Batman R.I.P.

[sclabguy]

^seems like a good theory but i doubt it

 

[Joker's Lackey]

I though Harlequin was implied by the Red and Black Tile floor line?

 

[Dirt Like Me]

To answer the question of whether the Joker already knew that Bruce is Batman, I think Morrison's version certainly knows and doesn't care.

In Issue #663 (the prose issue), the Joker's narration says:

"Both of us are trying to find meaning in a meaningless world. Why be a disfigured outcast when I can be a notorious crime God? Why be an orphaned boy when you can be a superhero?"
​

And in Arkham Asylum, when Black Mask suggest unmasking Batman, the Joker tells him to stop being so unimaginative, and that Batman is his real face.

My question now is this: What's the Joker going to do if Bruce isn't Batman anymore? It won't be the same for him if it's anybody else behind the cowl, so would he be content to devote his life to fighting laundry (the costume)? Would he go away until Bruce's inevitable reemergence? Would he kill himself? I think that this could be one of the more interesting things to come out of RIP.

As for the rest of the issue: some cool [BLACKOUT](Joker killing some of the B-listers, though I thought El Sombrero had potential)[/BLACKOUT], some predictable [BLACKOUT](Jezebel's betrayal)[/BLACKOUT].

To me there's a lot riding on this final issue. If Dr. Hurt's identity turns out to be a letdown, my opinion of the entire arc will suffer tremendously.

 

[javi1024]

To answer the question of whether the Joker already knew that Bruce is Batman, I think Morrison's version certainly knows and doesn't care.

In Issue #663 (the prose issue), the Joker's narration says:

"Both of us are trying to find meaning in a meaningless world. Why be a disfigured outcast when I can be a notorious crime God? Why be an orphaned boy when you can be a superhero?"
​

And in Arkham Asylum, when Black Mask suggest unmasking Batman, the Joker tells him to stop being so unimaginative, and that Batman is his real face.

My question now is this: What's the Joker going to do if Bruce isn't Batman anymore? It won't be the same for him if it's anybody else behind the cowl, so would he be content to devote his life to fighting laundry (the costume)? Would he go away until Bruce's inevitable reemergence? Would he kill himself? I think that this could be one of the more interesting things to come out of RIP.

As for the rest of the issue: some cool [blackout](Joker killing some of the B-listers, though I thought El Sombrero had potential)[/blackout], some predictable [blackout](Jezebel's betrayal)[/blackout].

To me there's a lot riding on this final issue. If Dr. Hurt's identity turns out to be a letdown, my opinion of the entire arc will suffer tremendously.

very interesting Joker analysis. that's something i would definitely like to see explored. and i agree, EVERYTHING is riding on the upcoming final issue. i have to admit reading through Morrison's run a second time made everything so much clearer but not necessarily better; though there have been highlights (the 3 batmen). but if the story doesn't end well, i think Morrison's run will go down as a low point in Batman's history (if it isn't being called that already ).

 

[WolfCypher]

To answer the question of whether the Joker already knew that Bruce is Batman, I think Morrison's version certainly knows and doesn't care.

In Issue #663 (the prose issue), the Joker's narration says:

"Both of us are trying to find meaning in a meaningless world. Why be a disfigured outcast when I can be a notorious crime God? Why be an orphaned boy when you can be a superhero?"
​

And in Arkham Asylum, when Black Mask suggest unmasking Batman, the Joker tells him to stop being so unimaginative, and that Batman is his real face.

My question now is this: What's the Joker going to do if Bruce isn't Batman anymore? It won't be the same for him if it's anybody else behind the cowl, so would he be content to devote his life to fighting laundry (the costume)? Would he go away until Bruce's inevitable reemergence? Would he kill himself? I think that this could be one of the more interesting things to come out of RIP.

As for the rest of the issue: some cool [blackout](Joker killing some of the B-listers, though I thought El Sombrero had potential)[/blackout], some predictable [blackout](Jezebel's betrayal)[/blackout].

To me there's a lot riding on this final issue. If Dr. Hurt's identity turns out to be a letdown, my opinion of the entire arc will suffer tremendously.

I don't remember...did JP Valley Batman ever encountered the Joker?

Anyway, your comment on how the potenial with seeing how the Joker acts after Batman "dies" is interesting, but I wouldn't be surprised if that potential was wasted. We probably wont see any good post-RIP Joker development. Maybe we will, I dunno.

 

[jackshea]

i think joker and batman will fight to the death, and "kill" each other. I think that bruce might live, yet retire. Joker would hate if the joke was on him and reinvent himself before his death in another person, twist someone else so badly that they become him, and ultimately have that joker kill bruce, because he's no longer batman, the ultimate punchline. i know its a stretch.

