Discussion: Racism - Part 3

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Thread Manager, Jul 3, 2017.

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  1. Sithborg

    Sithborg Oooh, plot twist!

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    The Confederate flag.
     
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  2. hellified

    hellified Well-Known Member

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    The stars and bars being associated with racists and white supremacists has way more to do with southern racists of the segregation era than the alt-left.

    Georgia and Alabama used the flag as a symbol to fight against civil rights and integration in the 50s and 60s. In his official capacity as governor George Wallace flew the flag at the state capital while declaring "segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever."

    Its THAT period that draws a racist association with the stars and bars.

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. routhman

    routhman Well-Known Member

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    :applaud: It's this sort of response (and more generally, this sort of exchange) that makes it clear who knows their history and who regurgitates Seann Hannity's bull crap.

    And for what it's worth, there is no "alt-left." The alt-right is a self-named group, whereas the alt-left is a term crafted by right-wing pundits to resemble the alt-right and to confuse.
     
    #528
  4. Thundercrack85

    Thundercrack85 Well-Known Member

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    That is not the stars and bars.

    People get that wrong all the time. The stars and bars refers to the original Confederate flag, which had bars. The modern-day Georgian flag (the state, not the country) is very similar.

    The confederate flag widely used today is modeled after the Army of Northern Virginia Battle Flag and the flag of the Army of Tennessee, which had the cross everyone now is familiar with. Sometimes called the "Southern Cross".
     
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    Last edited: Sep 3, 2017
  5. hellified

    hellified Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    do you really think anyone is going to bother to nuance and note the minute differences in the flag design?

    [​IMG]

    Also thats whats on the roof of the general lee car...which is what some people may take issue with..
     
    #530
  6. DJ Kornphlake

    DJ Kornphlake Well-Known Member

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    It's not really a minute difference:

    [​IMG]
     
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  7. Thundercrack85

    Thundercrack85 Well-Known Member

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    I am. I know what bars are.
     
    #532
  8. DarthSkywalker

    DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    To be fair, a cross is made up of two crossing bars. :funny:
     
    #533
  9. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Disturbing neo-Nazi stickers have started appearing in central London

    http://metro.co.uk/2017/09/04/distu...-started-appearing-in-central-london-6903091/

    [​IMG]

    I didn't realise the car in Charlottesville was a Dodge Charger. That's not any ordinary car. That's the Dukes of Hazzard car - the General Lee, albeit a different model. But still the same make of car. That can't be a coincidence.

    Anyway, I hope the Neo Nazis don't start showing up in London. Certainly any Confederates can't have much interest here. It's not even like the Deep South here and there are so many other nationalities and ethnic minorities that any Confederates or Neo Nazis won't exactly feel at home. What are they going to do? Chase all these ethnic minorities out of London?
     
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  10. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Which one is the original Confederate flag? The one which DJ Kornphlake posted?

    But what's the difference between bars and stripes? What about the current US flag? Couldn't those stripes be considered bars depending on how you categorise them? There's no real difference between this

    [​IMG]

    and

    [​IMG]

    in terms of whether they're bars or stripes. Couldn't the current US flag be called the stars and bars instead of the stars and stripes?
     
    #535
  11. routhman

    routhman Well-Known Member

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    Sure it could. But it's not.
     
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  12. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Yes, but why is that top flag considered to have bars and the one below it considered to have stripes? That's what I'm saying. What is the difference visually? It can't be just that the flag below has more. Otherwise does Captain America have bars on his abdomen or stripes, since he has fewer than the actual American flag, especially the movie costume which only has it on the front and not going all the way round, and there are only usually about 4?
     
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  13. routhman

    routhman Well-Known Member

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    You're getting tripped up by the difference between a society's idiomatic name for something (stars & stripes = the modern American Flag in modern American culture, and stars & bars = the Confederate flag in the same) versus synonymous words judged outside the context of a society's idioms (in the dictionary, bars = stripes).

    It's like how Superboy refers to one character and Superman refers to another character. You could argue that boy = man, so isn't Superboy = Superman? No, because that's not the meaning we assign to the words Superman and Superboy as a culture.
     
