Comics Big Time begins...Official Thread

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How could it be his twin brother. I thought his twin brother Daniel was Bald?

Yes Daniel was bald. I assume that if Roderick did in fact switch places with his brother, it must have been between the time Hobgoblin was speaking with Kingpin and when Hobby showed up at the OsCorp site. But like I said before, Hobgoblin tore the metal door off the hinges bare handed. Daniel never had super strength. Roderick did.
 
Boy, after years of complaining about this title, I am really enjoying this arc!

It was fun that what saved Spidey from the Sonic Scream/Laughing was that particular Lady GaGa song.

Like others, I never followed Philip outside his Green Goblin mini and M2 Spider-Girl, so his decent into serial killer seems a bit off, but I'm going with it.

Only minor complaint (and again it's minor, not as bad as the previous MJ scene) was the Pete, MJ, & Carlie scene. First after years of covering for Pete, you'd think MJ would have been a little smoother and less obvious ("yes, that's the perfectly logical explanation..."). But, I guess we have our living at Avengers Tower explanation.

Secondly, again it seems like another hitting over the head, saying, see how much better suited Carlie is than MJ for Pete, with Gobbldeegloop MJ Would Never Understand and Fashion Reference Neither Pete Or Carlie Would Know.

Not to mention it saves Slott from actually coming up with said
Gobbldeegloop. :cwink:
 
My Thoughts on Amazing Spider-Man #650:

With the third part of “Big Time” by Dan Slott and Humberto Ramos, we once again get a well-constructed story, but there are a some a few more noticeable snags this time around. Continuing off from the previous issue's cliffhanger, the new Hobgoblin (Phil Urich) steals the artificial Vibranium (known as Reverbium) from Horizon Labs, and it's up to Spider-Man, with the help of the Black Cat and a brand-spanking new suit, to try and get it back.

Much of the action involves Spider-Man and the Hobgoblin occurs within the opening pages, while the rest of issue is setting things up for part four, and that tends to slow the pace down quite a bit. Twice, Slott makes musical references, including, I think, having Peter sing a song from the Spider-Man: Turn Off the Dark musical of all things. The new character introduced from last issue, Bella Fishbach, is the one who saves Spidey via Lady Gaga’s “Bad Romance” and she also gets a recap page, making me think she's being established as yet another possible love interest for Peter, and a glasses-wearing sexy nerd girl like Carlie at that. Talk about redundancy, but at least Bella shows more personality.

Humberto Ramos’ artwork is still as dynamic as ever, even when it’s just characters talking. This issue, however, appears to have some panels where his tendency for exaggerating facial features and builds on characters were distracting. There are moments in which the perspective appears off, and the character’s body appear very out of proportion, particular in the opening fight sequence between Spidey and the new Hobgoblin. It makes me wonder if Ramos might have been rushed to complete the issue, but even so, it’s still decent enough for those readers who may like his “manga-influenced” style.

The previous two issues spent some time showing how "ideal" Peter new job at Horizon Labs is; now, however, a couple of possible dilemmas may have started to surface. First, the fact that Peter’s job is staffed with geniuses (and there's a scene which shows that one of the new characters, Sajani, may actually be even smarter than Peter) makes him more on guard about protecting his secret identity. Second that Max Modell can access his private lab with an emergency override command, which leads to a rather amusing scene where Peter gets a reputation for doing his best work “in the buff.” And third, the staff are not allowed to make anything that can be considered to be a weapon. It’s that later which I suspect will give Peter the greater problem later on, especially is one of his co-workers begins to suspect that Peter is supplying “Spider-Man” with new equipment from their labs. As right now, his new job still seems way too conveniently set-up to help him as Spider-Man without any of the hassle, so it would be great if any of what is being teased here escalated.

Speaking of his secret identity, there are several moments in which Peter has some close calls and I can’t help but ask if Slott has completely forgotten about the psychic blindspot--which Slott himself introduced no less--that's supposed to prevent people from figuring out Peter and Spidey are one and the same no matter how solid the evidence? Not that I would be upset about this being gone, but it would be nice if the story would explain whether it was still “up and running” or not.