 

[OSM]

This arc is absolutely crazy. Thank god it's almost over, none of this is making any sense to me still.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Some readers on the DC message boards have speculated that Doctor Hurt is none other than The Devil himself. I agree that the current issue has quite a bit of demonic imagery, e.g., Joker's forked tongue, the red and black, Hurt referring to Joker as his "good and faithful servant", etc. Not sure what to make of all that and I'm still confused as all hell, no pun intended.
Others on the board think Batman killed Joker and will now be taking his place as the clown prince of crime. How is the Joker walking around with a bullet in his head anyhow??

 

[Saint]

Hurt being the devil; that's interesting. Grand. Would require careful execution to work. Intriguing.

 

[CrimsonMist]

Hurt being the devil; that's interesting. Grand. Would require careful execution to work. Intriguing.

i believe Hurt being the Devil was implied in the issue where the third Batman tortures Bruce. Towards the end of the issue, i think.

 

[UA-Archangel]

Others on the board think Batman killed Joker and will now be taking his place as the clown prince of crime. How is the Joker walking around with a bullet in his head anyhow??

He may have put it there, after getting shot.

 

[sclabguy]

i think joker and batman will fight to the death, and "kill" each other. I think that bruce might live, yet retire. Joker would hate if the joke was on him and reinvent himself before his death in another person, twist someone else so badly that they become him, and ultimately have that joker kill bruce, because he's no longer batman, the ultimate punchline. i know its a stretch.

wow deep

 

[Dark Victory]

This arc is absolutely crazy. Thank god it's almost over, none of this is making any sense to me still.

Wikipedia helps t:

Also, even though I've hated Morrisons whole run, the last two issues were great, pretty brutal too(Tony Daniel draws a CRrRrRaZzZzZzAaAaAaYyYyYy Joker!). I have no idea what could happen in the next issue cause...well...it's Morrison, but I'm sure it will all make sense hopefully. It was awesome to see The Joker

Spoiler

go on a killing spree cutting up the Le Bosso's face(can't wait to see what he did!) and getting rid of El Sombrero and his henchmen. Didn't really get the whole part with Bruce laughing. Is he going insane? We'll find out next issue. It was obvious though that Jezebel was The Black Glove or was working with Dr. Hurt all along(but we all knew that even back in April).

 

[Saint]

i believe Hurt being the Devil was implied in the issue where the third Batman tortures Bruce. Towards the end of the issue, i think.

Yes, the third Batman did keep rambling about The Devil, didn't he? It fits, when you think about it: a great deception (the stuff about the Waynes), he organizes games of good and evil, red and black...

 

[Dark Victory]

Some readers on the DC message boards have speculated that Doctor Hurt is none other than The Devil himself. I agree that the current issue has quite a bit of demonic imagery, e.g., Joker's forked tongue, the red and black, Hurt referring to Joker as his "good and faithful servant", etc. Not sure what to make of all that and I'm still confused as all hell, no pun intended.
Others on the board think Batman killed Joker and will now be taking his place as the clown prince of crime. How is the Joker walking around with a bullet in his head anyhow??

Hurm. Must investigate further.

 

[jackshea]

i Think he just believes himself to be the devil, maybe he was the first replacement batman, he is in that issue wherebruce has all those crazy visions after his heart attack, prominently in the isolation chamber scene, maybe he wants to be batman, that's why he hates him.

 

[CrimsonMist]

i Think he just believes himself to be the devil, maybe he was the first replacement batman, he is in that issue wherebruce has all those crazy visions after his heart attack, prominently in the isolation chamber scene, maybe he wants to be batman, that's why he hates him.

That might be it though. Hurt is the devil, and the idea is so nonsensical that no one will buy it, until it's revealed as true. Could work, but not for me, especially if i've just figured it out.

But knowing Morrison, he'll throw a curve ball at us with the last issue. Atleast i hope so. As some other posters have said, Jezebel Jet's reveal as a villain wasn't a shock at all. RIP is riding on Hurt's identity right now.

 

[Two-Face=Badass]

Yeah Plot Device, er, I mean Jezebel was just another example of Morrison's hack writing for me. Seriously, having just read Batman and son, and the Resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul, his terrible cliches become obvious.

