Comics Back In Black Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

[moraldeficiency]

Symbolism in comics is all well and good, but not if something being detailed for the sake of symbolism compromises the integrity of the standard to which the title has come to be expected, and/ or insults it’s readers intelligence.

JMS- one of his main problems is that far too often he is solely concerned w/ the grand concept behind his story and what HE wants to do in the arc. To hell w/ whether it’s actually possible in terms of past continuity, whether it means he just has to invent things up that never happened or even if it means he writes PP doing stuff he would never do.

You see I’m not asking that everything be in back issues that is revealed in current issues.
But to just pluck something out of nowhere like that PP had already developed a batch of web fluid back in the day that lasted for long periods of time- months/years is bad writing.
It’s JMS just making something up to get his turd to float.

Why is it bad writing?
Because we all known Spidey’s original webbing only lasted an hour.
If he had ever developed a batch that could last as long as months …up to years then this would certainly be enough of a significant event that we would have seen him do so in the comics.
The mere fact that in a Q&A recently when a board member asked him about the webbings life span in #539 he replied by saying Spider-man’s original duration of the webbing was long-term, proves he does not even know the source material.

It may be a comic about a guy w/ proportionate spider powers, but the comics have always been written to a certain standard w/ everything inside the books being justified.
So your symbolism over reason argument does not have any legs.

Now I could mention about a million times in back issues that show science being thrown to the wind for the sake of continuing a plot line but you know them as well as I do I'm sure. I agree that a standard should be made but I'm willing to accept a lot if it provides the story with depth and dimension. We obviously disagree on this. It's just that I need more story and that story shouldn't just be written to entertain little kids and science nerds. I thought that the last ASM (despite bothering errors) was the first issue to get back on track of an actual story that's character driven based on emotions, which has always been Bug's appeal (at least to me).

While I agree the one hour thing has been a staple I have also seen bugs experiment with it and get some different results. You'll forgive me for not having the issues handy (I'm at work) but he did invent a webbing that was too strong for his web shooters that required diamond cutters to break (where he got that I have no idea) I also remember on a very odd storyline (I believe it was in WOSM) he designed a webbing battle suit made of a hardened web substance (it was later disolved by plant man) that was much more durable and lasted much longer than an hour. Look I'm not saying I buy it completely, it was a copout answer, but I'll take it with a grain of salt and say the imagery was worth the little tick in the back of my mind.

Unfortunately there's always gonna be errors. Unavoidable. Hopefully they'll step up their checks and balances but if everyone's gonna let some errors ruin a great story than you're in for a long miserable hall reading marvel.

 

[Mara Jane]

Not to mention that, seeing as how his web doesn't stay sticky all the time, it's possble that moths could have laid eggs all in it and eaten it up! That thing should be ridden with holes, or at least lost some of it's elasticity!

Now THAT would be real Parker luck! Pete having to swing around town in a moth-eaten, stretched out costume.

 

[Dangerous]

While I agree the one hour thing has been a staple I have also seen bugs experiment with it and get some different results. You'll forgive me for not having the issues handy (I'm at work) but he did invent a webbing that was too strong for his web shooters that required diamond cutters to break (where he got that I have no idea) I also remember on a very odd storyline (I believe it was in WOSM) he designed a webbing battle suit made of a hardened web substance (it was later disolved by plant man) that was much more durable and lasted much longer than an hour. Look I'm not saying I buy it completely, it was a copout answer, but I'll take it with a grain of salt and say the imagery was worth the little tick in the back of my mind.

Yes but as you highlighted above, the development of these variants on the standard web fluid were all previously detailed in specific issues that you recall. This only serves to reaffirm the dumbness of JMS decision to have Spidey recovering a black costume he webbed up to a building months/years ago, since we had never seen PP ever whip up a batch of the stuff that had that kind of lifespan.

Unfortunately there's always gonna be errors. Unavoidable. Hopefully they'll step up their checks and balances but if everyone's gonna let some errors ruin a great story than you're in for a long miserable hall reading marvel.

Well, I don’t have a problem w/ the other books.
FNSM and SSM are great, JMS is just sloppy.

 

[moraldeficiency]

Yes but as you highlighted above, the development of these variants on the standard web fluid were all previously detailed in specific issues that you recall. This only serves to reaffirm the dumbness of JMS decision to have Spidey recovering a black costume he webbed up to a building months/years ago, since we had never seen PP ever whip up a batch of the stuff that had that kind of lifespan.