Slott also continues to further explore the Black Cat being Spidey's sexy crime-fighting partner, much-welcome change compared to their "friend with benefits" status during Brand New Day. Certainly, Ramos appears to have fun--perhaps too much--in drawing Felicia in suggestive poses for the obligatory "fan-service." (Although, in regards to one scene where she's taking a milk bath, it certainly would be much more sexy and less ridiculous if her pet cats weren't also drinking the same milk she happens to be bathing in. YUCK!).

We also get to see Phil Urich get used to his role as the new Hobgoblin, after last issue's controversial death of the original. And as before, Slott underscores the notion that Phil is an insane, evil version of Peter, this time by having the Hobgoblin be as much of a sarcastic wise-cracker as Spidey, and especially when Phil has taken video footage of himself as the Hobgoblin to sell to the Daily Bugle in an attempt to impress Norah. The scene in which the Hobgoblin gets hired by the Kingpin is well done after his robbery is well done, and certainly one does get the scene that Phil how devious Phil is. The fact that we know he's the Hobgoblin actual make his scenes with at the Bugle that much more creepy. However, Phil does come across a bit too much like a carbon-copy of the Joker at times, especially with his gallows humor and tendency to laugh manically. Also, why would his Uncle, Ben Urich, not ask his nephew just what kind of job he has in order to afford new suits?

There’s also a scene where both Mary Jane and Carlie (sporting yet another new hairdo) unrepentantly show up at Peter's work, which, because of the obvious awkwardness Peter feels, is initially amusing--especially given that MJ knows Peter is Spider-Man while Carlie doesn‘t. However, once Peter and Carlie start talking in scientific terms that the word balloons literally tell us are "something MJ wouldn't understand" that it then comes across as Slott attempting to prop Carlie up by demeaning MJ as a character (even though MJ does get the last laugh with a similar narrative technique about meeting a fashion designer neither “Pete or Carlie have ever heard of.”). Perhaps it was Slott way of not actually wanting to make-up pseudo-scientific jargon and turning a joke out of it, but if the attempt was to show that Carlie, because she can converse on Peter’s level, is a more suitable girlfriend than MJ used to and ever could be, it instead makes Peter and Carlie look like a pair of insufferable bores. And the fact that the scene does spend enough time reminding us of Peter and MJ’s prior relationship together (via referencing them living together at Avengers Tower), it results in Peter having better chemistry when it comes to his ex than he does with his current girlfriend.

As for the new costume, while it certainly looks like an uninspired cross between the black costume and Marvel's attempt at cashing in on Tron: Legacy, the abilities of the suit are actually very cool--it's a Stealth suit which bends both light and sound, thus not only making Spidey invisible, but utterly silent and immune to sonic attacks. It's definitely a useful costume Spidey could have, so useful, in fact, that one immediately wonders why Spidey wouldn't want to wear something like this all the time. Obviously, there has to be some catch involved with this suit that will force Peter to have to go back to his classic red-and-blues again, especially since, apparently, he'll just be wearing the costume for this arc.

Finally, Slott has a back-up feature penciled by Neil Edwards that serves both update Mac Gargan’s deteriorating condition at the Raft and to set-up his eventual return as the Scorpion. It also reveals that the mysterious armored character who was stalking the Jameson family from issue #648 was in fact Alistair Smythe in a new cybernetic body, and how he makes his entrance in this story is certainly dramatic. Also, Edward’s pencils, while certainly excellent, still have a kind of stiffness and blandness to them, the exception being a spectacular splash-page where Smythe takes out the Raft guards and Mach-5. S So while the back-up is appropriately darker than the main story and has a good usage of flashbacks, it definitely is more of a prologue for the upcoming story after “Big Time,” and I wonder if it would have been better served had it appeared in the next issue rather than this one.

