Bought/Thought May 21st, 2008

Gildea agreed with Dread....twice? Jesus.

Truth is stranger than fiction. ;)

The Skrulls in Disassembled would seem to disprove this theory.

Artist choice. You also have to recall, not soon after Disassembled, Finch drew in the wrong figures for NA #2. It wasn't like Bendis was telling him EVERY figure to draw in these panels. And the Avengers had battled Skrulls before.
 
He's clearly been setting up something at least as long as Fury's disappearance. Dunno if it was exactly this but eh, whatevs.

I mean my Bendis-hating credentials are second to no man's but I'll grant as that some sort of long-term thought process was clearly at play.

Sentry as he stands now is a waste of a character. He is Emo Defined and I would rather trade him for Spidercide. Of course, he is being written by a writer who continues to believe that after 120 issues, a storyline where USM is captured, unmasked, humiliated, and is in need of rescue is "innovative".

Yeah, it can't be too huge of a shock that a writer who continually play Spider-Man as all of the above would get off on having a Superman he can make shout "Up, Up, and Away!" and then trip over himself, curl up into the fetal position and suck his thumb while the heroes win due to luck and the even greater incompetence of their enemies.
 
The Skrulls in Disassembled would seem to disprove this theory.
What? The Avengers fought against dozens of their old villains during Disassembled. To pick any one of them out as some kind of planning would be insanity. The Kree also appeared in Disassembled, so does that mean Bendis was planning an invasion by the Kree way back then?
 
What? The Avengers fought against dozens of their old villains during Disassembled. To pick any one of them out as some kind of planning would be insanity. The Kree also appeared in Disassembled, so does that mean Bendis was planning an invasion by the Kree way back then?

Only one or two skrulls showed up in Disassembled, and they were just there in the middle the Kree soldiers.

Of course, very few people will believe that Bendis has been planning this for years, because no one on SHH ever gives Bendis that kind of credit. :cwink:
 
At the very least, you could claim McDuffie altering the team roster and using Gravity was an attempt to spice things up.

Well I like Mcduffie, but his stuff in FF toward the end was horrible. The Roster shake up seemed botched and token.

The stories had a rushed and jumbled feel. And the Gravity story was one of the worst arcs IMO in the past 2 years in any comic.

Understanding that the Gravity as Captain Marvel "thing" never got off the ground, it didnt have to be so rushed and sloppy. This is Marvel comics, and FF has been a cornerstone of why they are tops. FF deserves better.

I'm not sure why a talent like Mcduffie delivered such a mess. Maybe he was peeved becuase of the Captain Marvel "thing" with gravity was taken away by the powers that be, maybe he just had his eye on the door. But i really can't find much commendation in his attempt to "spice" things up when it seemed so half ass.

At any rate i stopped buying FF after that. Partly becuase I dislike Millar with a passion and am too narrow minded to even give him a chance, and partly becuase i was dissapointed with that Gravity and T'challa deal.
 
Only one or two skrulls showed up in Disassembled, and they were just there in the middle the Kree soldiers.

Of course, very few people will believe that Bendis has been planning this for years, because no one on SHH ever gives Bendis that kind of credit. :cwink:
I don't understand how that disproves my point. There were less Skrulls than there were other things, so...that makes it more likely that Bendis planned to use them?

What?
 
I thought Blaze offered Ketch the benefit of his experience during their "SPIRITS OF VENGEANCE" days.
They were more partners than mentor/sidekick. I'm sure Blaze's experience came in handy, but by the time Blaze re-entered the GR series, Ketch had plenty of his own experience as Ghost Rider.
Except Skrull-Vision is still in the Savage Land.
Is he? If he can duplicate the powers of the Sentry, he could be anywhere in seconds, and the count of who's in the Savage Land seems to change every other issue.
 
Well can you prove that Finch drew a bunch of random Skrulls in a menagerie of Avengers villains because Bendis planned a Skrulls event three years in advance?
 
In your defense, it's funner there.

Hey, Firefox isn't telling me funner isn't a word. Total score!
 
Weren't the Skrulls in Avengers: Disassembled there because Wanda was reliving the Kree/Skrull War. I mean, come on. One does not go with the other, unless Wanda is working with the Skrulls which would be stupid and illogical. But this is Bendis.
 
Pssh. **** you with your logic, you just never give Bendis any credit.
 
Speaking of Avengers: Disassembled, whatever happened to that chick Captain Britain?
 
I dunno, but my avatar is totally battling yours.

Didn't Austen create her, or something?
 
Austen did create her, and I think she changed her name to Lionheart and joined Albion's band of evil bastards in the last arc of New Excalibur. I don't know what happened to her, though.
 
