Agatha Agatha All Along on Disney+

[Weather Witch]

You are comparing this to Disney+ shows which isn't exactly a high bar to surpass.

Which is what absolutely anyone would compare it with.

can you link me to an article that proves Agatha All Along is one of the most popular shows of this year across all platforms?

Not how this works. Not what I claimed. No data available for the entirety of 2024 any time soon. Nielsen barely knows what happened outside of the Top 10 in early November.

Agatha All Along is no Stranger Things or The Boys cultural phenomenon. Those shows are what would I call a real hit in the streaming era - not Agatha All Along.

Two shows which are currently in their fourth season with more than twice and almost seven times the budget of Agatha All Along. I'll be generous and say you'd want to compare it to the start of their respective first seasons though.

Let's run the numbers:

• The Boys averaged 4.1 million viewers per episode over the first 10 days of its season 1 release.
• Stranger Things 1 took 35 days to reach 14.07 million viewers.
• Agatha All Along reached more than 9.8 million viewers during its premiere week.

Three different metrics, so hard to compare directly, but that seems to suggest Agatha All Along had a better start than either of these. Now, if you did want to compare the first season of Agatha All Along to the fourth season of these shows, I can't help you.

 

[blueharvest]

 

[psylockolussus]

I'm not surprised. They really should have done 1 mcu show per year. There's just simply no excitement/hype when they release so much in a short period of time. Now time will tell if numbers for Daredevil/Ironheart improve from here.

And also, @blueharvest - we can no longer post links from Twitter/X,only screenshots.

 

[blueharvest]

I'm not surprised.

And also, @blueharvest - we can no longer post links from Twitter/X,only screenshots.

I know. It takes effect on the 31st, I think.

 

[psylockolussus]

Which is what absolutely anyone would compare it with.


Not how this works. Not what I claimed. No data available for the entirety of 2024 any time soon. Nielsen barely knows what happened outside of the Top 10 in early November.


Two shows which are currently in their fourth season with more than twice and almost seven times the budget of Agatha All Along. I'll be generous and say you'd want to compare it to the start of their respective first seasons though.

Let's run the numbers:

• The Boys averaged 4.1 million viewers per episode over the first 10 days of its season 1 release.
• Stranger Things 1 took 35 days to reach 14.07 million viewers.
• Agatha All Along reached more than 9.8 million viewers during its premiere week.

Three different metrics, so hard to compare directly, but that seems to suggest Agatha All Along had a better start than either of these. Now, if you did want to compare the first season of Agatha All Along to the fourth season of these shows, I can't help you.

Getting back on this. Marvel shows aren't the only shows they should be comparing the numbers to, but the original shows of Disney+'s competition. Especially if Disney+ wants to be in the streaming services business for a long time.

Also, if believe the recent tweet from Culture Crave about Deadline's report, then if its the lowest when it comes to Mcu shows(along with Echo), then what about The Boys/Stranger Things?

 

[psylockolussus]

Broadcast Was “Surprisingly Resilient” In 2024 Amid Production Declines, But Streaming Still Leads The Pack; ‘Fool Me Once’ Led TV Last Year, Luminate Says

Fool Me Once was the biggest TV series of 2024, according to a new report from Luminate

deadline.com

Luminate also notes that streaming franchises — including Marvel, Star Wars and Rings of Power — all underperformed last year. The second season of Prime Video’s Lord of the Rings series was down 60% in total minutes watched compared to Season 1, and Disney+ didn’t fare much better with offerings like Echo and Agatha All Along, which underperformed previous Marvel streaming series

 

[Venom 1988]

This doesn't make any sense. This contradicts all the reports from THR and the Nielson ratings. What's the article link for this?

 

[blueharvest]

This doesn't make any sense. This contradicts all the reports from THR and the Nielson ratings. What's the article link for this?

It's from these two articles:

Broadcast Was “Surprisingly Resilient” In 2024 Amid Production Declines, But Streaming Still Leads The Pack; ‘Fool Me Once’ Led TV Last Year, Luminate Says

Fool Me Once was the biggest TV series of 2024, according to a new report from Luminate

deadline.com

Franchise Frenzy or Fatigue? | Luminate

When it came to franchise titles in 2024, studios found themselves at an important crossroads.

luminatedata.com

 

[Venom 1988]

It's from these two articles:

Broadcast Was “Surprisingly Resilient” In 2024 Amid Production Declines, But Streaming Still Leads The Pack; ‘Fool Me Once’ Led TV Last Year, Luminate Says

Fool Me Once was the biggest TV series of 2024, according to a new report from Luminate

deadline.com

Franchise Frenzy or Fatigue? | Luminate

When it came to franchise titles in 2024, studios found themselves at an important crossroads.

luminatedata.com

So they are only saying in relation to 2023 shows, not all the shows. Loki makes sense cause it's Loki, it's the highest viewed MCU show. Secret Invasion is making me scratch my head though. Everything I've read up on it in the past doesn't make me think it would have done better than Agatha. The viewership numbers for Agatha kept growing week to week. Something isn't adding up.

