Arrow Arrow Season 3 Episode 16 the offer

[JC00]

god forbid the show's protagonist defeat a female.

 

[The Shape]

Merlyn needs to go on a long vacation and not come until season 6.

I like Merlyn and I like Barrowman, but one could argue that the way they've shoe-horned him into this season is technically what has derailed the entire season. His actions and motivations -- and subsequently, Oliver's actions and motivations -- are pretty absurd.

 

[Herolee10]

Do you guys think that the producers are even aware of the fact that they pretty much just pissed all over the logic that their characters have had for several episodes with the airing of "Nanda Parbat" and "The Offer"?lol

We've had Oliver and company making some moronic decisions over the last few episodes due to them believing that Ra's Al Ghul was going to kill them all as a result of Thea's involvement with Sara's death.

Heck, the only reason why Oliver decided to challenge Ra's Al Ghul in "The Climb" was because he thought that Malcolm would release the footage of Thea killing Sara to the League.

However, as we just saw in the last two episodes...the only things that Ra's and Nyssa cared about was killing Malcolm.

Heck, even when Thea told Nyssa that she was the one that killed Sara, she did nothing about it. And Oliver admitted in "Nanda Parbat" that he knew Malcolm would never serve Thea up to Ra's.

 

[Herolee10]

I like Merlyn and I like Barrowman, but one could argue that the way they've shoe-horned him into this season is technically what has derailed the entire season. His actions and motivations -- and subsequently, Oliver's actions and motivations -- are pretty absurd.

There are only three things that I can think of, where I feel seeing Malcolm in this season was entertaining or useful.

I enjoyed the fact that he at least taught Thea how to fight so that we don't have to waste more time in the future to get that out of the way.

I loved seeing him interact with Ra's, let alone having him squirm at his mere presence.

And truth be told, I liked seeing the flashbacks concerning what he was like before and after his wife was killed.

But does this justify him being a series regular this season? Hell no.lol

 

[Slade W]

Barrowman had to be tied down. He had offers from other shows last year so he asked the Arrow writers if they wanted him or not as he was considering the offers and he made them make their decision fast and give him their word he would be back in season 3. He said this in an interview.

 

[Slade W]

To add to my last post, I think the writers made the right decision. An Arrow universe with Barrowman in it is better than one without him.

 

[The Sage]

I'm conflicted about this episode. Not because I didn't like it or not---I really did like it. When it was over, I was wishing to myself that it had happened much sooner than it did. Because this needed to happen. They needed to establish Ra's as the bad guy. Up until now, he's been in limbo.

But if it had happened earlier on in the season, then it would've been stretched out, and not in a good way. Or maybe if it happened earlier, they could've given Ollie a couple additional episodes to ponder the offer.

Loved Ollie's inner conflict. A lot of what's happened this season from his actions have come back to bite him.

Why they brought Malcolm back with him, I don't understand. After all of that, "No prison can hold us" talk, Ra's was holding him pretty well. Should've dropped him on Lian Yu and put him in constraints.

I didn't even bother asking how Ra's got the Arrow outfit. People just come and go from the Foundry.

 

[Boy Scout]

I assume he has the resources to make his own.

 

[JC00]

Do you guys think that the producers are even aware of the fact that they pretty much just pissed all over the logic that their characters have had for several episodes with the airing of "Nanda Parbat" and "The Offer"?lol

We've had Oliver and company making some moronic decisions over the last few episodes due to them believing that Ra's Al Ghul was going to kill them all as a result of Thea's involvement with Sara's death.

Heck, the only reason why Oliver decided to challenge Ra's Al Ghul in "The Climb" was because he thought that Malcolm would release the footage of Thea killing Sara to the League.

However, as we just saw in the last two episodes...the only things that Ra's and Nyssa cared about was killing Malcolm.

Heck, even when Thea told Nyssa that she was the one that killed Sara, she did nothing about it. And Oliver admitted in "Nanda Parbat" that he knew Malcolm would never serve Thea up to Ra's.

So what's the complaint?

Oliver was basing decisions on the fact that The League was gonna come after them. DJ Assassin even tried to kill Thea. Oliver going for Malcom was the only dumb decision but he was doing it because he didn't want Thea to have the guilt of giving up someone to be killed. Then Oliver was ready to die when Ra's made him an offer.

