Cringeworthy Moments in Good Movies

[Picard Sisko]

That is exactly what they are doing here. This new trilogy is the conclusion of the skywalker story of Luke and the jumping point for the future franchise. With The stand alone characters won't be characters we already know. They will be new characters. Like Marvel had to create these characters and give them their own arcs so will ucasfilm and Disney. They will introduce nbew characters in standalone films and bring them together in big films every once in a while.

As far as Luke goes, I don't know why we would need three films to conclude his story. We don't even know if Mark Hamill is coming back to reprise his role anyway. I doubt people want to see an old Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia as the stars of the movie.

And I think you were missing my point about the spin-off films. With Marvel, the stand alone films are based off of the comic book characters who work by themselves, and also as a team in a larger story. That's how its supposed to happen. With Star Wars... it may not work.

Creating unknown characters from scratch and giving them their own movie that ties into a bigger story seems redundant. I still see it as milking a franchise.

 

[Marvolo]

As far as Luke goes, I don't know why we would need three films to conclude his story. We don't even know if Mark Hamill is coming back to reprise his role anyway. I doubt people want to see an old Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia as the stars of the movie.

And I think you were missing my point about the spin-off films. With Marvel, the stand alone films are based off of the comic book characters who work by themselves, and also as a team in a larger story. That's how its supposed to happen. With Star Wars... it may not work.

Creating unknown characters from scratch and giving them their own movie that ties into a bigger story seems redundant. I still see it as milking a franchise.

No, I get what you are saying with the stand alone films, but my question is still: Why can't it work? Every work of orignal fiction and franchise is created from scratch or taken from inspiration. And in this case there is 30+ years of notes and star wars books and comics to take from. You also seem to be forgetting that since 1977 fans have been coming up with their own ideas about star wars and their own stories they would like to tell. Some of these fans went on to become script writers and directors. These are the people that will be working on these films. This is where the ideas are coming from, Lucas, people that worked on the originals, fans of the films, people who know the canon, etc. This is the well. Don't forget Marvel had to start somewhere. All franchises are built so to think something like Star Wars which is an entire universe filled with thousands of ecosystems and lifeforms can't become a franchise is illogical. The history of the the Jedi Order alone spans 36,000+ years. There is plenty of story to tell.

And I didn't say these 3 films would all be about tying up Luke's story. Most likely he will feature in a small part at the beginning of the first film setting the stage and from their on it will be about whatever the new plot is going to be.

There is also going to be a live action tv series that has been in the plans for 5+ years that ABC is eyeing.

 

[Victarion]

I think I see where Picard is coming from.

Picard, do you mean to say that you'd want a new series in the same universe as the Star Wars (Episodes I-VI) to have it own unique name (like, say, Mandalorian Wars) indicating a new story arc in the same universe?

 

[Marvolo]

I think I see where Picard is coming from.

Picard, do you mean to say that you'd want a new series in the same universe as the Star Wars (Episodes I-VI) to have it own unique name (like, say, Mandalorian Wars) indicating a new story arc in the same universe?

This is my guess. The standalone films will not have an episode number in the title. It will either be Star Wars: Subtitle, or maybe like you suggested Mandalore Wars.

 

[Picard Sisko]

No, I get what you are saying with the stand alone films, but my question is still: Why can't it work? Every work of orignal fiction and franchise is created from scratch or taken from inspiration. And in this case there is 30+ years of notes and star wars books and comics to take from. You also seem to be forgetting that since 1977 fans have been coming up with their own ideas about star wars and their own stories they would like to tell. Some of these fans went on to become script writers and directors. These are the people that will be working on these films. This is where the ideas are coming from, Lucas, people that worked on the originals, fans of the films, people who know the canon, etc. This is the well. Don't forget Marvel had to start somewhere. All franchises are built so to think something like Star Wars which is an entyire universe filled with thousands of ecosystems and lifeforms can't become a franchise is illogical.

And I didn';t say these 3 films would all be about tying up Luke's story. Most likely he will feature in a small part at the beginning of the first film setting the stage and from their own it will be about whatever the nbew plot is going to be.

As far as novels and comic books go, those are usually considered non-canon and won't be adapted onto film.

I think the whole Jedi/Luke Skywalker story has been told. That's done. Anything else is just milking the story and playing it safe (unless its just a small segment of the film, which I doubt). I never said it COULDN't work, I just said it may not work. Marvel has source material that spans over 50 years of time, which Star Wars couldn't even compete with.

The stories have to be really fresh, and new. Something different.

 

[Picard Sisko]

I think I see where Picard is coming from.