Well, I don’t have a problem w/ the other books.
FNSM and SSM are great, JMS is just sloppy.

I disagree with none of that. I just think you might be being slightly over critical. I was very happy with the last issue of ASM and I hope it starts a trend for the future issues and not just this arc. I agree more fact checking and editorial work needs to be done.

 

[moraldeficiency]

But I don't really think FNSM is very good at all. The stories all seem like bad filler to me.

 

[SpideyZERO]

We need some breaks from the no-turning-back event of ASM. SSM and FNSM are where we get the filler adventures

 

[moraldeficiency]

We need some breaks from the no-turning-back event of ASM. SSM and FNSM are where we get the filler adventures

SSM I like, but FNSM just hasn't been a very good read for me. I hope it improves but that last issue truly was awful.

 

[SpideyZERO]

You mean the Sandblasted story? I was pretty disappointed that Peter felt nothing when he found out that an alternate Uncle Ben is killed. It's still Uncle Ben but yet he didn't show any sadness

 

[Themanofbat]

You mean the Sandblasted story? I was pretty disappointed that Peter felt nothing when he found out that an alternate Uncle Ben is killed. It's still Uncle Ben but yet he didn't show any sadness

I don't think Peter should be saddened... because it wasn't his Uncle Ben. The Uncle Ben from the alternate reality had a different personality than his Uncle Ben, and was a different person.

And while Peter still feels guilt over the death of his Uncle Ben, I think he's moved on from it.

Just my two cents...

 

[moraldeficiency]

You mean the Sandblasted story? I was pretty disappointed that Peter felt nothing when he found out that an alternate Uncle Ben is killed. It's still Uncle Ben but yet he didn't show any sadness

Personally I don't like the alternate Ben's at all. Also the creature they were fighting??? What the hell man!?! And I know there saving a lot of the Sandman's better material for the upcoming but Sandy and Bugs have one hell of a history and we got like nothing for it in the story. I thought it would be a great story and it just fell so short in my eyes I don't believe I'll pick up another issue unless someone convinces me otherwise.

 

[SpideyZERO]

http://www.marvel.com/news/comicstories.984
Some new previews for FNSM #20. It seems that it has different cover from solicitation we got. Looks Peter David will now solve the mystery of The Other.

The article about Spidey in black is kinda pointless anyway. We have heard of it for millions times

 

[shinlyle]

That cover is NICE! Is reminds me of some of the Black and White covers from teh 80's...

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Okay, Alonso said this...

For the first time, Peter Parker is embracing his anger and nixing the wise cracks.

Definitely *cough*Peter's parents* not *cough* Peter finding out he's a clone *cough* true.

Will he finally snap or will he be able to reign himself back in? Alonso says to keep reading and find out. "In August and September, Spider-Man will be the number one topic of debate at your local comic store. What we're about to do is historic."

Uh oh... If Alonzo is saying that, the editor in charge during those "stellar" status-quo changing events such as "Sins Past", "The Other", Peter's organic webshooters, the unmasking and all the mystical totem-stuff, then that sound-byte can only mean trouble. For once I don't want Spidey to be the topic of debate at the local comic store... because nowadays they just debate how all these shock-value events suck. How about we just have solid stories without his world having to be turned upside down every six months?

 

[arachnid-guy]

Am I the only one disappointed with FNSM's art?

 

[CConn]

I'm a pretty big fan of Nauck myself. I mean, sure, he's no Wieringo, but he does a great job of capturing the light, comic book-y style of Peter David's writing. Plus David's very familiar with him from his Young Justice run.

 

[Venom Drool]

the writing of fnsm sucks..

 

[SpideyZERO]

I think it's ok....it's fun. I just don't really like the 2211 connection much

 

[Venom Drool]

its not even that. its just boring. it feels like noting is really happening. the characetrs are flat and that red guy is the chamleon. what the hell? its just.. stupid. the betty brant is crazy angle is dumb, and this wrapping up into the other is even worse as it is not in any way emotionally driven. whats her story with peter? also, who cares? they could have done something motre interesting like they did with the vulture but this crap is god awful. the art makes my head hurt too.

 

[Dangerous]

That cover is NICE! Is reminds me of some of the Black and White covers from teh 80's...

Me too, reminds me of Milgrom.

 

[Kevin]

its not even that. its just boring. it feels like noting is really happening. the characetrs are flat and that red guy is the chamleon. what the hell? its just.. stupid. the betty brant is crazy angle is dumb, and this wrapping up into the other is even worse as it is not in any way emotionally driven. whats her story with peter? also, who cares? they could have done something motre interesting like they did with the vulture but this crap is god awful. the art makes my head hurt too.

ooookay....