With his third issue in as the main writer for Amazing Spider-Man, Slott is certainly bringing a much welcomed focus and sense of fun into Spidey’s world and exploring some intriguing avenues. Even so, there are times in which there is a heavy-handedness and, while this issue is more streamlined that the previous two, the sense that there’s too much on the plate. Still, this is shaping up to be a pretty-decent story and the showdown between Spidey, Black Cat, and the new Hobgoblin will hopefully be an exciting one.

http://stillanerd.livejournal.com/8673.html
 
Nice review as always man. I must say, I'm loving the new suit. I find it a welcome addition to the classics. :)
 
Nice review as always man. I must say, I'm loving the new suit. I find it a welcome addition to the classics. :)

Thanks. And yeah, idea of Peter having [blackout]a Stealth suit[/blackout] is a great idea. He also had a similar one in [blackout]the much-panned Spider-Man Unlimited[/blackout] but at least, since this is in canon, the new one "counts."
 
You know, stillanerd, I missed the idea that Phil is a psychotic version of Pete! I was just thinking how Ramos was making Phil look a little too much like Pete it was a little confusing. Only his hair was tipping me off (and even that was a bit similar, and for some reason, I thought Phil had blonde hair).

Anyway, now it makes senes, along with wise cracks and filming himself to sell to the Bugle. Not to mention both have (had) an Uncle Ben!
 
I'll start with story 2, it deserves my attention more:

  • Anyone here recalls Dr. Eli Folsom? I think I saw him in a story before, don't remember what
  • Looking at how the boy was with his father, I didn't think of Smythe, not the one who in his first appearance brings the mention of his father neglecting him for his work
  • This is the second bionic form Alistair gives himself, only this one is better, I like the armor much more than I did the naked Greek Mythology creature he looked like in the 90s
  • I'm very excited to see what comes after this story
  • I wish the artist of that story becomes a regular for ASM if he isn't
As for story 1:

  • Saved by Lady Gaga is funny, I don't like her music, but I don't find it bad enough to like the noise from Hobgoblin more
  • The "naked in his private lab" scene is awkward, but hilarious, the funniest thing here
  • Phil Urich breaking in Kingpin's tower is much more respecting for the character than the way he was treated in Spider-Girl, letting Crazy 8 & Funny Face reshape his face the way they did when the Green Goblin
  • The scene of the thug with Black Cat when she received a call from Spider-Man is amusing, until the man is killed by Urich
  • Cool explaining for the suit, and it leads to the good quality of having Peter the man to destroy the reverbium
entered the building of Canis
 
You know, stillanerd, I missed the idea that Phil is a psychotic version of Pete! I was just thinking how Ramos was making Phil look a little too much like Pete it was a little confusing. Only his hair was tipping me off (and even that was a bit similar, and for some reason, I thought Phil had blonde hair).

Anyway, now it makes senes, along with wise cracks and filming himself to sell to the Bugle. Not to mention both have (had) an Uncle Ben!

And the parallels between Peter and Phil (notice their first names start with P) run deeper when you realize that the interaction between Phil, Norah Winters, and Randy Robertson is also a twist on what Stan Lee and Steve Ditko were doing with Peter, Betty Brant, and Ned Leeds. Just substitute Phil for Peter, Norah for Betty, and Randy for Ned. The difference here is that Norah is in no way interested in Phil other than as a causal acquaintance at best.
 
Now you really make me feel dumb, stillanerd! How did I miss all that?
 
And the parallels between Peter and Phil (notice their first names start with P) run deeper when you realize that the interaction between Phil, Norah Winters, and Randy Robertson is also a twist on what Stan Lee and Steve Ditko were doing with Peter, Betty Brant, and Ned Leeds. Just substitute Phil for Peter, Norah for Betty, and Randy for Ned. The difference here is that Norah is in no way interested in Phil other than as a causal acquaintance at best.

Huh...yeah, I missed all of that. Good observations.
 
Both Peter and Phil have Uncle Bens, too. :)
 
Nice catch with Dr. Folsome, br_ss... I did start to make some parallels the moment Phil showed up at the Bugle with footage of himself... luckily, we have stillanerd to fill in the blanks for the rest of us... :up:

:yay:
 
Now you really make me feel dumb, stillanerd! How did I miss all that?

