Discussion: Iraq II - Part 2

I think we should start targeting their families.

Revoke citizenships.

Junior wants to go wage Jihad back in the old country? Let his parents join him.


Normally I would disagree with this but you may have a good idea but I would look at the family on a case by case basis. NOT all of those families wanted their kids to run off and become murdering POSs
 
This. We need to counter the oft-captivating voice of extremism, and what better counter-narrative than those who have been there done that and regretted it or have been counseled. Having think tanks like Quilliam around is a start. It's a huge drain of resources yeah but if every single returnee is prosecuted without giving the individual a chance of turning it around, we're just giving ISIS and its ilk another recruitment sound bite.

Imprisoning all returnees without any attempt at deradicalization only yields another recruitment ground in prison.
It's not a huge drain of resources. The new Joint Strike Fighter program and various other R&D projects that don't work and aren't needed are huge drains of resources. But yes, we know the reasons for why many of these people are leaving their home countries to join ISIS. They tend to have the same profiles, similar backgrounds, etc. We need to seriously start addressing these reasons, otherwise we'll never solve this problem using only military tactics.

Sorry but IF you make a decision to leave your country and go kill then you are a criminal!!!
What if they didn't kill anyone? Maybe they never even saw combat. You said all returning fighters should be tried for "murder, terrorism and treason." I'm saying that some of those who go to join ISIL come to regret their decision, and the main thing keeping them from returning is fear of being tried for treason. In some cases, there's a benefit to bringing some of these guys back that outweighs the potential risk of harm and your need to see them put in prison for life. If not, then yes, they're probably screwed.
 
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It's not a huge drain of resources. The new Joint Strike Fighter program and various other R&D projects that don't work and aren't needed are huge drains of resources. But yes, we know the reasons for why many of these people are leaving their home countries to join ISIS. They tend to have the same profiles, similar backgrounds, etc. We need to seriously start addressing these reasons, otherwise we'll never solve this problem using only military tactics.


What if they didn't kill anyone? Maybe they never even saw combat. You said all returning fighters should be tried for "murder, terrorism and treason." I'm saying that some of those who go to join ISIL come to regret their decision, and the main thing keeping them from returning is fear of being tried for treason. In some cases, there's a benefit to bringing some of these guys back that outweighs the potential risk of harm and your need to see them put in prison for life. If not, then yes, they're probably screwed.

They joined a terrorist organization! Also It is HIGHLY ILLEGAL to join OR support a terrorist organization. So yes they ALL should be arrested!
 
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They joined a terrorist organization!

And? If they quit before they actually go on any missions, and offer up actionable intel in exchange for a lighter sentence when they get home, they're going to get consideration. If they don't pose much of a threat, but they can give me specific names, locations, etc. then I'm not going to write them off. The intel that he gives up could enable me to take out many enemies, and/or a few high-value enemies. Maybe it can be used for raid, rescue or sabotage. I gain NOTHING if he chooses to take his chances staying with ISIL rather than facing the death penalty back at home.
 
And? If they quit before they actually go on any missions, and offer up actionable intel in exchange for a lighter sentence when they get home, they're going to get consideration. If they don't pose much of a threat, but they can give me specific names, locations, etc. then I'm not going to write them off. The intel that he gives up could enable me to take out many enemies, and/or a few high-value enemies. Maybe it can be used for raid, rescue or sabotage. I gain NOTHING if he chooses to take his chances staying with ISIL rather than facing the death penalty back at home.


It is illegal just to join a terrorist organization in the US.
 
It is illegal just to join a terrorist organization in the US.
Right. You said they should ALL be charged with murder, terrorism and treason. I'm not even going to waste any more time trying to explain to you why this is not realistic.
 
Right. You said they should ALL be charged with murder, terrorism and treason. I'm not even going to waste any more time trying to explain to you why this is not realistic.

LOL spoken like a true liberal.

How about we charged them to accessory to murder, treason and being a part of a terrorist org.
 
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What's the typical punishment?

Not the death penalty, right?

I would imagine it depends on the total chargers but I think supporting and being part of a terrorist org may carry separate charges and thus separate sentences. I am not a lawyer.
 
LOL spoken like a true liberal.

This has nothing to do with my political stance. The Feds caught 3 US citizens trying to join ISIL this past week. None of them are charged with treason. I guess the CIA is just a bunch of latte-sipping, bleeding-heart liberal metrosexuals.
 
How about we charged them to accessory to murder, treason and being a part of a terrorist org.
Most likely charged for conspiracy, except for extreme cases that are beyond reform or redemption.
 
This has nothing to do with my political stance. The Feds caught 3 US citizens trying to join ISIL this past week. None of them are charged with treason. I guess the CIA is just a bunch of latte-sipping, bleeding-heart liberal metrosexuals.


Well I was saying that they SHOULD be charged with Treason. Not that are going to be charged with Treason.
 
Most likely charged for conspiracy, except for extreme cases that are beyond reform or redemption.


Honestly I think once you make a decision to join as group like ISIS you are most likely past the point of reform.
 
Honestly I think once you make a decision to join as group like ISIS you are most likely past the point of reform.
The typical recruit is in his/her late teens. They are highly impressionable, alienated, frustrated, humiliated. The recruiters are very persuasive. Some of these kids don't know what they're getting into. They can be reformed and they can be used against the enemy.
 
I know that is what the FBI says, but the people that have been shown on the news are not teens....as in the couple that they know of from the US.
 
I know that is what the FBI says, but the people that have been shown on the news are not teens....as in the couple that they know of from the US.
The Bosnian couple in St. Louis and all of their cohorts should get life sentences. There's really no question of them being lured into anything.
 
Over 1,000 Americans are part of the Israeli army.

herakles should probably have added go to fight directly against US interest(although I guess what is considered directly need to be defined but I have no problem people fighting for either Isreal or Palestine since neither of them is in direct conflict with the US)
 
Well we now know who Jihadi John is.

Go figure he's a rich kid.
 
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I'm confused. Haven't we known who he is for months? I'm sure his identity was leaked to the media a looooong time ago, so I'm not sure why this new leak is getting all the publicity.

(And needless to say, I also hope he dies slowly and painfully in a crater of drone hellfire)
 
Not publicly. There were a number of people he was speculated to be, some of whom I imagine probably are also in ISIS.

British Intelligence knew who he was for a while, but they didn't reveal it until now.

Wonder if he'll still be wearing that mask.
 
Apparently his family hasn't been seen in a while. Go figure.

I'd probably ditch town too if my son was a murdering traitor.
 
I'd rather see him on trial, and convicted by twelve of his countrymen.
 

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