Picard, do you mean to say that you'd want a new series in the same universe as the Star Wars (Episodes I-VI) to have it own unique name (like, say, Mandalorian Wars) indicating a new story arc in the same universe?

Yes. That is one thing I'd like for the series to do. Kind of like Prometheus was to Alien.

 

[Marvolo]

As far as novels and comic books go, those are usually considered non-canon and won't be adapted onto film.

I think the whole Jedi/Luke Skywalker story has been told. That's done. Anything else is just milking the story and playing it safe (unless its just a small segment of the film, which I doubt). I never said it COULDN't work, I just said it may not work. Marvel has source material that spans over 50 years of time, which Star Wars couldn't even compete with.

The stories have to be really fresh, and new. Something different.

Yes. That is one thing I'd like for the series to do. Kind of like Prometheus was to Alien.

I don't think me and you are communicating clearly. What you are saying you want is what Disney has planned for Star Wars. The Skywalker Luke story is finished. He will have a cameo at most in Episode 7 because he is the head of the Order. The standalone films wont be skywalkler films. They will be bounty hunter films, new jedi characters, smugglers or something like that. And as for the Jedi Order despite what the 6 films might have had you think the Jedi Order is much bigger than just the Skywalker family and has been through 36,000+ years of history that far preceded their arrival to Coruscant. The Jedi Order and The force play a big part in this galaxy. It isn't milking so much as they haven't even begun to scratch the surface of the Jedi Order.

Yes, 3 more films of Luke and the gang would be milking it, but films about the Old Order, the smugglers, the underworld, the Sith Empire and the Old Republic of 2,000 years ago wouldn't be milking anything. Like I keep saying the Star Wars universe is bigger than you seem to realize and brimming with potential that far surpasses the Skywalker clan and their story.

 

[Snow Queen]

I'd like to see Episode 7 maybe dealing with the next in the line of the Skywalker family and if that's a success a series of 'one shot' movies. Take the rumor of Zack Snyder directing a Samurai Star Wars movie for example. That could work really well and I'd like to see stuff like this more than Episode 8, 9, 10, etc... Think about one year having Snyder direct a KOTOR-esque prequel followed a few years later by one during the Clone Wars directed by Peter Jackson and a year or two later could have a smaller one focusing on a group of people trying to hide from the Empire as they take over their planet (taking place between 3 and 4) directed by Rian Johnson. Just for example.

 

[Picard Sisko]

I don't think me and you are communicating clearly. This is what Disney has planned for Star Wars. The Skywalker Luke story is finished. He will have a cameo at most in Episode 7 because he is the head of the Order.

Gotcha.

The standalone films want be skywalkler films. They will be bounty hunter films, new jedi, smugglers or something like that.

I really don't know if that's necessary. Do we need to see a solo film about a bounty hunter, or a smuggler?

And as for the Jedi Order despite what the 6 films might have had you think the Jedi Order is much bigger than just the Skywalker family and has been through 36,000+ years of history that far preceded their arrival to Coruscant. The Jedi Order and The force play a big part in this galaxy.

It would be nice to have some more "show and not tell." In Episode IV, we hear Obi-Won telling us all about the Clone Wars and his relationship with Anakin. We finally see what that was like, and... ruined. I understand the force has 36,000 years of history, but obviously they are not going to show us any of the history since we are going to see sequels to the original trilogy.

We also had the Emperor tell Anakin about his history, and how he became the Sith. Would be cool to see some of his history.

It isn't milking so much as they haven't even begun to scratch the surface of teh Jedi Order. Yes, 3 more films of Luke and the gang would be milking, but films about the old Order, the smugglers, the underworld, the Sith Empire and the Old Republic of 2,000 years ago wouldn't be milking anything.

But how much is there to talk about the Jedi order? It would be cool to see them make movies about the Jedi Order THOUSAND of years prior, and the history of the Sith and such... that's where it would feel like Prometheus was to Alien. It could lead into the franchise, but have its own storyline. But it doesn't seem like they are doing that. It feels like they are just continuing what we have from Episode 1 to 6.

 

[Anno_Domini]

A new one I had thought of:

The very awkward sex scene in Watchmen.

 

[Still Wynning]

A new one I had thought of:

The very awkward sex scene in Watchmen.

I don't think that was so much "cringeworthy" as much it was very uncomfortable to watch.

 

[Marvolo]

Gotcha.

I really don't know if that's necessary. Do we need to see a solo film about a bounty hunter, or a smuggler?



It would be nice to have some more "show and not tell." In Episode IV, we hear Obi-Won telling us all about the Clone Wars and his relationship with Anakin. We finally see what that was like, and... ruined. I understand the force has 36,000 years of history, but obviously they are not going to show us any of the history since we are going to see sequels to the original trilogy.

