Age of Ultron Age of Ultron SPOILER thread, DO NOT enter if you don't want to be spoiled!!! - Part 4

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Kudos to Whedon for not making this movie as obviously "Iron Man and Friends" as The Avengers, while still giving the armoured avenger his due.

I feel like Stark was the backbone of the movie, without taking over it.
 
I didn't feel at all like this was Stark's movie. Felt like I saw more Cap, Widow and Bruce throughout.
 
Stark is not only the backbone of the film, he's the villain. Without Stark, the twins would not have volunteered to join Hydra and Ultron never would have been created.

Frankly, after his personality became an annoyance in Iron Man 3, I'm pretty much sick of the character.
 
He's not a villain but he's quickly becoming the Tony Stark from the comics circa Civil War era. Which I guess is appropriate.
 
Stark is not only the backbone of the film, he's the villain. Without Stark, the twins would not have volunteered to join Hydra and Ultron never would have been created.

Frankly, after his personality became an annoyance in Iron Man 3, I'm pretty much sick of the character.

Hey guys, I found the third twin :funny:
 
He's not a villain but he's quickly becoming the Tony Stark from the comics circa Civil War era. Which I guess is appropriate.

Yes, he is and I love it. He couldn't stay stuck in his witty routine forever. I was never as fond of Stark as everyone else was, but he's quickly becoming very interesting to me.

He's more heroic and dedicated to his mission than ever. His Iron Legion protecting people, his heroics in the battle with Hulk, his intellect coming up with the plan at the end, etc. He's become a full on hero, no longer the selfish guy he used to be.

But you can start to see the cracks. You can see his paranoia, his fear, and his anxiety over what's coming. He's starting to become addicted to the idea of "putting a suit of armor around the world", even laughing at the rest of the team for not seeing what he sees. He clearly has stopped caring about what people will say, as seen by his talks with Banner. He even came to blows with Cap over Vision. He's willing to do whatever it takes to protect the earth. He's well on his way to becoming the Stark of Civil War, and he's becoming far more intriguing to me than he ever was as the "billionaire playboy philanthropist" Stark of the past.
 
He's sick. He still has PTSD and it's made him neurotic.
I love it too. A bit scary what a sick villain-like Stark could become.

I was shocked that he walked right up to Thor and kinda got in his face, without the armor. He knows Thor could squash him but during that emotionally charged moment, it didn't even register.
 
He's sick. He still has PTSD and it's made him neurotic.
I love it too. A bit scary what a sick villain-like Stark could become.

I was shocked that he walked right up to Thor and kinda got in his face, without the armor. He knows Thor could squash him but during that emotionally charged moment, it didn't even register.

Especially considering that Thor walked into the room and lifted him up by the neck right before that. I was with Banner when he was like "Tony, maybe this isn't the best time" I was like, Tony you're nuts, he can squash you right there! Even with the armor I still think he'd squash you if he was pissed enough.
 
Someone clocked the screen time for each Avenger.

Iron Man- 29:57

Hulk- 24:40

Captain America- 22:02

Black Widow- 19:23

Hawkeye- 14:20

Thor- 13:26

Scarlet Witch- 10:31

Quicksilver- 7:53

Vision- 5:50

War Machine- 2:15

Falcon- 0:35

Honestly it didn't feel like there was all this difference between the characters.
 
Once those 3 join the team (or at least BP and Cap Marvel), they will almost certainly be MORE powerful than the original team. Cap Marvel and Vision offer basically the same things Thor does, War Machine's got IM's power-set covered, Scarlet Witch offers a HUGE new power set, and T'Challa doubles the Cap power-set plus some. That's a ridiculously powerful team, even without a Hulk.

As for not having a science expert, they've got Vision, who basically has an advanced alien computer for a brain, so I'm sure he can handle the science/tech exposition stuff.


Adding Black Panther isn't just like adding another Cap, it's like adding another Cap AND Iron Man.

I think a lot of people often forget that Black Panther is a genius too. In fact in the comics they sometimes show him as being smarter than Tony Stark. T'Challa also has greater resources than Stark due to Wakanda.

So with Tony being out I'd expect T'Challa to fill the role of science expert.
 