There's just simply no excitement/hype when they release so much in a short period of time.

My dude there was an 8 month gap between the two shows. That is not a short period.

 

[Weather Witch]

Very misleading way of presenting these metrics.

This only shows that:

• In the first 12 weeks, Agatha underperformed vs Secret Invasion, Loki S2, and Rings of Power
• Agatha All Along was the third most-watched Disney+ original of 2024

Now, we've been over budget compared to performance before, but ROP being this close to AOA is praise honestly. Or damning for the show that isn't AOA.

Some outlets are even comparing this 12-week run to the 26-week run last year, which is just nonsense. The metric used last year was views, which doesn't translate at all. If you look at this chart Secret Invasion and Loki S2 are very close. Last year's chart shows that Secret Invasion performed MUCH better. That's how misleading this is.

It's trying to paint a very clear picture that will generate articles about Disney. They spend half of their streaming slides on how bad Disney+ is doing and barely mention competitor services. The "Marvel series and Lord of the Rings" chart in particular is just insane framing. Data always has a bias. Usually, it just isn't as obvious.

Of course, everyone is jumping on this to write hit pieces.

 

[Weather Witch]

Seriously, looking at that page from Luminate again frustrates the hell outta me. Y'all know how I'm passionate about industry reporting, box office, and viewership stats.

It shows that Rings of Power had a huge drop, sure. Yet they use a picture of Agatha All Along. Write out the name of AOA just above 'streaming franchises fail to maintain momentum'. Only include Marvel shows that performed worse than ROP in the chart. Then the text mentions the struggles at Marvel first before finally pointing out the drop for ROP.

Agatha All Along as a <$40M show is made the posterchild for failing IP. While the $1B show ROP is mentioned in the footnotes. People are falling for it too. If Luminate didn't receive a personal check from Amazon for this, they certainly have staff members who hated Disney movies growing up.

Absolutely insane.

 

[Dragon_316ca]

 

[psylockolussus]

Very misleading way of presenting these metrics.

This only shows that:

• In the first 12 weeks, Agatha underperformed vs Secret Invasion, Loki S2, and Rings of Power
• Agatha All Along was the third most-watched Disney+ original of 2024

Now, we've been over budget compared to performance before, but ROP being this close to AOA is praise honestly. Or damning for the show that isn't AOA.

Some outlets are even comparing this 12-week run to the 26-week run last year, which is just nonsense. The metric used last year was views, which doesn't translate at all. If you look at this chart Secret Invasion and Loki S2 are very close. Last year's chart shows that Secret Invasion performed MUCH better. That's how misleading this is.

It's trying to paint a very clear picture that will generate articles about Disney. They spend half of their streaming slides on how bad Disney+ is doing and barely mention competitor services. The "Marvel series and Lord of the Rings" chart in particular is just insane framing. Data always has a bias. Usually, it just isn't as obvious.

Of course, everyone is jumping on this to write hit pieces.

Its really not a hit, really far from it.

I doubt Luminate would call it as an underperformer for nothing.

 

[Weather Witch]

Its really not a hit, really far from it.

I doubt Luminate would call it as an underperformer for nothing.

Hit piece as in a targeted article that damages brand credibility. Writing about Disney generates a lot of clicks so everyone wants to do it. Anger drives clicks too.

Think I've outlined pretty clearly the way I feel about how Luminate has reported on this topic. It's not about the data, but the framing is what I have massive issues with. It's terrible reporting.

 

[psylockolussus]

Hit piece as in a targeted article that damages brand credibility. Writing about Disney generates a lot of clicks so everyone wants to do it. Anger drives clicks too.

Think I've outlined pretty clearly the way I feel about how Luminate has reported on this topic. It's not about the data, but the framing is what I have massive issues with. It's terrible reporting.