As for Nyssa it is pretty clear she's always wanted Merlyn to pay for Sara's death. So when Thea tells her she was drugged by him it puts it back on Merlyn of who is responsible for Sara's death.

But as for Oliver's decisions how was he suppose to know Ra's was not only not gonna kill him but offer him The League?

 

[fire117]

So what's the complaint?

Oliver was basing decisions on the fact that The League was gonna come after them. DJ Assassin even tried to kill Thea. Oliver going for Malcom was the only dumb decision but he was doing it because he didn't want Thea to have the guilt of giving up someone to be killed. Then Oliver was ready to die when Ra's made him an offer.

As for Nyssa it is pretty clear she's always wanted Merlyn to pay for Sara's death. So when Thea tells her she was drugged by him it puts it back on Merlyn of who is responsible for Sara's death.

But as for Oliver's decisions how was he suppose to know Ra's was not only not gonna kill him but offer him The League?

You make some good points.

 

[Seb]

god forbid the show's protagonist defeat a female.

I think people are making the same complaint that I have: It's not about Oliver defeating a female, it's about him effortlessly defeating that female. Him beating Huntress was never an issue because he has more training than her and is just generally shown to be better than her, but this show (like a lot of comic books) has the issue of portraying villains as stronger than the hero, then having the hero defeat them purely because he is the hero, or because it makes the scene look prettier, or whatever.

In the end, it depends what matter most to you when watching a show, but for me, characters and consistency are the most important things, and if a show can't manage that then I'm gonna whine about it.

Oliver also saved his city twice in as many years, and he's defeated countless threats. So no, he's not as incompetent as some people seem to think, except for when Malcolm is involved. And Nyssa hardly has a stellar track record on the show either.

He actually didn't save his city in season 1. Malcolm had a back up bomb, so Oliver failed his city pretty spectacularly. And in season 2, he just about manage to stop his city being entirely obliterated and he needed Nyssa and the League's help to do it (something that Sara secured, not Oliver.)

Honestly, unless Ra's is just doing all of this in an effort to toughen Nyssa up I'm just going to use the head-canon that the Pit has completely destroyed his judgement.

 

[Seb]

So what's the complaint?

Oliver was basing decisions on the fact that The League was gonna come after them. DJ Assassin even tried to kill Thea. Oliver going for Malcom was the only dumb decision but he was doing it because he didn't want Thea to have the guilt of giving up someone to be killed. Then Oliver was ready to die when Ra's made him an offer.

As for Nyssa it is pretty clear she's always wanted Merlyn to pay for Sara's death. So when Thea tells her she was drugged by him it puts it back on Merlyn of who is responsible for Sara's death.

But as for Oliver's decisions how was he suppose to know Ra's was not only not gonna kill him but offer him The League?

The problem with this is that he admitted last episode that he never really thought Malcolm would release the video of Thea, so lying to protect Malcolm (who the League suspected and wanted) and challenging Ra's was a dumb idea. Oliver put himself and the Team in the League's crosshairs by protecting Merlin both in the Magician and in the Climb. DJ *****ebag didn't attack Thea until after Oliver fought Ra's, so that wasn't an incentive.

Some of Oliver's decisions do make sense, but almost all of them are decisions he only had to make because of some idiotic previous decision. He has been making out of character choices based on what advances the plot rather than the plot advancing organically and adhering to the character the writers have shown us over the first two seasons.

 

[Herolee10]

I'm trying to figure out what Maseo's motives are.

I mean, do you guys even think Ra's knows that the only reason why Oliver is still alive is because Maseo intervened? And in hindsight of everything that's going on, did he only save Oliver because he wanted to repay his debt, from which as soon as Oliver recovered, his debt was paid? Or does Maseo plan on assisting Oliver from the shadows whenever it's possible?

 

[HanShotFirst]

Pretty meh episode. You can just skip oliver/felicity and merlyn/thea conversations and nothing of the value would be lost. They've been repeating the same thing over and over again this whole damn season. Just a filler.
Atleast action scenes are great as always.

 

[Boy Scout]

I'm trying to figure out what Maseo's motives are.

I mean, do you guys even think Ra's knows that the only reason why Oliver is still alive is because Maseo intervened? And in hindsight of everything that's going on, did he only save Oliver because he wanted to repay his debt, from which as soon as Oliver recovered, his debt was paid? Or does Maseo plan on assisting Oliver from the shadows whenever it's possible?