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  14. chamber-music

    chamber-music Infinity Ammo

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    Four serving members of the British Army have been arrested under anti-terror laws on suspicion of being members of banned neo-Nazi group National Action.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41161233
     
    #539
  15. ouroboros

    ouroboros Well-Known Member

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    Routhman is correct in pointing out that the "Southern Cross," or "Battle Flag" as others call it, is the correct term.

    However, I think it's arguable as to whether the Battle Flag had become inextricably associated with racist movements in the 1960s and 1970s. You brought up the Dukes of Hazzard car. What producer of a popular TV show would have let the car be so decorated if he thought that was how all viewers would interpret the icon?

    By 2005, though, due to the flag's constant usage by supremacist groups, the icon had taken on that unilateral meaning, to the extent that when they released the HAZZARD film-remake that same year, it included a "joke" in which the Dukes were vilified for having the symbol on their car.
     
    #540
  16. ouroboros

    ouroboros Well-Known Member

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    According to Wiki, one particular guy originated the term, and others picked up on it.

    Now, while it's true that "alt-left" probably wasn't coined by lefties, it would still be applicable if indeed there was an assortment of left-leaning partisans who shared the alt-right's penchant for extremity.
     
    #541
  17. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    I didn't know they made that joke in the movie. But I have read that by 2015 the Dukes of Hazzard TV series was pulled from the syndication schedule.

    And in that Charlottesville incident recently, it was a Dodge Charger that was used to mow people down. It wasn't the same orange colour and didn't have the southern cross on the roof, but it was still a Dodge Charger. That can't be a coincidence, because whichever model it is, you'd still associate that make of car with Hazzard, just like you'd automatically associate a Ford Gran Torino with Starsky and Hutch, even if it's a slightly different model.
     
    #542
  18. squeekness

    squeekness The mighty squeek!

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    Actually the car used in Charlottesville was a Challenger (note that it is a two door, )not a Charger(four door). My husband has a Challenger and it was the first thing I noted when I saw the footage of the crime. Shame to have used such an awesome car. :(

    edit: The Charger also has boxy headlights, not the circle lights (they look like eyes to me) that the new Challengers have. :)
     
    #543
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2017
  19. Uskok

    Uskok MCU fan

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    Here's the movie scene.

    [YT]Us7v8vQpmZg[/YT]

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Us7v8vQpmZg
     
    #544
  20. Tacit Ronin

    Tacit Ronin Well-Known Member

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    #545
  21. chamber-music

    chamber-music Infinity Ammo

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    That isn't really a big surprise. You go on many Alt-Right or Conservative leaning sites with a comments section or message board and there are usually many posts extremely hostile to anything remotely related to black people.

    The posters are clearly racist but are in denial that they are racist.

    They are the type of racists that say they aren't because they a friend who is black (for example) but they don't even realize that the whole 'few good ones I know' is a age old common excuse for racists that don't want to publicly admit their prejudice.
     
    #546
  22. chamber-music

    chamber-music Infinity Ammo

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    British Labour MP and Solicitor David Lammy is advocating reform to the British Justice System after a report he lead found racial bias towards minority groups that was eroding trust in the justice system.

    Lammy offered up some recommendations which the government said they will look at.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41191311

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politic...eview-bursts-myth-link-between-race-and-crime

    Before people start dismissing the report because Lammy is center left and black, it is worth noting the review was commissioned by the previous and current Prime Minsters (Cameron and May) who are both center right conservatives. Prime Minister Theresa May said in her national address when she became leader that she would tackle racial inequality.
     
    #547
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
  23. Black Narcissus

    Black Narcissus Pimp a Butterfly

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    Please tell me the story of the 8year old boy being lynched is fake. Goddamn.
     
    #548
  24. DarthSkywalker

    DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    It is most certainly not sadly.
     
    #549
  25. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Philly Driver Shouts ‘This Is America’ To The Wrong Asian-American

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...iver-philadelphia_us_59aee63ae4b0354e440d1069

    “Yes, this is America. I am American,” reporter responds in viral video.

    [YT]qqgC83QmbMk[/YT]

     
    #550
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