Discussion: Gay Rights

[Eggyman]

If stupidity and ignorance are sins then this thread is overloaded. To be quoting a book about such things and letting that give you -- nigh, tell you -- your opinion, that to me is just so saddening to hear.

It would be a very dull place if we were all the same.

 

[Bishop]

Heaven is probably the single most difficult thing for me to comprehend. It is simultaneously terrifying, exciting and comforting. I guess its where the whole faith aspect comes into play. We just need to believe that its going to be great. t:

i'm not a massive fan of the blind faith thing either, but then again i do subscribe to the principle of occam's razor, which is limited when discussing spiritual matters.
i've just no rational reason to believe in god, a heaven or hell.

 

[Mr Sparkle]

No Sparkie....this is what you said:


Now you want to switch gears unto something else other than the lesbian and gay men topic.



The law of Moses was made of 3 parts. But I'm sure you already know this. Right?
1. Ceremonial
2. Civil
3. Moral

Jesus' death did away with needing to practice the first two. Those laws were types and shadows of who Jesus was. The need for the harsh punishments, animal sacrifices, dietary, restrictions and other stringent rules no longer applied. The Moral law (the 10 commandments) continue on. Sexual sin is still a moral problem.....old and new testament.


But I don't expect you to accept this answer either.

actually, this is what I said.

the bible says nothing about Lesbians.

wow, I stand corrected.
now tell me what Jesus said.
you know, cuz he didn't say anything you know.
because if you're gonna quote Mathhew you might want to stop wearing the mixed fabrics and stuff.

by this meaning that Jesus never spoke against Gays or Lesbians.
like, there's no quotes on him about it.
but there are tons of quotes on him about keeping the law of moses.
It's obvious that what I meant was that you are a huge hypocrite in that you have the gall to assume what Jesus meant.
however, I don't see how this is "changing gears" it's not in the least.
I'm still saying that if Jesus by NOT speaking against Homosexuality did NOT alter the perception of it as sinful, therefore he did NOT speak against mixed fabrics therefore he DID not remove the "sinful"connotation of the act.
see because I don't remember Jesus saying that he came to remove any part of law, just to fulfill it.
that's my point.
that you take from Mosaic law and Christ whatever you happen to agree with and forget about all those laws you constantly break.
infact, nowhere does it say that the ceremonial part of the law was removed by Jesus.
or did Jesus mention something?
you know where you will find people saying that it WAS removed?
Op ed pieces, conservative Op Ed pieces
you know why?

 

[Super Kal]

i'm not a massive fan of the blind faith thing either

I'm exactly the same as you, bishop...

I NEVER accepted blind faith in my life, and I still don't.

 

[DBella]

To your friends, I would say (as crazy as this may sound in this day in age): Confess your sins, turn away, and God will deliver you from temptation. Live a in accordance with God's will. Get together with some friends in a Bible study, and basically just follow the Lord. It's truely amazing what God can do and does for people who are lost in lives of sin. I speak from experience. I spent the last couple years of my life worshiping many "false idols" I guess you could say. I became obsessed with various bands, pornography, movies. I tell you, I've never felt so empty in all my life. But, a long time ago I gave my life to Christ and in doing so He made a promise to never leave. I chose to live that life. I chose to entertain different religious ideas. But, He was always there. I could feel it. It was like I was a little kid trying to rebel against whatever my parents told me. To be honest, I became very disenfranchised with other Christians because of their behavior. It was such a dark place to be in for so long. I could see no reason to be alive. I started to believe in evolution... and that's when things really started to get dark. It became a new religion, except this one did give me a reason to live. It said there was no meaning to anything. Everything was random. Nothing had any purpose. But, obviously God called me back. I basically begged for my life one night. It was pretty awesome. I really don't know why I'm writing all of this. I guess its sort of a mini testimony. Anyway, I'm done.

What do you think of ministers who are gay? Don't you think they pray to God to deliver them from temptations? Why are they still gay? Does that make them evil hypocrites? To be teaching God's message and yet, to choose to be gay?

I am glad you've found your peace in your faith.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

For the ministers/priests/reverends/spiritual leaders who are gay in a religion that frowns on homosexuals would most likely say it's a test from their creator to see if they'll stay on the true path.

Most will say that makes no sense, as they're on the path of faith.

Most will reply that it's not up to them to question, and everybody must be watched and tested somehow.

 

[Sarge 2.0]

Homosexuality is like any other sin. The Bible does not describe any sin as being worse than the other except for blasphemy (which is an eternal sin) You can chose not to be a part of it, or you can chose be a part of it. If you ask the Lord to cleanse you of your sins, he will honor your choice and lead you out of temptation. I think our culture perpetuates certain kinds of sexual perversions through exposure to sexual images in the media. Ancient Greek culture perpetuated the same thing. We place such a focus on physique, figure and being in shape that people become confused with what is attractive. There is such a big push by our media to force "gay culture" on us. I don't hate gay people. Christ teaches us to love. I believe in spiritual warfare. I believe that demons are always whispering to us, pushing our buttons and leading us into temptation. You can chose to ignore these suggestions or you can chose to engage in them. The beautiful thing about God is that he honors our choices no matter what they are. I don't believe that homosexuality is innate. We are all genetically wired for an attraction to the opposite sex, much the same as we are all genetically wired for a desire to live eternally. Everything in life is about choice.

