• The upgrade to XenForo 2.3.7 has now been completed. Please report any issues to our administrators.

Comics Amazing Spider-Man #595 - #599 "American Son" spoilers/discussion

Good issue. 5/5 from me.
I have absolutely nothing wrong to say with this issue. :up:

there were often times that I was confused between Norman and Harry. The artist at the end drew them WAY too closely but that's minor.
I kind of rolled my eyes at the "5-spectrums of light" thing though but meh I can believe why harry would want nothing more to do with Spidey.

It was clever to completely destroy Peter's mask in the first place, so he would adjust it to a more believable cover for his identity.
 
Last edited:
I kind of rolled my eyes at the "5-spectrums of light" thing though but meh I can believe why harry would want nothing more to do with Spidey.

Yet at the same time, if he did indeed see his face, and the disbelief that Spidey would be Peter, it would be credible for Harry to say he didn't see his face while he takes the time to digest this info...

I wouldn't be surprised if we find out that Harry saw him later on down the road...
 
Yet at the same time, if he did indeed see his face, and the disbelief that Spidey would be Peter, it would be credible for Harry to say he didn't see his face while he takes the time to digest this info...

I wouldn't be surprised if we find out that Harry saw him later on down the road...

I kind of figured that as well once I read it again....:cwink:
It also makes a little bit more sense as to why he would listen to Spidey near the end. :yay:

This is what I like in a comic. It was really good. It left closure while leaving certain things to be questioned, just enough...but not too much.
 
Okay, first of all, I'm not going to give a full recap of the comic like I did in earlier parts, mainly because it's just too much of a chore do do so. Secondly, in terms of American Son overall, I will agree that out of the mini-event stories like New Ways to Die, Character Assassination, and this one, American Son was the best of three. That's because, unlike the other two arcs, Kelly didn't make the mistake of trying to throw in extraneous, superfluous, and ultimately unrelated story threads (with the exception of one subplot) and as as result, we get a tightly-scripted more focused story involving the quasi-family power struggle between Peter, Harry, and Norman. The difference is that the previous mini-arcs had John Romita Jr. and this one, in terms of art, was just all over the map.

However, make no mistake, the conclusion to this arc was bar none the weakest of all five issues, and the whole arc suffers as result. First the good, then the bad:

*I appreciated that Harry, a character who has been haunted by the love for his father and yet felt unappreciated because he never seemed to live up to him, FINALLY stood up to Norman Osborn. The scene in which Spidey tells Harry that if he kills Norman, he'll be giving him exactly what he wants was certainly the best moment of the issue. Couple this with the flashback scene of Peter and Harry in college and how they became like brothers and it does suggest Harry has progressed as a character (even though, once again, Peter has remained static).

*Last issue, I thought it was very out of character for Norman to suggest that he'd be willing to arrange his own son's death to advance his own agenda when he's done pretty much everything to protect him as a form of misguided parental love. Here, I think Kelly better articulated Norman's rationale--in that since Norman now is about to be a father of a child whose parents both have the goblin formula coursing through them, and thus is a "genetically purer" offspring in his mind, he no longer needs Harry to carry on his legacy (of course, this then begs the question why even bother giving Harry ANOTHER chance if Norman already made up his mind before hand and he, in the context of this story, saw Harry as expendable anyway). And the last page in which Norman talks to his unborn son while Lily realizes in horror that she's nothing more than an incubator to the man whom she thought loved her really does underscore what a creepy and demented guy Norman really is.

However, aside from Norman and Harry disowning each other, nothing has actually changed. "But wait," you say, "What about Harry learning that his best friend, Peter Parker, is actually Spider-Man? He clearly saw Spidey unmasked, didn't he?" Are you sure about that? Because the way the scene was depicted, it's actually ambiguous as to whether or not Harry does actually know Peter is Spider-Man. Maybe Kelly believed that the readers would be smart enough to figure out Harry learned who Peter was without explicitly stating so, but this was certainly one of those times in which he shouldn't have cryptic and subtle. And if he doesn't know, then not only did--surprise, surprise--the solicit for this issue which clearly states Spidey's identity would be revealed to someone outright mislead it's potential readers, but it shows just how utterly ridiculous the whole "psychic blindspot" aspect of how Spidey's identity remains secret really is.