 

[SpideyZERO]

I hate my LCS. It only has new shipment every 2-3 weeks. So I get new issues late and worst, I have to buy a lot of them at once, thus, using a lot of money at once.

I just bought ASM 539, SSM 36, FNSM 19, Spider-Man Family 2, Spawn 166, and tpb: Ultimate Spider-Man Clone Saga and Birth of Venom. I'm officially bankrupt t:

ASM 539 is surprising good. JMS makes a predictable storyline good with great character emotion, and the last picture of Spidey rocks. I could care less about some errors, it will be fixed. I'm really looking forward to this arc!!! Great start

SSM 36 is quite ok, it's just the art. I really miss Medina's art as it gives the story a darker feeling. I like the conversation between Reed and Peter. There's some great tension between them, thanks to the little Civil War.

FNSM 19 is as funny as usual. So Spidey and Sandy and Dennis are the Marvel Scobby Doo gang? t: Nice. Much more hint that Miss Arrow is The Other. And LOL at the poetic justice.

So far I'm enjoying Back In Black event. Good to see Peter being dead serious while I still can enjoy seeing Peter joking around in FNSM!

 

[shinlyle]

I'm a pretty big fan of Nauck myself. I mean, sure, he's no Wieringo, but he does a great job of capturing the light, comic book-y style of Peter David's writing. Plus David's very familiar with him from his Young Justice run.

Honestly, I like Nauck's art, myself. He's shows a lot of promise, and I'm a big fan of new blood getting a chance at drawing Spidey, as I'd like to draw him one day, myself.

My only beef with his artwork is that he continues to draw the white spider on Spidey's chest incorrectly. It looks like an ant. That is the ONLY problem I have with it. Everything else is dead on.

 

[Norman Osborn]

Personally I don't like the alternate Ben's at all. Also the creature they were fighting??? What the hell man!?! And I know there saving a lot of the Sandman's better material for the upcoming but Sandy and Bugs have one hell of a history and we got like nothing for it in the story. I thought it would be a great story and it just fell so short in my eyes I don't believe I'll pick up another issue unless someone convinces me otherwise.

Personally I thought the Vulture arc was so darned good I put the title back on my pull list ....The Sandman arc was a let down but I'm giving the title some slack...why?.....

1/ Because David retconned the evil Ben Parker (although in all fairness he dreamed up the idiotic idea in the first place)....so no matter how bad it was (and I personally thought the arc as a whole had some positives)...a positive came from it

2/ I truly believe David's planning on retconning the "Other" ....not just making "arrow" the "other"...but blowing the whole Pete died and was reborn and embraced the spider and was one of many spider-men and blah blah blah!!!!......and if the "Other" arc is getting a long awaited retcon bomb....I darn well wanna be there when it happens...

...and if it doesn't happen then David better have some more Vulture arcs up his sleeve!

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Anyone get the Back In Black Handbook this week?

I was really impressed. It was written by Mike Fichera, who is a staff writer over at www.spiderfan.org and man, there is all KINDS of detail about all the characters and situations currently happening in Spidey-land.

There is more detail and info on the Daily Bugle staff that i've ever seen compiled ANYWHERE else...

A really cool "see-through diagram" showing how Peter's organics work (ewww! )....

And apparently, Peter can now press 20 tons!!! (which means i expect to see him kicking some serious butt in the very near future)...

Anyway; if you're the type of fan that likes all that type of info (like ME ), then this is a must have.

 

[Dangerous]

Anyone get the Back In Black Handbook this week?

I was really impressed. It was written by Mike Fichera, who is a staff writer over at www.spiderfan.org and man, there is all KINDS of detail about all the characters and situations currently happening in Spidey-land.

There is more detail and info on the Daily Bugle staff that i've ever seen compiled ANYWHERE else...

A really cool "see-through diagram" showing how Peter's organics work (ewww! )....

And apparently, Peter can now press 20 tons!!! (which means i expect to see him kicking some serious butt in the very near future)...

Anyway; if you're the type of fan that likes all that type of info (like ME ), then this is a must have.

Oh it is indeed a great piece of work Cap!

Check it out I have even made a thread for the BIB handbook.
After reading the Gwen Clones profile I was reminded of when Deadpool had 4 of em dressed as French maids serving him, so I then went and dug out those issues and re read em.