Rant over

Oh, bull****. Practically every word of this post is complete bull****.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

In what way?

 

[Eggyman]

In what way?

In what way what?

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

I meant it to Sarge.

 

[Super Kal]

What do you think of ministers who are gay? Don't you think they pray to God to deliver them from temptations? Why are they still gay? Does that make them evil hypocrites? To be teaching God's message and yet, to choose to be gay?

yes, they are, because they know better and yet they still continue. They hide behind their religion and use it as a front to conceal what they really are... they're so afraid afraid of what they're doing, they put themselves on a pedestal and think of it as "well, I'm a priest, so it's OK for me to do these things..." and they use their faith as an enormous shield so that whenever someone thinks about them, all they see is there supposes "strong faith" and say "well, he can't be gay..."

yeah, it's sad, but it's just proof that everyone on this planet make mistakes

 

[Sarge 2.0]

I don't think anyone here is acting homophobic. Homophobic suggests that someone is afraid of homosexuality. I'm not afraid of it. I disagree with it. I think its a morally incorrect way of living life. But, I doesn't scare me and homosexuals are people just like everyone else. I can respect someones choice to live that kind of life just as God does. It's not my place to judge anyone. But, I do not have to agree with that choice. I have several gay friends, and not once have I reprimanded them for their life choice or even mentioned that I disagree with it. It's not my place. But, this a discussion forum and the topic happens to be gay marriage, so I think this is an appropriate place have this kind of discussion.

Wrong-o.

Homophobia is a hatred for homosexuals (conscious or otherwise) that stems from confusion and fear. It is not strictly fear.

And I would argue that many of the people who have posted in this thread are homophobic, some are unapologetic, most are incredibly hypocritical, claiming to "hate the sin but love sinner", even though several of their posts contain subtle homophobic undertones.

 

[Super Kal]

sarge, not all who don't like it are afraid of it...

I completely understand it, and yet I still don't like it... does that make me afraid of it? no.

 

[Sarge 2.0]

In what way?

Do you honestly believe that homosexuality is a choice? And that the media is pushing gay culture on people? And that people are wrong for wanting to take care of themselves so that they may look attractive and gain some self confidence?

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

A phobia is -literally- an irrational fear. Some show it in irrational hatred, but it's an irrational fear at it's base. People with phobias will usually (MOST usually) flat out ignore, and not go NEAR things dealing with it.

For instance, people with arachnophobias tend to stray from spider related monster movies.

 

[Sarge 2.0]

sarge, not all who don't like it are afraid of it...

I completely understand it, and yet I still don't like it... does that make me afraid of it? no.

Where did I say anything remotely close to that?

 

[Super Kal]

I honestly don't think the media is pushing it... they're just making it more evident that it exists, and they should.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Do you honestly believe that homosexuality is a choice? And that the media is pushing gay culture on people? And that people are wrong for wanting to take care of themselves so that they may look attractive and gain some self confidence?

If you read an earlier post, I said it sometimes is a choice, and mainly not a choice. He means in the media aspect that many shows will incorporate (ESPECIALLY in America) lots of homosexual themes and characters that build up the entire show in some instances, does it ACTUALLY force it on people? Only in an entertainment sort of way, and it's probably that in which he meant to imply, rather than forcing people to be gay or whatever it is that most people think he meant. As for the last question, I must've missed something, because I didn't see that.

 

[Bishop]

A phobia is -literally- an irrational fear. Some show it in irrational hatred, but it's an irrational fear at it's base. People with phobias will usually (MOST usually) flat out ignore, and not go NEAR things dealing with it.

For instance, people with arachnophobias tend to stray from spider related monster movies.

behold:

ho·mo·pho·bi·a (hō'mə-fō'bē-ə)

n.

1. Fear of or CONTEMPT for lesbians and gay men.
2. Behavior based on such a feeling.

 

[Super Kal]

Where did I say anything remotely close to that?

you mentioned "hate the sin love the sinner", and I was one of those people who said that...

I was just making myself and my view as clear as possible.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Backdrifter, have you recently found religion ?

 

[Eggyman]

I meant it to Sarge.

Sorry

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phobia

I particularly like the part detailing it as an anxiety disorder, which is NORMALLY characterized by irrational fears.

 

[Sarge 2.0]

A phobia is -literally- an irrational fear. Some show it in irrational hatred, but it's an irrational fear at it's base. People with phobias will usually (MOST usually) flat out ignore, and not go NEAR things dealing with it.

For instance, people with arachnophobias tend to stray from spider related monster movies.

Yes, I know what a phobia is. But homophobia, like xenophobia is not a clinical phobia, rather it is a word used to indicate discrimination or prejudice. Which is why it always gives me a chuckle when homophobes try to deny their homophobia by saying "I'm not a-scared of them thar gay boys!".

 

[Bishop]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phobia

I particularly like the part detailing it as an anxiety disorder, which is NORMALLY characterized by irrational fears.

fine, let's cite wikipedia then:


a non-clinical term[3][4] used to describe the fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or homosexuals.[