Also, if Norman is still alive and Harry clearly wants to have nothing to do with his father, what reason does Harry have in hating Spider-Man now? Is it because, like Norman, he's tired of Spider-Man also "interfering" with his life and how it's a mess because of it? It's understandable, but to make that the basis of hating Spider-Man to the point of wanting to kill him is bit of stretch. Likewise, since Harry no longer has to worry about trying to win over his father's approval, what is his motivation as a character now going to be? The issue suggest that Harry is going to fall of the wagon, AGAIN, this time possibly becoming addicted to Oxycontin. So his future as a character is being developed, or rather regressing, into being a junkie once again for Spidey to save? And folks wonder why BND seems like it's rehashing old stories.

As for the whole Norah subplot in her trying to get the dirt on Norman Osborn, what bearing did this have on the overall story other than to show what readers already knew--that Norman Osborn was evil and vindictive? Yeah, like we couldn't tell that already in the main storyline. And since Norah is clearly not going to publish her story, aside from making Norah scared out of her wits, it makes her entire contribution to American Son come off as completely pointless.

And don't get me started on how Peter winds up in the hospital under the pretext of being caught in a "hit and run," making this the second Spider-Man story this month that ends with Peter in the hospital. Yeah, real original guys! Not to mention, it once again shows how ridiculous the psychic blindspot is when the doctors completely buy this story, even though logically Peter's wounds wouldn't probably correspond to a hit and run, especially the friggin arrow wounds in his legs. I know Peter has enhanced healing, but it's not as fast as Wolverine's so the injuries, even after less than 24 hours, would still be clearly visible.

Finally, the fact that there were four different artists on this one issue really hurt the consistency, which has been a problem on the illustrations throughout this story. Now, folks were under the impression that Phil Jimenez couldn't do the entire arc due to personal reasons. Well, thanks to Wacker's note in the back of this issue, we finally learn that the real reason Jimenez couldn't do the arc was because he was doing the artwork for future issues of Astonishing X-Men. Well, if the braintrust/webheads knew Jimeniz had a prior commitment to another book, why even bother having him do the first issue? Because it comes across as a real bait-and-switch on their part, which I don't believe readers will appreciate.

So all in all, while American Son is better than New Ways to Die and Character Assassination, it still ends the same way as those other two arcs, in which there's a lot of build-up, but ultimately no real satisfying payoff at the end. At least in my opinion.
 
Last edited:
So all in all, while American Son is better than New Ways to Die and American Son, it still ends the same way as those other two arcs, in which there's a lot of build-up, but ultimately no real satisfying payoff at the end. At least in my opinion.

American Son is better than itself? o_O
 
I loved the the final part of the arch.

Just brought the Harry/Peter friendship to a new level, i think that was the core of this entire arch (also with the finally seeing some closure towards Harry/Norman).

American Son is deff. the best mini-story arch since BND started and one of the best emotional stories they have told. The way Peter tears up with his mask over, apologizing to Harry, but Harry not wanting to see his face...awesome stuff.

Bring #600 f'n on!
 
Very wonderful conclusion. Heart warming as well with Pete's inner monologue during the ending of the Harry/Norman battle. Joe Kelly really did a fantastic job. I was disappointed with the artwork. It wasn't bad but there were places that I was like, "Huh, wha?". If Romita Jr. would have been artist during this arc it would be a near classic in my eyes.

The creepiest part was those last few pages with Norman and Menace. Holy crap is Osborn one CREEPY bastard. But definitely sets up a very awesome future meeting between Spider-Man and the Green Goblin.

Also liked the flashback to what Wolverine told Spidey the next time he got a shot at taking out Norman. Things definitely have some awesome momentum going into # 600!
 
Very wonderful conclusion. Heart warming as well with Pete's inner monologue during the ending of the Harry/Norman battle. Joe Kelly really did a fantastic job.

The creepiest part was those last few pages with Norman and Menace. Holy crap is Osborn one CREEPY bastard. But definitely sets up a very awesome future meeting between Spider-Man and the Green Goblin.

