2011/2012 NBA Thread: Where Weather Happens

[Doc Samson]

I like KG too, but there is no way that I can ever root for Celtics to win another ring, even for KG.

Lol, I agree, I just really liked KG before he got there. I know it's sacrilegious for us, but I was kind of pulling for the guy.

The public perception will be harsh against them no matter if they win or lose or if they are underdogs or not.

Still, I know I've said it before, but can the Heat fans in the better seats actually stand up and cheer every once and a while.

I don't think so, most, if not all, of the harshness is directed at Lebron anyway. And for most people, it's because he's routinely shrunk in the clutch, when the best player is supposed to rise up. If they lose, but Lebron still goes off and does his thing, it won't be near the same type of reaction as it was last year.

 

[Darthphere]

Whoa!!!

I know right!

 

[runawayboulder]

I don't think it's that shocking. You don't know how the rest of his career may play out.

He could end up on a team in the later stages of his career as a role player for a championship contender. Mourning and Payton did.

 

[Doc Samson]

The decision was nothing but publicity stunt for ratings, that Lebron was most likely pressured into. All this bs about I hate Lebron is just what it is hating. Personally I never found him arrogant nor self centered. He pretty well tempered guy with class. I mean how many confrontations has he been in, hell he damn sure hasn't gotten into a physical altercation yet that I know of. Everytime he gets foul hard he doesn't run into the defender face like most players do. He walks it off. I don't know, I just think people should get off his nutz for doing something no different the the big three at Boston, only difference is that there wasn't no publicity stunt.

While I do agree with some of what you said, there are some differences. The Boston 3 was put together by management, not the players.

Also, none of the Boston 3 were in prime, they all tried to get it done on their respective teams way longer than Lebron did.

And lastly, not one of those 3 were considered the best in the league, on a team with the best record 2 years in a row, and back to back MVP winners.

Even further than that, 2 of those 3 were never considered Top 5. IMO, Garnett was the 2nd best player throughout the 2000's but the media certainly never gave him that respect, let alone fans. By the time he made it to Boston, he was well past that level of play anyway. It's pretty unheard of for someone of Lebron's stature to willingly go to another Top 5 player's team while they're both close to, or still in, prime.

This is why people were upset, they just don't come out and say that. It wasn't the Decision show, it's the fact that it was a decision at all. Fans thought Lebron was more competitive than that. Turns out, IMO, that this Heat team isn't really that much better than what he had...

 

[runawayboulder]

It's kinda funny that the day after the Celtics lose, Celtic Pride was playing on one of the movie channels. t:

 

[Darthphere]

It's crazy how similar this Thunder team is matchup wise to the Mavs from last year. Heat seem to have all the same problems.

 

[kaypain]

I don't remember Bosh ever being considered the best in the league.

 

[Scrandy Randy]

But even if LeBron just got caught up in the moment it still stands to my point, he brings this **** on himself. Do you think that Steve Nash or KG would ever say something so abundantly dumb. That said, dumb, cocky players seem to be the new trademark of the league so what can you do? LeBron just happens to be the face of the new generation of dumb asswipes, so it is worse for him. But in fairness, his stupidity seems to be worse than say....Rose or Howard. So it is what it is. I'm not going to pity LeBron for his stupidity being held against him.

Anyway, answer your PMs Phere!

LeBron really isn't that cocky. I actually prefer him to players like Rose and Durant who always play politics when talking to the media and always say the "politically" right thing. Never being real, never taking shots when it's necessary, never bad mouthing the other team, etc. It's fake.

 

[Erzengel]

I don't think so, most, if not all, of the harshness is directed at Lebron anyway. And for most people, it's because he's routinely shrunk in the clutch, when the best player is supposed to rise up. If they lose, but Lebron still goes off and does his thing, it won't be near the same type of reaction as it was last year.

It'll still be the perception, fair or not, it'll be another year that Lebron has failed to win a championship.

And like I said, if he does win, it'll be Lebron couldn't do it by himself. He's no insert other NBA player.

Lebron and the Heat are in a no "win" situation. Winning isn't going to sway the general public into liking him outside of Miami.

If I was him, I wouldn't care but it's pretty apparent that he and Wade do seem to want to be liked. But there's nothing they can do, so might as well try and win and embrace it. At least Miami would be happy for them.

 

[NewYorkSpider]

Would like to see the Thunder win it all, but I think Miami has this in 6 games.

 

[Doc Samson]

I don't remember Bosh ever being considered the best in the league.

Obviously I was talking about Lebron, which is why I said the two mvps in a row, best record two years in a row. Point being, none of the Bos 3 were ever considered the best in the league, and certainly 2 of them were never considered Top 5.

It'll still be the perception, fair or not, it'll be another year that Lebron has failed to win a championship.