Okay, but the Deadline article literally has this headline "Broadcast Was “Surprisingly Resilient” In 2024 Amid Production Declines, But Streaming Still Leads The Pack; ‘Fool Me Once’ Led TV Last Year, Luminate Says." Your reaction seems overexaggerated, when there's only 1 to 2 sentence about the "underperforming" Marvel shows. That article is not a Disney-hate article.

Anyway, as for season 2, don't get your hopes up.

Agatha All Along Season 2 Gets Disappointing Release Update From Actor - Comic Book Movies and Superhero Movie News - SuperHeroHype

Patti LuPone recently spoke about why fans have not yet seen either Agatha All Along or WandaVision return for Season 2.

www.superherohype.com

 

[Venom 1988]

Its really not a hit, really far from it.

lol what? Weather Wizard provided a breakdown of how exactly it was succesfully.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

Am I wrong in saying that it doesn't really make sense for these corporations to keep spending $200 million on 6 to 9 episode streaming shows and treating them as if they were blockbuster movies?

The Acolyte was the second most performing show on Disney Plus and they are cancelling it because they spent way too much money on it, and the numbers for everything else were... not that great overall. Which gets back to the nature of streaming, and all these services just don't seem sustainable long term.

Am I wrong here?

 

[Venom 1988]

Am I wrong in saying that it doesn't really make sense for these corporations to keep spending $200 million on 6 to 9 episode streaming shows and treating them as if they were blockbuster movies?

The Acolyte was the second most performing show on Disney Plus and they are cancelling it because they spent way too much money on it, and the numbers for everything else were... not that great overall. Which gets back to the nature of streaming, and all these services just don't seem sustainable long term.

Am I wrong here?

No you are not wrong. I'm not saying prestige TV should go away but streaming in general needs to starting scaling back and making TV shows with a resasonble sized budget and, imo, larger episode counts. Crazy idea but maybe we should start making tv shows actually tv shows again. Agatha was not perfect, but it was certainly a step in the right direction. One of the reasons why it is considered a success is due having the smallest budget of all the MCU shows ($40m). That budget in relation to the viewership it got is why Marvel considers it succesfull. If it had the budget of something like The Acolyte ($240m) or Secret Invasion ($212m) , this would be a different story.

 

[Weather Witch]

Okay, but the Deadline article literally has this headline "Broadcast Was “Surprisingly Resilient” In 2024 Amid Production Declines, But Streaming Still Leads The Pack; ‘Fool Me Once’ Led TV Last Year, Luminate Says." Your reaction seems overexaggerated, when there's only 1 to 2 sentence about the "underperforming" Marvel shows. That article is not a Disney-hate article.

I didn't say anything specifically about the Deadline article though? I commented on an industry trend and explained what I meant by a hit piece.

Am I wrong in saying that it doesn't really make sense for these corporations to keep spending $200 million on 6 to 9 episode streaming shows and treating them as if they were blockbuster movies?

Oh yeah, much I've enjoyed this era of companies throwing large amounts of money at streaming, it ultimately isn't sustainable. Same with all the gaming subscription services that allow you to play the newest AAA titles. All these companies have been too focused on market share and neglected everything else. That bubble is bursting unfortunately.

One of the reasons why it is considered a success is due having the smallest budget of all the MCU shows ($40m). That budget in relation to the viewership it got is why Marvel considers it succesfull. If it had the budget of something like The Acolyte ($240m) or Secret Invasion ($212m) , this would be a different story.

Absolutely! You can make several seasons of Agatha All Along for the budget of most shows it's being compared to. That makes it a smart investment. The results speak for itself. Similar story with the Ahsoka series.

 

[psylockolussus]

Am I wrong in saying that it doesn't really make sense for these corporations to keep spending $200 million on 6 to 9 episode streaming shows and treating them as if they were blockbuster movies?

The Acolyte was the second most performing show on Disney Plus and they are cancelling it because they spent way too much money on it, and the numbers for everything else were... not that great overall. Which gets back to the nature of streaming, and all these services just don't seem sustainable long term.

Am I wrong here?

I was under the assumption Disney gave these shows a big budget, so they would look on par with the MCU movies, rather looking like ABC/CW superhero shows.

Same with Star Wars movies. Financially it doesn't make sense especially they are pumping out these shows in such a rapid pace. If it was only 1 Star Wars and 1 Marvel live action show per year or every 2 years, it might be more sustainable in the long run.

 

[blueharvest]

 

[blueharvest]

 

[ComicChick]

not enough purple