Don't feel bad, I didn't catch on it at first, either. Heck, I didn't notice that Peter and Phil actually look alike artistically and how that may be intentional until you pointed it out. :yay:

Huh...yeah, I missed all of that. Good observations.

Nice catch with Dr. Folsome, br_ss... I did start to make some parallels the moment Phil showed up at the Bugle with footage of himself... luckily, we have stillanerd to fill in the blanks for the rest of us... :up:

:yay:

Thanks, guys.
 
This is the only Dr. Folsom(e) that i can remember. Though i could've sworn there was mention of this one recently....
Spider-Man075-02-03.jpg
Probably this one
Thank you Mr. Morrison
 
With regards to the scene between Peter, Mary Jane, and Carlie at Horizon Labs, and after quite a bit of discussion about it over at Scans Daily in TWO separate threads, it appears there may in fact be A LOT of subtext going on in those particular panels which might have been initially overlooked. Granted, this is probably a combination of wishful thinking, over-reading, and playing devil's advocate on my part (and I'm not sure whether this is worthy of being it's own thread) but looking at the scene again, here's what I'm now picking up and which has been brought to may attention. First, here are the two panels in question:

ASM_650_024.jpg

ASM_650_025.jpg


1. Now both Mary Jane and Carlie have shown up at Peter's new job with lunch for him, which Peter finds VERY awkward. When he asks what they're really doing there, notice that Carlie says that she's primarily there because she's investigating the "superhuman crime scene" as part of her job. Mary Jane, on the other hand, is there primarily because she heard about the Hobgoblin's attack and, due to the fact that she's knows Peter is Spider-Man, was worried about him. See how, in the first panel, Carlie is giving MJ a sideways, apprehensive glance while MJ looks completely relaxed and at ease? Then, in the next panel, once MJ tells Peter that she wanted to see if Peter was okay, Carlie is suddenly hugging Peter like there's no tomorrow, almost as if she's choking Peter. It's as if she's saying "Hey, I care about Peter, too!" It gives the impression that Carlie's job as CSI investigator is the most important thing in her life and that her relationship with Peter is an afterthought until it appears to be threatened by a rival. And of course, MJ is taking cues from Peter and coming with a logical reason for being there, showing that they are still on each other's wavelength.

2. The food both Carlie and MJ have brought for Peter could be symbolic of both women. Carlie has given Peter the burger, which could be described as "meaty," which is also defined as "full of substance or interest." MJ brought Peter doughnuts, which can be described as being "sweet" and even "savory." And Peter is attempting to eat both of these meals at the same time while profusely sweating. It suggests that he's trying to please both of these women and, subconsciously, is still undecided between them, even though he is no longer with MJ and is currently dating Carlie.

3. When he's bragging about his new job, it's Peter himself who accidentally lets it slip that he worked for Tony Stark, which naturally piques Carlie's interest. And Peter, realizing he's risking exposing his secret identity, can't really figure out a good enough excuse...until Mary Jane comes in for the save. Also, her saying "That's the perfectly logical reason we lived at Stark Tower" is not only an attempt at deflecting Carlie's suspicions, but is also a rebuke towards Peter, as if to say "That's how should explain it in the future, tiger." And notice Carlie's facial expression when she says "With supermodel girlfriends?" She's clearly pissed. No wonder Peter is doing a facepalm.

4. Then comes the moment in which we get the "blah blah blah (something MJ wouldn't understand)" dialogue between Peter and Carlie. Now Peter, of course, has a history of lapsing into scientific and technical jargon whenever he gets excited about something, which, given how long MJ has known Peter, is something she'd be used to. However, in light of the fact that Carlie has just been previously reminded that Peter and MJ used to be a couple, her conversing in equally scientific and technical jargon with Peter could be her passive-aggressive and spiteful way of telling MJ, "You may be a glamorous supermodel and more attractive than me, but I can better relate to Peter than you ever could." And MJ, when she tells them she has to go see a "(fashion celebrity Pete and Carlie never heard of)" may be indirectly saying to Carlie "If you're trying to make me look stupid, well two can play at that game, Missy." And of course Peter, being the nice but clueless guy that he is, promises MJ he'll record her program in spite of never hearing of the guy she'll be interviewing, while Carlie is probably all too happy to see MJ finally leave.