I don't understand how that disproves my point. There were less Skrulls than there were other things, so...that makes it more likely that Bendis planned to use them?

What?

Because if there were a bunch of Skrulls and a bunch of Kree, your theory would make sense. But the fact that a single random Skrull or two showed up points more to the theory of a blown cover.
 
Because if there were a bunch of Skrulls and a bunch of Kree, your theory would make sense. But the fact that a single random Skrull or two showed up points more to the theory of a blown cover.

So Jigsaw actually broke Spider-Man's arm?
 
Because if there were a bunch of Skrulls and a bunch of Kree, your theory would make sense. But the fact that a single random Skrull or two showed up points more to the theory of a blown cover.
It would, if the fact that a few Skrulls showing up in those panels at that moment of the story was at all unusual in any way. But...it wasn't. If you didn't know about Secret Invasion, you could read through that entire scene without thinking anything was out of the ordinary, narratively speaking...which we all did. Wanda was summoning past villains, which included Skrulls; it would have been weird if there weren't Skrulls. Skrulls at that point in time were in fact more of a sidenote than any real threat anyway, so I actually think it would have felt more awkward if they were in large numbers hogging up space.

So we have a scene that makes perfect sense within the context of the story with nothing from the original story that would suggest anything else. I mean, by very definition that's not actually planning or foreshadowing anything; to do that, the scene would have to be able to stand out in any way without Hindsight Vision. Of course Bendis could write a scene now that claims those Skrulls back then were real Skrulls but, hell, that's a retcon.
 
Well I like Mcduffie, but his stuff in FF toward the end was horrible. The Roster shake up seemed botched and token.

The stories had a rushed and jumbled feel. And the Gravity story was one of the worst arcs IMO in the past 2 years in any comic.

Understanding that the Gravity as Captain Marvel "thing" never got off the ground, it didnt have to be so rushed and sloppy. This is Marvel comics, and FF has been a cornerstone of why they are tops. FF deserves better.

I'm not sure why a talent like Mcduffie delivered such a mess. Maybe he was peeved becuase of the Captain Marvel "thing" with gravity was taken away by the powers that be, maybe he just had his eye on the door. But i really can't find much commendation in his attempt to "spice" things up when it seemed so half ass.

At any rate i stopped buying FF after that. Partly becuase I dislike Millar with a passion and am too narrow minded to even give him a chance, and partly becuase i was dissapointed with that Gravity and T'challa deal.

To be fair, Gravity was not entirely his fault. He had the go-ahead from the editors to get the ball rolling on Gravity as the new Capt. Marvel in BEYOND!. The editors then switched gears, presumably because they knew they would get more buzz by hinting to revive THE Mar-Vell, and they knew it would amp up SI in the end. So, this left McDuffie with two options. He could have left Gravity dead in BEYOND! and went, "Hey, not my problem" like many writers would have, and passed the buck to whoever wanted to use Greg next. Instead, he used the next ongoing he was immediately on to address the issue and basically get Gravity back to about the status quo he was before BEYOND!. He took responsibility and I respected that. Plus, it got Gravity some cosmic experience (which is a plus for a new hero) and about the only thing that irked me is McDuffie never had Gravity at least CALL his poor girlfriend in NY to let her know he was alive. She knew he was a hero and went to his funeral (which McDuffie wrote in BEYOND! #6). That to me seemed OOC.

To me, McDuffie's run on FF was like the Gerald Ford presidency after Nixon and before Carter; a "middle of the road" run to get things to some state of normalcy. FF had been mired in CW with their characterizations divided. Reed was a Nazi witch-doctor who Sue no longer respected. Thing abstained in France. Johnny was his usual ****** self. They needed some run that allowed things to go back to basics. McDuffie was that run. Yeah, T'Challa and Storm was a stunt, but FF has altered their rosters before for longer periods, so I let it slip. The run was at least lighter hearted. I agree it wasn't anything too meaningful; aside for the Gravity stuff, I forgot half of it.

Millar & Hitch are on a better run so far; even with their "U.S. flag draped robot overreacts to threats and seems to 'pre-emptive strike' other nations" schtick doesn't come off as half as cynical as the political stuff in ULTIMATES. But their sales are sagging quickly and that means fixing this franchise may be a near impossible task. Or, Millar & Hitch don't have the pull they used to.

Which is a totally baseless theory, unless you can provide something that proves Finch just drew one or two Skrulls for the hell of it.