I wish they had just gone the extra mile and gave some actual character progression to Stark, it feels like everything they worked towards in IM3 they kinda forgot, he still has ptsd, he's still quipping like a maniac, and upon seeing his vision and going protect the world crazy, he still reverts back to normal saves the day and drives off in his car (with more jokes and quips) just once I'd like them to take some risks and change the status quo with these characters, turn stark a bit darker and jaded by the events of these movies, thats why this film felt like filler to me, because we all know by the events of the next film the avengers will all assemble just as usual with little to no explanation. Take some damn risks Feige.

Winter Soldier got it. 100%...
 
I wish they had just gone the extra mile and gave some actual character progression to Stark, it feels like everything they worked towards in IM3 they kinda forgot, he still has ptsd, he's still quipping like a maniac, and upon seeing his vision and going protect the world crazy, he still reverts back to normal saves the day and drives off in his car (with more jokes and quips) just once I'd like them to take some risks and change the status quo with these characters, turn stark a bit darker and jaded by the events of these movies, thats why this film felt like filler to me, because we all know by the events of the next film the avengers will all assemble just as usual with little to no explanation. Take some damn risks Feige.

Winter Soldier got it. 100%...

I think Civil War is the movie to do that.
 
Adding Black Panther isn't just like adding another Cap, it's like adding another Cap AND Iron Man.

I think a lot of people often forget that Black Panther is a genius too. In fact in the comics they sometimes show him as being smarter than Tony Stark. T'Challa also has greater resources than Stark due to Wakanda.

So with Tony being out I'd expect T'Challa to fill the role of science expert.
You'll see we also discussed those aspects in the posts directly following the one you quoted. ;)

Yes, T'Challa is like adding the intellect/money of Tony Stark to the physical abilities of Cap. On top of the Cap we already have. And having both Cap Marvel and Vision on the team is almost like doubling the Thors, too. And SW can be as destructive as Hulk in her own way. Point being, once the newbies are added, they'll make the old team look...quaint. :woot:
 
I definitely believe that Ultron's creation was largely due to some type of Trojan Horse virus that Thanos implanted in the scepter/mind-stone. To me, it seemed like it was strongly hinted at several times throughout the film. It was Thanos' backup plan to destroy Earth and get the Mind Stone back, in case Loki failed him.

Totally agree with you!! Had exactly tha same feeling about Ultron's creation and Thanos troyan horse...hope we'll get straight answers and explanations in future films
 
Someone clocked the screen time for each Avenger.

Iron Man- 29:57

Hulk- 24:40

Captain America- 22:02

Black Widow- 19:23

Hawkeye- 14:20

Thor- 13:26

Scarlet Witch- 10:31

Quicksilver- 7:53

Vision- 5:50

War Machine- 2:15

Falcon- 0:35

Honestly it didn't feel like there was all this difference between the characters.

It's the Hulkbuster fight that puts Tony and Bruce out front, for sure. They get a one-on-one showcase there, as well as when they are working on the scepter/AI.

I'm surprised that Thor has so little screen time, but they sure made it count! His presence in the film feels much larger, so they did a good job. That counts more to me than the actual number of minutes.
 
Thor,Clint,Vision and Wanda really stood out considering their screentime.
 
It's the Hulkbuster fight that puts Tony and Bruce out front, for sure. They get a one-on-one showcase there, as well as when they are working on the scepter/AI.

I'm surprised that Thor has so little screen time, but they sure made it count! His presence in the film feels much larger, so they did a good job. That counts more to me than the actual number of minutes.

I agree. I would never have guessed that Thor had so much less screen time than some of the other guys. That just shows how well he comes across every time he's on screen. Now they just need to build on this for Ragnarok.
 
Stark is not only the backbone of the film, he's the villain. Without Stark, the twins would not have volunteered to join Hydra and Ultron never would have been created.

Frankly, after his personality became an annoyance in Iron Man 3, I'm pretty much sick of the character.

It makes sense this is happening if he is to have separate ideologies with the others going into Civil war. He is adamant about his solutions to world threats.
 
Kudos to Whedon for not making this movie as obviously "Iron Man and Friends" as The Avengers, while still giving the armoured avenger his due.