So, in light of this, this could be Slott's way of setting up another "Betty and Veronica" that poor Peter often finds himself getting stuck in, with Carlie as the "Betty," MJ as the "Veronica." Or would it actually be the other way around?
 
ASM #651 was a pretty good read... I'm really digging all the parallel's between Peter & Phil... Slott's off to a GREAT start... :up:

:yay:
 
Apparently his sanity began to degrade over in Runaways or whatever it was he was in. Which makes sense to me given his strength was derived originally from bathing in a new goblin juice by accident, and it being triggered by the mask (which I'm assuming was Harry's way of trying to keep the goblin serum stable or something)
 
Yes. I love when a good character becomes evil for no reason. :huh:

See Chris Moore's answer... and add to the fact that he's doing this to impress a girl... how many stupid things have you seen guys do in order to impress chicks? I've seen a guy fall to his death trying to do a handstand on a handrail on the second floor of a mall because he was trying to impress his girlfriend... :csad:

And the reality is that Phil is becoming what Peter Parker might have become if he hadn't been hit with guilt ridden tragedy... we saw prior to Uncle Ben's death how Peter "twisted" (for lack of a better word) was becoming, and if Uncle Ben hadn't been killed, he might have easily fallen to the side that Phil has... hence, the nice parallels...

Read that before last page where Phil is at the Bugle... it almost reads like an old school Peter Parker at the Bugle (with twisted words)... even the half Phil/Half HobGoblin face is a classic reminder...

I think Slott's going to bring great things to Phil Urich... a nearly forgotten character that certainly needed a boost.

:yay:
 
Also, I like how for Pete, with power comes responsibility. For Phil, with responsibility comes power!

EDIT: Sorry TMOB, just re-read your post and saw you made reference to it.


Quick question, as I never read Runaways, that takes place in the current 616? Another superhero team? Did Phil runaround as a hero goblin in that (like he did in his mini-series and M2's Spider-Girl)?
 
With regards to the scene between Peter, Mary Jane, and Carlie at Horizon Labs, and after quite a bit of discussion about it over at Scans Daily in TWO separate threads, it appears there may in fact be A LOT of subtext going on in those particular panels which might have been initially overlooked. Granted, this is probably a combination of wishful thinking, over-reading, and playing devil's advocate on my part (and I'm not sure whether this is worthy of being it's own thread) but looking at the scene again, here's what I'm now picking up and which has been brought to may attention. First, here are the two panels in question:

ASM_650_024.jpg

ASM_650_025.jpg


1. Now both Mary Jane and Carlie have shown up at Peter's new job with lunch for him, which Peter finds VERY awkward. When he asks what they're really doing there, notice that Carlie says that she's primarily there because she's investigating the "superhuman crime scene" as part of her job. Mary Jane, on the other hand, is there primarily because she heard about the Hobgoblin's attack and, due to the fact that she's knows Peter is Spider-Man, was worried about him. See how, in the first panel, Carlie is giving MJ a sideways, apprehensive glance while MJ looks completely relaxed and at ease? Then, in the next panel, once MJ tells Peter that she wanted to see if Peter was okay, Carlie is suddenly hugging Peter like there's no tomorrow, almost as if she's choking Peter. It's as if she's saying "Hey, I care about Peter, too!" It gives the impression that Carlie's job as CSI investigator is the most important thing in her life and that her relationship with Peter is an afterthought until it appears to be threatened by a rival. And of course, MJ is taking cues from Peter and coming with a logical reason for being there, showing that they are still on each other's wavelength.

2. The food both Carlie and MJ have brought for Peter could be symbolic of both women. Carlie has given Peter the burger, which could be described as "meaty," which is also defined as "full of substance or interest." MJ brought Peter doughnuts, which can be described as being "sweet" and even "savory." And Peter is attempting to eat both of these meals at the same time while profusely sweating. It suggests that he's trying to please both of these women and, subconsciously, is still undecided between them, even though he is no longer with MJ and is currently dating Carlie.