He knows Oliver's alive because he made a grand, televised speech to the city almost immediately upon return.

 

[SpideyVille]

I'm trying to figure out what Maseo's motives are.

I mean, do you guys even think Ra's knows that the only reason why Oliver is still alive is because Maseo intervened? And in hindsight of everything that's going on, did he only save Oliver because he wanted to repay his debt, from which as soon as Oliver recovered, his debt was paid? Or does Maseo plan on assisting Oliver from the shadows whenever it's possible?

This is actually an important things to think about and I wouldn't be surprised if he factored into the finale, or the resolution with Ra's. I mean, we still don't know what happened to his son, and while the most logical and common belief is that he died, I think it's almost too obvious at this point. A real twist would be that his son was kidnapped and later trained by the League or something, because in present day he would be about 17-19 years old give or take, so he could be a much different character.

But there's more to Maseo than what's being let on and I just wish the flashbacks didn't stall things as much as the main arc has been.

 

[JC00]

The problem with this is that he admitted last episode that he never really thought Malcolm would release the video of Thea, so lying to protect Malcolm (who the League suspected and wanted) and challenging Ra's was a dumb idea. Oliver put himself and the Team in the League's crosshairs by protecting Merlin both in the Magician and in the Climb. DJ *****ebag didn't attack Thea until after Oliver fought Ra's, so that wasn't an incentive.

Some of Oliver's decisions do make sense, but almost all of them are decisions he only had to make because of some idiotic previous decision. He has been making out of character choices based on what advances the plot rather than the plot advancing organically and adhering to the character the writers have shown us over the first two seasons.

Except Ra's threatened to kill citizens of Star City if Oliver didn't bring him the person who killed Sara. If we are to believe Oliver has made the jump from murderous vigilante to city protecting superhero, then him not giving up Merlyn to be murdered can't be looked at as a dumb decision.

People want him to be 100% faithful to the comics and be Green Arrow, would Green Arrow in the comics give up an enemy to be murdered?

Only dumb decision now is Oliver not handing Merlyn over to the authorities. So hopefully when they go to Diggle's wedding Merlyn gives them the slip so it doesn't become a thing.

 

[combocaz]

What's the point in having a mask when pretty much everyone on the show knows who you are?. For me the show has too many sidekicks, it was way better when Ollie worked alone with diggle and felicity. The romance thing with Ollie and felicity never worked for me and I'm glad that's out of the picture. Glad to see shadow though hopefully we see more of her.

 

[Hunter Rider]

What's the point in having a mask when pretty much everyone on the show knows who you are?. For me the show has too many sidekicks, it was way better when Ollie worked alone with diggle and felicity. The romance thing with Ollie and felicity never worked for me and I'm glad that's out of the picture. Glad to see shadow though hopefully we see more of her.

I disagree but regardless of our views it's clearly not over at all, this weeks past ep was evidence of that, the scenes between them showed he wants her more than anything but is afraid, and she all but said "I'd drop Ray like a hot brick if you change your mind about us."

 

[fire117]

I disagree but regardless of our views it's clearly not over at all, this weeks past ep was evidence of that, the scenes between them showed he wants her more than anything but is afraid, and she all but said "I'd drop Ray like a hot brick if you change your mind about us."

Agreed. I dont like the Ray/Felicity pairing myself. I find Ray too stalkerish frankly.

 

[Pokkle]

Agreed. I dont like the Ray/Felicity pairing myself. I find Ray too stalkerish frankly.

And Oliver is a serial killer. t:

I would like that they just make Felicity and Ray, a happy couple forever and stop the drama/cheating/etc but it won't happen.

 

[JC00]

For me the show has too many sidekicks

It's kind of comic accurate though.

 

[SpideyVille]

It's kind of comic accurate though.

With the exception of Diggle and Felicity, neither of whom wear masks, it's very comic accurate.

The Green Arrow family has usually been Oliver, Dinah, Roy and Mia. They will have achieved this if Roy lives by the time Thea gets her mask.

 

[Primal Slayer]

Colton is still filming so he isn't dead

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

It not different from batman, robin and batgirl working together as a team. But I think Roy will going solo eventually