming there's nothing objective about good story telling, good writing of characters etc, IS completely wrong. And this movie has some very obvious markings of very bad story telling. So, again, feel free to like a movie that is in some ways objectively bad, glad that you can, but I'm not able to.

Let's just say for a moment that there is objectively good storytelling, that its quality can be broken down to objectively good or bad, that's still not saying a movie can be objectively good or bad. You so far are essentially repeating the same conclusion without supporting it. That's what I am asking for here. If you are going to keep saying, for example, that BvS is a bad movie that people are entitled to like, but objectively bad nonetheless, then you are making a claim, and when making a claim, you have to support it. You haven't done that.

 

[Limonade]

I seem to recall the theatrical cut selling pretty well on home release.

The clear favorite is the Blu-Ray version. The standalone DVD Theatrical cut made up the rest of the sales, I'm assuming.

The extended cut is available only on the “Ultimate Edition” Blu-ray copies of the movie, not the standalone DVD version, and the first week of release for “Batman v Superman” saw 70% of its copies sold coming from the Blu-ray format — one of the highest first-week Blu-ray percentages ever for a major theatrical release new to disc

Assuming we go with this source:
http://variety.com/2016/digital/news/batman-v-superman-shoots-to-top-of-disc-charts-1201825810/

I know this because there was a thread in Reddit talking about Warner bros "cheating" their fans.

 

[kguillou]

You have to admit, its kind of fascinating in a way how Snyder's comic book movies have sort of driven a line in the sand between the fanbase. I've never seen any other comic book related movie be simulteaneously claimed as one of the best of the genre by one side and deemed one of the absolute worst by the other side. I think, traditionally, we fans have GENERALLY fallen on the same side of the coin with these movies. When theyre good, we agree theyre good, when theyre bad we agree theyre bad and even those oddities in the middle, movies like Spiderman 3 which have a lot of technical merit to them, we generally agreed that they were dissapointing. I dont think anyone claims SM3 to be one of the best cbms ever made even if you enjoyed the movie.

But I feel like MoS and especially BvS scratched an itch that a significant sect of the comic book movie fanbase has had for a long time. Even if you hate his movies you gotta admit there is something there that people seem to be really latching onto and praise. Even if you go on Amazon or something and look up customer reviews for BvS from regular people, you see different variations of "best cbm ever!" and "worst piece of s*** ever!" It really is fascinating. What other movie has brought out these kind of hot and cold responses?

 

[Da-Scribe]

Sometimes I think if Zack made the exact same movies, but with original characters that they'd get better reviews. Once you start throwing out all the Kents and the Waynes then the game changes.

 

[chintai80]

You have to admit, its kind of fascinating in a way how Snyder's comic book movies have sort of driven a line in the sand between the fanbase. I've never seen any other comic book related movie be simulteaneously claimed as one of the best of the genre by one side and deemed one of the absolute worst by the other side. I think, traditionally, we fans have GENERALLY fallen on the same side of the coin with these movies. When theyre good, we agree theyre good, when theyre bad we agree theyre bad and even those oddities in the middle, movies like Spiderman 3 which have a lot of technical merit to them, we generally agreed that they were dissapointing. I dont think anyone claims SM3 to be one of the best cbms ever made even if you enjoyed the movie.

But I feel like MoS and especially BvS scratched an itch that a significant sect of the comic book movie fanbase has had for a long time. Even if you hate his movies you gotta admit there is something there that people seem to be really latching onto and praise. Even if you go on Amazon or something and look up customer reviews for BvS from regular people, you see different variations of "best cbm ever!" and "worst piece of s*** ever!" It really is fascinating. What other movie has brought out these kind of hot and cold responses?

it's like the last jedi.
i love how it pisses off half of the fan-base.

i'm like michael jackson in the theater eating my popcorn in the thriller video when reading people go back and forth at each others throats in the message boards.

 

[chintai80]

Sometimes I think if Zack made the exact same movies, but with original characters that they'd get better reviews. Once you start throwing out all the Kents and the Waynes then the game changes.

this too.

once u start making a movie about established characters with long histories like superman and batman, people are more rigid in their beliefs on what this or that character is suppose to be like.

 

[Joeyjojo72]

Sometimes I think if Zack made the exact same movies, but with original characters that they'd get better reviews. Once you start throwing out all the Kents and the Waynes then the game changes.

I guess we'll find out.

 

[random_havoc]

Gimmicks don't work if the product is bad.

Are you kidding? That's why the saying "It's just a gimmick" is a thing, specifically because they can often make money despite not having quality

Moving the goal posts, I see. I was talking about how general audience were buying DVD's /Blurays , they wouldn't if the movie is bad.

Looking at sales figures of Transformers: The Last Knight (2017) answers your question.

Total Est. Domestic Video Sales $33,714,898

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Transformers-The-Last-Knight#tab=summary

Ok, right on these boards there's a guy who posted that he didn't think The Last Jedi was that good but he watched it in the theatres 3 or 4 times because "it's Star Wars", but you're telling me that you don't think a significant portion of the people buying the DVD were fellow nerds buying it for the extended edition gimmick?
And what moving the goal posts? You brought up a point, I responded to it.