We also had the Emperor tell Anakin about his history, and how he became the Sith. Would be cool to see some of his history.



But how much is there to talk about the Jedi order? It would be cool to see them make movies about the Jedi Order THOUSAND of years prior, and the history of the Sith and such... that's where it would feel like Prometheus was to Alien. It could lead into the franchise, but have its own storyline. But it doesn't seem like they are doing that. It feels like they are just continuing what we have from Episode 1 to 6.

Only the New Trilogy will be a sequel to the Original Trilogy, and we aren't even sure how much of a sequel it will be. By all indications it will be something new with maybe some cameos. After that it is anything goes. The stand alone films can be in whatever time period they want them to be in, and tell whatever stories they want them to tell.

I'm not sure how much you are into the star wars fanbase, but there is a reason why they are doing this new trilogy first. Episodes 7-9 have been the stuff of legend for 20+ years . Episodes 7-9 are the holy grail. It sells itself and it allows for some familiar faces to appear in cameos. Its new but familiar. It gives Disney a jumping point. That's all this new trilogy is. A convenient jumping point to launch the new Franchise. After this trilogy it will be very much a different beast. With stories of all kinds taking place in different times, and different parts of the galaxy. Disney couldn't just come in and change the face of the franchise and do a bunch of standalone films. They want to tread some familiar but new marketable territory first to let the fans know that its Star Wars but a new beginning. Then they will do their thing and go new places.

 

[Snow Queen]

A new one I had thought of:

The very awkward sex scene in Watchmen.

Yeah, that was really quite strange.

Here's another: In Sherlock Holmes: A Game of Shadows, the part where they discover the bombs are covering up the work of a sniper. This makes no sense and is just cringeworthy on repeat viewings.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Only the New Trilogy will be a definite sequel to the Original Trilogy, and we aren't even sure how much of a sequel it will be. By all indications it will be something new with maybe some cameos. After that it is anything goes. The stand alone films can be in whatever time period they want them to be in, and tell whatever stories they want them to tell.

I'm certain the new trilogy WILL be sequels, since they will be Episode 7, 8, & 9.

Chances are, the standalone films won't go back and take place that long ago. They need to be relevant to the current storylines or else the general audience won't be able to follow them correctly and understand what's going on.

With the Marvel Cinematic Universe, everything happens in chronological order. Iron Man, then The Incredible Hulk, then Iron Man 2, then Thor, Cap, and then the Avengers. Its very easy to follow.

Imagine having the Star Wars trilogy, then a solo film that took place 30,000 years prior, then another film that took place after episode 9, and at different points in the timeline. It would be... annoying.

 

[Picard Sisko]

I'm not sure how much you are into the star wars fanbase, but there is a reason why they are doing this new trilogy first. Episodes 7-9 have been the stuff of legend for 20+ years . Episodes 7-9 are the holy grail. It sells itself and it allows for some familiar faces to appear in cameos. Its new but familiar. It gives Disney a jumping point. That's all this new trilogy is. A convenient jumping point to launch the new Franchise. After this trilogy it will be very much a different beast. With stories of all kinds taking place in different times, and different parts of the galaxy. Disney couldn't just come in and change the face of the franchise and do a bunch of standalone films. They want to tread some familiar but new marketable territory first to let the fans know that its Star Wars but a new beginning. Then they will do their thing and go new places.

I understand what you're trying to say. After this trilogy, they can go in whatever direction they want. That's how I see the Star Trek reboot from Abrams. He redefined the franchise, and gave it new life. Now he has all the freedom to do whatever he likes to the characters and stories.

 

[Marvolo]

I'm certain the new trilogy WILL be sequels, since they will be Episode 7, 8, & 9.

Chances are, the standalone films won't go back and take place that long ago. They need to be relevant to the current storylines or else the general audience won't be able to follow them correctly and understand what's going on.

With the Marvel Cinematic Universe, everything happens in chronological order. Iron Man, then The Incredible Hulk, then Iron Man 2, then Thor, Cap, and then the Avengers. Its very easy to follow.

Imagine having the Star Wars trilogy, then a solo film that took place 30,000 years prior, then another film that took place after episode 9, and at different points in the timeline. It would be... annoying.

The storyline of 1-6 is over. Episode 7-9 are going to feature maybe Luke and Leia, but beyond that they will be a new story. There is no current storyline. This is new stuff. Disney has said this. Whatever is set up in this trilogy will be new. After the trilogy there will be stand alone films, and they can be stand alone or tie into an as of yet unkown larger story.