And like I said, if he does win, it'll be Lebron couldn't do it by himself. He's no insert other NBA player.

Lebron and the Heat are in a no "win" situation. Winning isn't going to sway the general public into liking him outside of Miami.

If I was him, I wouldn't care but it's pretty apparent that he and Wade do seem to want to be liked. But there's nothing they can do, so might as well try and win and embrace it. At least Miami would be happy for them.

The thing about Lebron is there's a groundswell, which I don't understand, of people criticizing those who criticize him. Heat fans & some in the media act like it's brand new, but Kobe went through the same type of things. He still does, and he's got 5 RINGS! It's being a superstar in the post-Jordan NBA where people have this crazy revisionist history about MJ.

I think there's a very large segment of people ready to love Lebron again, if they haven't already, especially if he wins. Honestly, Skip Bayless is the only person in the media still railing hard against him.

 

[Erzengel]

Well a lot of people dislike Kobe because of the rape charges and because of the 5 rings.

Outside of the typical divisional rival hate, a player or team can be hated because of a polarizing player (Alex Rodriguez, Michael Vick, Terrell Owens) or if a team wins too much (Yankees, Lakers, Patriots).

So I'd be surprised if winning the Finals would turn the general fan around about Lebron and the Heat. In fact, I think it would give them more reason to hate them.

3 years ago, Dwayne Wade was a pretty popular player even outside of Miami and now him and Lebron are making comments on how everyone on team is "good guys" and insinuating that they aren't villains.

And I understand that NY could be different, but I went to a Knicks vs. Heat game last year. Every time Lebron had the ball, he was booed. Every single possession.

If he can sway opinions with a win, more power to him but I don't think it'll help regardless.

 

[Doc Samson]

Plenty of people hated Kobe before any rings or rape charge, simply because they thought he was fake, which IMO, he was when he first came into the league.

Once the Shaq nonsense started, and especially after the "rape", Kobe stopped trying to please everyone with the fake facade and started being himself, an a-hole! And more people started liking him afterwards.

He's still hated and criticized way more than someone with 5 rings should be, but the point is, once Lebron decides to stop caring so much about what people think, he'll be better off for it. I remember A.I. on Stephen A Smith's old show, and he was saying how quickly fans/media turned on him, and Kobe, and he warned Lebron it would happen to him too. It's the post-Jordan world, he needs to just deal with it.

 

[Erzengel]

I think there's a very large segment of people ready to love Lebron again, if they haven't already, especially if he wins. Honestly, Skip Bayless is the only person in the media still railing hard against him.

He's still hated and criticized way more than someone with 5 rings should be, but the point is, once Lebron decides to stop caring so much about what people think, he'll be better off for it. I remember A.I. on Stephen A Smith's old show, and he was saying how quickly fans/media turned on him, and Kobe, and he warned Lebron it would happen to him too. It's the post-Jordan world, he needs to just deal with it.

Which is it are people going to start loving Lebron or is Lebron going to stop caring? My point is, Lebron cares too much. He doesn't come off as a Reggie Miller or a Kobe Bryant, he wants to be liked.

Once the Shaq nonsense started, and especially after the "rape", Kobe stopped trying to please everyone with the fake facade and started being himself, an a-hole! And more people started liking him afterwards.

I think in general only Laker fans like him.

I'm not saying people don't recognize his abilities and what he's accomplished, just for the most part, it's not surprising that he and Lebron show up on Top 10 most hated athletes.

 

[Doc Samson]

Which is it are people going to start loving Lebron or is Lebron going to stop caring? My point is, Lebron cares too much. He doesn't come off as a Reggie Miller or a Kobe Bryant, he wants to be liked.

I'm saying it's one in the same. Once Lebron stops caring about the media, fans, and yes, even his teammates sometimes (which he seems to be doing, I've seen him yell at Chalmers more this postseason than both regular seasons combined) then I think people will like him more. He'll never be loved universally, but it'll be better than what he's going through now, no doubt.

In this post-Jordan climate, any athlete deemed anywhere close to MJ will be ripped to shreds and picked to pieces to find all the faults that keep him from meeting the "Jordan Ideal" that Jordan himself didn't even meet. I guarantee you, if Durant wins this year, and gets an MVP or two soon, he'll start getting the same treatment. People will tear down all the things he doesn't do in order to degrade the stuff he excels at. Lebron let that nonsense affect him, which is why I think he's been inconsistent in the clutch. He's worried about having to go to the line, and possibly missing, thus being the "bad guy" and the one who blew the game.

So he'd rather launch a fall away 3 pointer or pass it to someone else. Once he truly doesn't care about failing (and he's already failed, so why care?) he'll succeed. And that goes for anyone in life period. People are afraid to be laughed at or seen as failures if they try to do something outside of their comfort zones, so they stay in horrible jobs and marriages they don't care about, in order to keep up the status quo.