I feel like Stark was the backbone of the movie, without taking over it.

I half-disagree.

The first film was very "Iron Man and Friends" in its marketing and the presence each actor brought to their respective role. In terms of the actual narrative and screentime each character, it was pretty equal. But the former two reasons made the film feel more like "Iron Man and Friends" than it actually was.

By the second film the gap in success between Iron Man and the rest has shrunk, especially with Cap, and each actor has grown to embody their role in the same way. As such the film was more marketed on each character and characters with little screentime like Thor feel very present regardless. However, it's a much more Tony-driven narrative and he has significant more screentime than most of the rest of the team, even compared with Cap who had more screentime than him the first time around. So in that respect, this was a much more "Tony and Friends" film than the first.

I'd also argue that with the first film, the ways in which it was a "Tony and Friends" film were understandable for the time. Back then Downey was the only major success Marvel had. He was the glue holding the MCU's profits together, and everyone else was relatively newer and had less substance to work with in the other solo films (thus they hadn't grown in their role as much). This time it was a much fairer game all around. Marvel's had a number of hugely successful non-Iron Man products and each actor has greatly upped their game since then, especially Evans. To have an even more Tony focused narrative with the sequel is, in my opinion, inexcusable.
 
I don't see why people are so bent in the film too fail. Yeah, it has it's issues but all in all it's a FUN movie!

It really is a fun movie. I enjoyed it more than Avengers which I recently watched again. I plan on seeing AoU again if I have time after the gym.
 
I half-disagree.

The first film was very "Iron Man and Friends" in its marketing and the presence each actor brought to their respective role. In terms of the actual narrative and screentime each character, it was pretty equal. But the former two reasons made the film feel more like "Iron Man and Friends" than it actually was.

By the second film the gap in success between Iron Man and the rest has shrunk, especially with Cap, and each actor has grown to embody their role in the same way. As such the film was more marketed on each character and characters with little screentime like Thor feel very present regardless. However, it's a much more Tony-driven narrative and he has significant more screentime than most of the rest of the team, even compared with Cap who had more screentime than him the first time around. So in that respect, this was a much more "Tony and Friends" film than the first.

I'd also argue that with the first film, the ways in which it was a "Tony and Friends" film were understandable for the time. Back then Downey was the only major success Marvel had. He was the glue holding the MCU's profits together, and everyone else was relatively newer and had less substance to work with in the other solo films (thus they hadn't grown in their role as much). This time it was a much fairer game all around. Marvel's had a number of hugely successful non-Iron Man products and each actor has greatly upped their game since then, especially Evans. To have an even more Tony focused narrative with the sequel is, in my opinion, inexcusable.

You definitely have a point, this movie's story was completely structured around Stark. His fear, his mistake, Ultron and the Twins hating Stark more so than the Avengers, etc. Still, coming out of the movie it doesn't feel like Stark took over like in TA. I believe because on the surface level he was less prominent as compared to TA.

It actually feels like a reversal between TA and AoU. In TA, the plot doesn't really have much to do with Stark. Loki's plan and the assembly of the team were very balanced, and there wasn't any critical Stark-plot point besides the self-sacrifice play at the end. No Stark-driven plot. However, he's the spirit of the movie with his great character moments and lines.

In AoU, the story is pretty much driven by Stark. His actions are what push the story forward. But this time, on the surface level he's not as much of a scene-stealer. Everyone else is more in the spotlight this time, and Stark even takes a backseat during the finale, which also wasn't resolved solely due to him like in TA. So that's what I meant when I said he was the backbone of the movie without taking over it.

I've been waiting for your full review by the way, I can't wait to read your expanded thoughts on the movie.
 
The movie feels like a comic book page :)

Joss Weldon sure made me feel like a kid again
 
Someone clocked the screen time for each Avenger.

Iron Man- 29:57

Hulk- 24:40

Captain America- 22:02

Black Widow- 19:23

Hawkeye- 14:20

Thor- 13:26

Scarlet Witch- 10:31

Quicksilver- 7:53

Vision- 5:50

War Machine- 2:15

Falcon- 0:35

********

Thor had screentime in this movie
 
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