 

[Lemenbolle]

Wikipedia helps t:

Also, even though I've hated Morrisons whole run, the last two issues were great, pretty brutal too(Tony Daniel draws a CRrRrRaZzZzZzAaAaAaYyYyYy Joker!). I have no idea what could happen in the next issue cause...well...it's Morrison, but I'm sure it will all make sense hopefully. It was awesome to see The Joker

Spoiler

go on a killing spree cutting up the Le Bosso's face(can't wait to see what he did!) and getting rid of El Sombrero and his henchmen. Didn't really get the whole part with Bruce laughing. Is he going insane? We'll find out next issue. It was obvious though that Jezebel was The Black Glove or was working with Dr. Hurt all along(but we all knew that even back in April).

By the last two issues, you means the #679 and #680?

btw, I found this website, maybe someone is interested: http://tonydaniel.blogspot.com/

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Jezebel Jet is a ridiculous character. I'm sorry, but it has to be said. What kind of name is that anyway? Noone names their kid Jezebel! That's almost as bad as Harlot!! What's worse is the fact that Bruce hardly knows the woman and is completely smitten with her. I know that can happen, but the whole relationship just feels too rushed, IMHO. JJ is frankly too poorly developed. Even her race is ambiguous. She looks Caucasian with long straight red hair, but has very dark skin. Is she supposed to be of Indian or Latin American origin? Maybe even Black (in the same vein as other racially ambiguous looking characters, such as Storm)? Not really an issue for me, but I'll admit that I find it somewhat distracting - not knowing. And we truly DO know nothing about Jezebel Jet, yet all of a sudden, she's front and center in Batman's world. Where is she from again? I forget. Is it a real nation or another Morrison fabrication? With a name like Jezebel Jet, maybe the shocking revelation will be that she's actually a pornstar from another dimension with a fetish for black and red!

No, I'm not serious.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Yeah Plot Device, er, I mean Jezebel was just another example of Morrison's hack writing for me. Seriously, having just read Batman and son, and the Resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul, his terrible cliches become obvious.

Ugh. "Plot Device" is right! This whole arc makes no sense and yet it's got me HOOKED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here's hoping it's not another "One More Day".

 

[Quantum39]

The last issue was a real turnaround for me. Up until now I hated the story, but Morrison's handling of the action and The Joker's characterization really sold me that the story is going somewhere interesting.

 

[OSM]

I just picked up the latest issue.

Jezebel Jet as a villain was no surprise, but those pages of Batman and the Joker were INSANE. This is really starting to make more sense now, and I agree, this whole arc rides on Doctor Hurt's true identity.

I can see what Morrison meant by the Dark Knight never being the same again.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

The last issue was a real turnaround for me. Up until now I hated the story, but Morrison's handling of the action and The Joker's characterization really sold me that the story is going somewhere interesting.

I agree. Can't wait to see what happens next! And surprisingly, it hasn't leaked... or HAS IT?

 

[Motown Marvel]

Jezebel Jet is a ridiculous character. I'm sorry, but it has to be said. What kind of name is that anyway? Noone names their kid Jezebel! That's almost as bad as Harlot!! What's worse is the fact that Bruce hardly knows the woman and is completely smitten with her. I know that can happen, but the whole relationship just feels too rushed, IMHO. JJ is frankly too poorly developed. Even her race is ambiguous. She looks Caucasian with long straight red hair, but has very dark skin. Is she supposed to be of Indian or Latin American origin? Maybe even Black (in the same vein as other racially ambiguous looking characters, such as Storm)? Not really an issue for me, but I'll admit that I find it somewhat distracting - not knowing. And we truly DO know nothing about Jezebel Jet, yet all of a sudden, she's front and center in Batman's world. Where is she from again? I forget. Is it a real nation or another Morrison fabrication? With a name like Jezebel Jet, maybe the shocking revelation will be that she's actually a pornstar from another dimension with a fetish for black and red!

No, I'm not serious.

i think your obsessive concerns over jezebel shouldnt be an issue. it's clear that her character is integral to the story, and her being in the forefront of bruce's life is just as necessary to the story. i dont think thats too much to accept, for the sake of the story. and having how she got there to be explained would probably be a long and boring story that i'd rather not read.

as for your remark on who names their kid jezebel, let me tell you a story, and its honest to god true:

my mother used to work in labor and delivery. and one day she delivers a baby. afterwards, a doctor mentions that the baby just passed meconium. upon hearing this, the mother of the newborn says, "ohh, meconium, i like the sound of that, that's what i want to name my baby, it sounds so pretty. meconium." my mother proceeded to explain to her that meconium is what a newborn's first bowel movement is called, and its usually green...it pretty much means green s#!t. but the mother didnt care. she liked the sound of it, and there is a kid out there right now with the name meconium....green s#!t.

either way, i think morrison came up with the name as influenced by bond women. morrison mentioned in interviews that he wanted to take batman back to his james bond ways as seen in 70's batman comics.