Also liked the flashback to what Wolverine told Spidey the next time he got a shot at taking out Norman. Things definitely have some awesome momentum going into # 600!


Agreed. :woot:
 
Very wonderful conclusion. Heart warming as well with Pete's inner monologue during the ending of the Harry/Norman battle. Joe Kelly really did a fantastic job. I was disappointed with the artwork. It wasn't bad but there were places that I was like, "Huh, wha?". If Romita Jr. would have been artist during this arc it would be a near classic in my eyes.

The creepiest part was those last few pages with Norman and Menace. Holy crap is Osborn one CREEPY bastard. But definitely sets up a very awesome future meeting between Spider-Man and the Green Goblin.

Also liked the flashback to what Wolverine told Spidey the next time he got a shot at taking out Norman. Things definitely have some awesome momentum going into # 600!

Aloha,
Agreed. Now could someone tell me if Norman is disowning the twins from Gwen or just being N.O. scum of the earth or is Marvel trying to forget Sins Past like they did the Clone Saga for decades?
Spidey rules
 
Aloha,
Agreed. Now could someone tell me if Norman is disowning the twins from Gwen or just being N.O. scum of the earth or is Marvel trying to forget Sins Past like they did the Clone Saga for decades?
Spidey rules

Little of column A and column B i think.

It helps show how much of a bastard Norman is, because in reality, those "children" also failed him, so why would he care about them anymore, just like Harry. He's on to his next attempt to an heir.

Which if Lilly is preggers with a girl, that would be very interesting.

I like to see kinda Goblin Queen and Goblin King, plus with certain issues showing that split personality of Norman's starting to come back slowly, it will be interesting to maybe think that Norman's future downfall will not be because of anyone other then himself?
 
Aloha,
Agreed. Now could someone tell me if Norman is disowning the twins from Gwen or just being N.O. scum of the earth or is Marvel trying to forget Sins Past like they did the Clone Saga for decades?
Spidey rules

Marvel hasn't forgotten it. They referenced it in the thunderbolts with an awesome monologue but Norman Osborn.
It could just be a mistake made by the writer.
Just like when Peter fought with Ezekiel. "It was the first time he had ever fought with someone who had powers similar to his own." Yea....right." :whatever:

Or even when Peter thinks to himself in NWTD that his powers come from his radioactive blood. Although I'm not sure if that's a mistake or not. JMS wrote it out of continuity. (In the first Morlun arc he explains that the radioactivity was in his bloodstream for a while but died out after years.)
No one touches on that so that's what I believe. This new body (the other) that he has should not have any radioactivity in it.
I wish someone could conform which one is right for me.

Anyhoo,
When everybody's hands get in the pot. It gets kind of cluttered.

my opinion: they should have at least two writers on ASM. 4 is just way too much. Everyone has different styles and different flavors of Spider-man.
Waid and Kelly should be the only one's on this book. I have yet to be disappointed by either one in portrayal of Spider-man or Peter Parker. Sometimes I can't tell the difference. I thought Waid was doing american son.

I think the last few arcs made it clear that Marvel needs to go back to at least
2 issue's a month. I love the 3 times thing, but it just too much on the team. :csad:

  • Art has been rushed, so much that even JRJR has needed another artist to fill a gap. (He draws REALLY fast)
  • Norman's disappearing crew cut in NWTD
  • 2 artists a book. at least 3 times.
 
Last edited:
I need to remind people that in the American Son arc, there was a blonde man in one of the tubes with the name "G. Stacy" on the outside.... perhaps a "Gabriel Stacy"?

It may never go anywhere, but it's the small things like this that give a nod to past continuity...

Me likes it...

:yay:
 
I need to remind people that in the American Son arc, there was a blonde man in one of the tubes with the name "G. Stacy" on the outside.... perhaps a "Gabriel Stacy"?

It may never go anywhere, but it's the small things like this that give a nod to past continuity...

Me likes it...

:yay:

:up:

I'm interested in seeing the follow up to how Peter really feels about the affair. I think JMS hit it accurately. The things that ran through his mind from the immediate reaction is how I would have felt.