 

[Erzengel]

I'm saying it's one in the same. Once Lebron stops caring about the media, fans, and yes, even his teammates sometimes (which he seems to be doing, I've seen him yell at Chalmers more this postseason than both regular seasons combined) then I think people will like him more. He'll never be loved universally, but it'll be better than what he's going through now, no doubt.

As of now, from what people have said about him (media and people allegedly close to him), he wants to be liked. Until he proves otherwise......

 

[WalkingDeadMike]

I'm not gonna lie, I have nothing against Lebron, I actually defend him at times and bash him at others when it's appropriate. But I'm pulling for the C's for one reason only, KG.

I used to get into arguments, and still do on occasion, because I thought KG was the 2nd best player overall throughout the 2000's. I thought he was better than Duncan but saddled with a much worse team, and I think he's better than Duncan right now, easily.

I remember an interview he did, I think, with John Thompson. And he started crying because he couldn't figure out how to get Minnesota to win. Just true, honest passion, man. He's the last of a dying breed, those players who brought it every night and left it all out on the court, just trying to win. Of course he finally got that ring, but I'd like to see him get one more crack at it before being broken up.

**** KG. He's the dirtiest mother ****er in the league, and has been for a while. Real talk.

I can't agree with him being the 2nd best player of the 2000s, or having a better career than Duncan. But I will give you that he deserved the MVP over Duncan in '02-'03.

 

[Doc Samson]

As of now, from what people have said about him (media and people allegedly close to him), he wants to be liked. Until he proves otherwise......

He needs to reconcile that real quick, I don't know if he's getting past OKC playing nice.

**** KG. He's the dirtiest mother ****er in the league, and has been for a while. Real talk.

Maybe, but I respect that heart of his. He was the man during the 2000s and never really got the attention I think he deserved. Have you ever seen that John Thompson interview he did years ago, when he was still in Minnesota? Even after he went to Boston and started the tough guy stuff, I couldn't shake that image. Dude just wants to win, I love that!!

 

[JaD]

Maybe, but I respect that heart of his. He was the man during the 2000s and never really got the attention I think he deserved. Have you ever seen that John Thompson interview he did years ago, when he was still in Minnesota? Even after he went to Boston and started the tough guy stuff, I couldn't shake that image. Dude just wants to win, I love that!!

I just watched that interview and wow. My respect for him went up a bit. Just like a lot of players have described though, I would hate having to play against him but I would love to have him on my team. I remember a game where he was getting in his teammates ear about something and TNT was showing the replay of it. He looked like the scariest dude on the planet. He's still a pretty dirty mother****er.

 

[Doc Samson]

I can't agree with him being the 2nd best player of the 2000s, or having a better career than Duncan. But I will give you that he deserved the MVP over Duncan in '02-'03.

Your entitled to that, but I think he was better all around then almost everybody, and certainly Tim Duncan. His game was more versatile, and head to head, Tim couldn't do anything with him. It's similar to how people say CP3 is the best PG but Deron Williams eats him up almost every time they go head to head.

Back then KG would handle the ball like a guard and pull up for 3's like nothing. Defensively he was quicker, able to cover more ground outside the paint, and ran the floor better too. Just all around he was better IMO, and still is today. He just had a garbage team the whole time. But that passion man, that will to win, was unmistakable.

We like to think all athletes have that, but 99% of them don't, they're just physically gifted. When I see it in someone for real though, I can't help but respect it. KG, Kobe, A.I., those guys had that desire man, I loved watching them (and still do obviously in KG & the Mamba's case)

I just watched that interview and wow. My respect for him went up a bit. Just like a lot of players have described though, I would hate having to play against him but I would love to have him on my team. I remember a game where he was getting in his teammates ear about something and TNT was showing the replay of it. He looked like the scariest dude on the planet. He's still a pretty dirty mother****er.

There's certain images for players I like or respect that plays in my head whenever I see them, and for KG it's always been that interview. He definitely got dirty when he went to Boston, I guess he felt that was the edge and identity he needed to energize that team. But it's still the same heart beneath all of that. Just wanting to win, at any cost...

 

[TMC1982]

It has officially been ten years (well, at least for those on East Coast as I'm typing this) since the NBA on NBC signed off for the last time:
[YT]qLb-Dt-jreI[/YT]

The ABCs of ruining the NBA, Part 1.

The ABCs of ruining the NBA, Part II

 

[L.A.]

I have the NBA on NBC theme on my ringtone

 

[Poeman]

haha man I swear. I absolutely miss those days

 

[JaD]

I'm whistling it right now at work after reading that, haha.

 

[Dr. Evil]

I have the NBA on NBC theme on my ringtone

[YT]fZKX-cf_p90[/YT]