3. When he's bragging about his new job, it's Peter himself who accidentally lets it slip that he worked for Tony Stark, which naturally piques Carlie's interest. And Peter, realizing he's risking exposing his secret identity, can't really figure out a good enough excuse...until Mary Jane comes in for the save. Also, her saying "That's the perfectly logical reason we lived at Stark Tower" is not only an attempt at deflecting Carlie's suspicions, but is also a rebuke towards Peter, as if to say "That's how should explain it in the future, tiger." And notice Carlie's facial expression when she says "With supermodel girlfriends?" She's clearly pissed. No wonder Peter is doing a facepalm.

4. Then comes the moment in which we get the "blah blah blah (something MJ wouldn't understand)" dialogue between Peter and Carlie. Now Peter, of course, has a history of lapsing into scientific and technical jargon whenever he gets excited about something, which, given how long MJ has known Peter, is something she'd be used to. However, in light of the fact that Carlie has just been previously reminded that Peter and MJ used to be a couple, her conversing in equally scientific and technical jargon with Peter could be her passive-aggressive and spiteful way of telling MJ, "You may be a glamorous supermodel and more attractive than me, but I can better relate to Peter than you ever could." And MJ, when she tells them she has to go see a "(fashion celebrity Pete and Carlie never heard of)" may be indirectly saying to Carlie "If you're trying to make me look stupid, well two can play at that game, Missy." And of course Peter, being the nice but clueless guy that he is, promises MJ he'll record her program in spite of never hearing of the guy she'll be interviewing, while Carlie is probably all too happy to see MJ finally leave.

So, in light of this, this could be Slott's way of setting up another "Betty and Veronica" that poor Peter often finds himself getting stuck in, with Carlie as the "Betty," MJ as the "Veronica." Or would it actually be the other way around?

Fantastic post, man. I hadn't seen the full pages yet, so getting proper context and such a thoughtful description with it was very redeeming. :up:
 
Also, I like how for Pete, with power comes responsibility. For Phil, with responsibility comes power!

EDIT: Sorry TMOB, just re-read your post and saw you made reference to it.


Quick question, as I never read Runaways, that takes place in the current 616? Another superhero team? Did Phil runaround as a hero goblin in that (like he did in his mini-series and M2's Spider-Girl)?

The last I saw of Phil was actually in a superhero support group in a series called Loners. The concept was pretty funny, b-list heroes sitting in folding chairs supporting each other in their "hero" addictions. Here's a wuick rundown from wiki...

wiki said:
He later formed a superhero self-help group in order to prevent teenagers from becoming superheroes and aiding young former ones. After a mental meltdown, Phil attacked Mickey Musashi (Turbo) and Chris Powell (Darkhawk), stealing the Darkhawk amulet and giving in to his psychosis. Afterwards, Phil was depowered, but escaped with Hollow.

I honestly don't remember how it ended, it seemed to kind of peter out. But I do vaguely recall Phil kinda turning to the dark side. So I guess this has been just a progression form that.


My only beef upon reading it initially, was that I wished he wouldn't have killed Hobby. Because that's kinda the point of no return(arguably). And I guess I would have liked it to be a possibility for him to turn back. But, I guess that's Dan's way of saying, "Nope, he's in the bad guy column. No grey."

Frankly, I can live with that. Phil was a character that was going nowhere fast. Now he has renewed life. And I'd much rather an awesome bad guy than a good guy in limbo eternally.
 
I'd hate to be Randy Robertson these days.... yikes... :wow: :wow: :wow:
 
Thanks for the info, 'clones!

Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about Phil's change, but now you provided some backstory. I liked him as a nice guy in his series & in Spider-Girl, but I was not totally invested in the character. But, this looks like it could be interesting as another "dark mirror" of Pete.

I'll say one thing, I think Phil has better taste (Norah) than Pete (Carlie).
 

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