But afterwards they kinda dropped the ball due to all the backlash.
It's not gonna go away so they shouldn't ignore it.

Right now she's still "innocent" old Gwen Stacy in his heart.

Kind of like she is.......to the readers? :cwink:
 
In some way she will always been, because the guilt that Pete still has that HE killed her overpowers the wrongs she has done.

It happens all the time in real life, where people think of passed ones overly saintly then they really where in real life.
 
Yeah... I remember some real bastards in life that died, and suddenly, it's like they were best friends with Mother Theresa & Guandi...

:huh: :huh: :huh:

:o
 
I need to remind people that in the American Son arc, there was a blonde man in one of the tubes with the name "G. Stacy" on the outside.... perhaps a "Gabriel Stacy"?

It may never go anywhere, but it's the small things like this that give a nod to past continuity...

Me likes it...

:yay:

TMOB, I looked back at that issue and don't see where it says "G. Stacy." Where is it?

Could it be that he made a clone of Gwen and changed the sex. THAT would be the kind of twisted thing that Normie would do...
 
In some way she will always been, because the guilt that Pete still has that HE killed her overpowers the wrongs she has done.

It happens all the time in real life, where people think of passed ones overly saintly then they really where in real life.

True. I've been there before.
Oh yeah,
Did they ever confirm the real cause of her death?

I know that's been a pretty hot debate for years. But the way I see it is, whether she had been dead or alive (when she fell), she would have been killed anyways when he caught her. :csad:

Yeah... I remember some real bastards in life that died, and suddenly, it's like they were best friends with Mother Theresa & Guandi...

:huh: :huh: :huh:

:o

LOL.

I can't say it hasn't recently happened around me. This guy used to be a real jerk in High school, and when he passed away everyone remembers the one good thing he did for society, like play sports. :o

They completely ignore the students he sent to their graves through suicide. Yeah. He was a great guy. :whatever:

me on the other hand? I'm always there....but of course it gets over looked and I'm easily blamed too. Yowza. :yay:
 
I found the final issue, and the entire arc in general, to be completely underwhelming overall.

Bring on Doc Ock in #600.
 
You seem to be the in minority though, lot of talk bout the arch has been the best since BND and really great way to roll into #600. :cool:
 
I know that's been a pretty hot debate for years. But the way I see it is, whether she had been dead or alive (when she fell), she would have been killed anyways when he caught her. :csad:

There is no debate...

In the letter's page of ASM a few months afterwards (ASM #127 maybe?), Marvel states that it was the webbing impact that snapped her neck, though she was doomed to fall... either way, she was dead, but it was the webbing that snapped her neck and killing her.

:yay:
 
You seem to be the in minority though, lot of talk bout the arch has been the best since BND

That's not saying much.

This story felt like The Amazing Osborns, guest starring Spider-Man.

and really great way to roll into #600. :cool:

The only thing in this story that seems to build toward #600 is the Doc Ock cameo in #597, and the wedding plans for Aunt May.

This was just another generic Norman being a manipulator story. Oh look, he screwed over Harry again. Oh look, Norman's spawning another Goblin son.

The only part worth noting was Harry disowning himself from Norman at the end. And I wonder will that even last. The rest was sub standard, and definitely didn't live up to the hype, IMO.
 
Last edited:
There is no debate...

In the letter's page of ASM a few months afterwards (ASM #127 maybe?), Marvel states that it was the webbing impact that snapped her neck, though she was doomed to fall... either way, she was dead, but it was the webbing that snapped her neck and killing her.

:yay:

Maybe you haven't seen a debate. But I've seen them and they have certainly confused me. I've even heard some rumors that she had been dead before Spidey even reached her on the bridge.

Also I don't have a link but there was some dude that posted a scienftic article about the situation. He said given the elasticity of Spidey's webbing...it would not have snapped her neck. (Had it happened in real life) Which is kind of a pointless argument if you think about it, since you see a big SNAP on the page.

But thanks for confirming it like I asked now I know for sure. Hugs and kisses TMOB. :yay:
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"