Wanda was throwing in all of the Avenger's rogues, from Ultron to the Kree/Skrull War. Just because there were a few Skrulls (alongside Kree) in DISASSEMBLED doesn't mean it was planned that far back. MA #14 all but revealed that the Skrull imposters really didn't start moving pieces into place until after the New Avengers roster was finalized with Wolverine and Sentry (which would have been about 6 or so issues in) and even then they were sitting back and allowing Civil War and World War Hulk to run their courses (although if Pym has been a Skrull since that time, then he DID have a hand in CW because Pym was the one who made Clor and was cloning heroes and was the 3rd biggest face of the Pro-Reg side behind Iron Man and Reed).

Bendis has pulled this trick before. USM #100, he tried to tie things together and make it seem like he had everything planned to the minute detail since he launched the book, and it was an awkward mess. Just because you are writing your own stories doesn't mean you can't retcon yourself. It is fine for Bendis to have come up with the Skrull Invasion thing in, say, 2006, figure ways to make it work and go from there; but claiming he had it all mapped out since 2004 is, again, akin to pulling a George Lucas with Episodes 1-3. And not even Lucas could get away with that bull**** to most mainstreamers. Hence why he admits it took him "over ten years" to even come up with a script idea for INDY 4.

It is akin to some things I said about Millar; some of these writers would get better rapport if they were honest, but Bendis among many writers comes off as ridiculously smug and "smarter-than-thou". Granted, I suppose considering his success, his status as Marvel's #1 writer on their #1 ongoing, and that he has never been told "no" by an editor since about 2005, he may have a reason to be so. But that doesn't mean he could go another way. Instead he is making himself seem smarter than he is, which is too typical.

Weren't the Skrulls in Avengers: Disassembled there because Wanda was reliving the Kree/Skrull War. I mean, come on. One does not go with the other, unless Wanda is working with the Skrulls which would be stupid and illogical. But this is Bendis.

Exactly.
 
I almost picked up all that has come out that has to do with SI but it just looks like a convulted mess. I will be reading Final Crisis but only the core series.
 
It would, if the fact that a few Skrulls showing up in those panels at that moment of the story was at all unusual in any way. But...it wasn't. If you didn't know about Secret Invasion, you could read through that entire scene without thinking anything was out of the ordinary, narratively speaking...which we all did. Wanda was summoning past villains, which included Skrulls; it would have been weird if there weren't Skrulls. Skrulls at that point in time were in fact more of a sidenote than any real threat anyway, so I actually think it would have felt more awkward if they were in large numbers hogging up space.

So we have a scene that makes perfect sense within the context of the story with nothing from the original story that would suggest anything else. I mean, by very definition that's not actually planning or foreshadowing anything; to do that, the scene would have to be able to stand out in any way without Hindsight Vision. Of course Bendis could write a scene now that claims those Skrulls back then were real Skrulls but, hell, that's a retcon.

So, it's a retcon because you say that it is? There have been several unusual occurrences since the start of Bendis' run, including Reed telling Iron Man that he never sent DD to the Raft to check on the Sentry. At the time, it was unusual, but now it seems to make more sense.

At that particular point in Disassembled, the Avengers were ONLY fighting the Kree. A random Skrull or two popping up might mean something even if you don't think it does. You're acting like your opinion is fact, and that's very frustrating. Just because you think Bendis is retconning, it doesn't mean that he is.
 
So, it's a retcon because you say that it is? There have been several unusual occurrences since the start of Bendis' run, including Reed telling Iron Man that he never sent DD to the Raft to check on the Sentry. At the time, it was unusual, but now it seems to make more sense.

At that particular point in Disassembled, the Avengers were ONLY fighting the Kree. A random Skrull or two popping up might mean something even if you don't think it does. You're acting like your opinion is fact, and that's very frustrating. Just because you think Bendis is retconning, it doesn't mean that he is.

But just because you think Bendis perfectly planned this for four years, doesn't make it so. The argument works both ways. I think B-W's point was that your opinion has a higher burden of proof than his. From what was given, he has every right to think Bendis planned this later, and you may have a right to go your want, but the burden of proof is on you. Because, as he said, there were more Kree than Skrulls there. Not long after, Finch was drawing characters wrong at The Raft in NA #2. So obviously Bendis wasn't in 100% control of whoever got on panel.

From what we were given so far, The Kree & Skrulls were there in Disassembled to represent the Kree-Skrull war, via Wanda. Hell, Ultron played a larger symbolic role. In the last issue of MA, it heavily implied that the Skrulls didn't even start to manipulate stuff heavily until after the New Avengers formed and Sentry & Wolverine were officially part of the roster, which would have been before NA #12, but not before NA #6 (and even muckier since Sentry didn't take part in a slew of adventures in that book after they beat back The Void, so it could have been later). Basically, between the formation of the NA and prelude to CW. That's around 2005 or so.

Again, Bendis played this card with his CLONE SAGA in USM, especially #100 and it was obvious he was reaching. He could be repeating himself, albeit hopefully in a better way.
 

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