 

[Picard Sisko]

The storyline of 1-6 is over. Episode 7-9 are going to feature maybe Luke and Leia, but beyond that they will be a new story. There is no current storyline. This is new stuff. Disney has said this. Whatever is set up in this trilogy will be new. After the trilogy there will be stand alone films, and they can be stand alone or tie into an as of yet unkown larger story.

That's not what I was talking about. Re-read my post.

You were saying that after 7-9, they could make solo films and movies that take place at any point in the Star Wars timeline. I'm saying that they need to keep it consistent. Don't just make a film that takes place 30,000 years ago, then a movie that takes place post Episode 9.

 

[TheDreamMaster]

I'm certain the new trilogy WILL be sequels, since they will be Episode 7, 8, & 9.

Chances are, the standalone films won't go back and take place that long ago. They need to be relevant to the current storylines or else the general audience won't be able to follow them correctly and understand what's going on.

With the Marvel Cinematic Universe, everything happens in chronological order. Iron Man, then The Incredible Hulk, then Iron Man 2, then Thor, Cap, and then the Avengers. Its very easy to follow.

Imagine having the Star Wars trilogy, then a solo film that took place 30,000 years prior, then another film that took place after episode 9, and at different points in the timeline. It would be... annoying.

Well, technically its Cap (except the edning), Iron Man, Iron Man 2, TI Hulk, Thor, then Avengers, but its made in such a way it never brings into question having to watch them in order, you just know that everyone saw Iron Man first, and the Avengers was the last film in the first phase of the MCU.

 

[Picard Sisko]

The beginning and end of Captain America take place after Thor I believe. But either way, its made so that if you watch them in the order they were made, they all add up to the Avengers. There is an MCU timeline out there somewhere, I'll go search for one.

With Star Wars, if they ever wanted to make a solo film that went back and showed something from the past, it should be done in the same way Captain America was done. It ties directly into the Avengers film.

 

[TheDreamMaster]

The beginning and end of Captain America take place after Thor I believe. But either way, its made so that if you watch them in the order they were made, they all add up to the Avengers. There is an MCU timeline out there somewhere, I'll go search for one.

With Star Wars, if they ever wanted to make a solo film that went back and showed something from the past, it should be done in the same way Captain America was done. It ties directly into the Avengers film.

Thats why I said except the ending (and the beginning as you said) of Cap t:

As for Star Wars, yeah, I agree on your points. However, if they made a film like KOTOR, then I'd just insert something in the opening crawl telling everyone "2,000 years before the rise of Palpatine's Empire, the Sith were numerous, spanning their own galaxy wide Empire. etc.etc.etc."

I think we've gotten quite off topic however.

 

[Mace Dolex]

I don't think that was so much "cringeworthy" as much it was very uncomfortable to watch.

Malin Akerman makes a weird sex face.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Thats why I said except the ending (and the beginning as you said) of Cap t:

As for Star Wars, yeah, I agree on your points. However, if they made a film like KOTOR, then I'd just insert something in the opening crawl telling everyone "2,000 years before the rise of Palpatine's Empire, the Sith were numerous, spanning their own galaxy wide Empire. etc.etc.etc."

I think we've gotten quite off topic however.

Even with the opening crawling text, they still need to tie it into the bigger film that its leading up to. I'm sure the new Star Wars will be good, but I just hope they don't waste the opportunity to do something big, and not just "milk" Star Wars. But yes, we are quite off topic.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Malin Akerman makes a weird sex face.

Wasn't she in Harold and Kumar go to White Castle?

 

[James]

I thought the movie The Edge with Alec Baldwin and Anthony Hopkins (and Bart The Bear, respectively) was pretty good. If you haven't seen it, they basically end up being hunted by a bear through the forest while trying to make their way back to civilization. So at one point Anthony Hopkins (who is my favorite actor, incidentally) is trying to enthuse Alec Baldwin to help him turn the tide and go after the bear. The scene is pretty decent and gets more intense as Hopkins eggs Baldwin on. "I'm going to kill the bear!" Baldwin repeats with increasing volume.

And then right at the end of the scene the camera zooms in on Hopkin's face and he blurts out this terrible delivery of a line best left to Samuel Jackson "Imma kill the mother****er!". It's just...well, it's pretty hilarious. Totally lacks the impact it was obviously supposed to have.

 

[Maresk]

Anytime Lazenby throws a one liner in 'On Her Majesty's Secret Service'. It's like George Constanza trying to make a joke.
*Guy get chopped in machine* "He had a lot of guts!"
*Blofeld gets stuck in branch* "I guess he branched out!"
Since it's one of Nolan's favorite movies, this is probably the origin of such beloved moments like 'Nice coat', 'That's not good!' etc etc.