🇺🇸 Discussion: The DEMOCRATIC P - Part 3

[C. Lee]

He calls Warren "Pocahontas" as an insult.....using a well known Native American's name as an insult is racist.

 

[Lily Adler]

Settle down Old Man Jenkins.

 

[MaceB]

No, he doesn't.

He actually said that if he were to face Warren in a debate, he would "toss a DNA testing kit at her and offer 'a million dollars to your favorite charity, paid for my Trump, if you take the test and it shows you're an Indian.'"

So:

1. No debate has taken place between Trump and Warren.
2. She's got Indian heritage (like me, although I have more), but she's not an Indian (like me, she's white).

It's like if I said, "Hey, MaceB, if we ever play Tecmo Bowl against each other and you score 100 points, I'll give you a million dollars." Two weeks later, while playing Tecmo Bowl by yourself, you score a 100 points.with Bo Jackson and the Raiders. Would you then seriously suggest that I owe you a million dollars?

There's no bet.

"I will give you a million dollars, to your favorite charity, paid for by Trump, if you take the test and it shows you’re an Indian," Trump said at the time. "I have a feeling she will say 'no.' "

Trump dared Warren to take a DNA test. He said he didn't think she would, but if she did.. then he'd give a million dollars to her charity of choice. It's cute that now he wants to split hairs and say, "no, no, no, the deal was only if I got to debate and make her take a test right then and there." Huh? Who cares about the debate? Why is that added in there? He questioned her heritage and implied she was a liar. He dared her to put up or shut up. She did. If Trump were a man of his word, then he'd pony up. He's not though... so he won't. This argument cuts straight to Trump's biggest weakness: he's not a man of his word. He's a liar.

It doesn't matter what your personal views are on what constitutes "whiteness." She never lied on any forms. She's part Native American. She was telling the truth this whole time, and Trump mocked her for it. And the entire GOP with him mocked her heritage. And yeah... it was a joke, not a binding contract. He's under no legal responsibility to honor his pledge... but as a decent person, he should own up to his mistake and admit that she does - in fact - have Native American heritage, and he did - in fact - needlessly insult and defame her without knowing the facts. I think she might have a defamation suit to be honest... if he weren't President.

If nothing else, this feeds into the MeToo movement in which a rich white man would rather chastise a woman as a liar than believe her. That should matter... but we live in The Upside Down now, so.....

 

[Zarex]

No, he doesn't.

He actually said that if he were to face Warren in a debate, he would "toss a DNA testing kit at her and offer 'a million dollars to your favorite charity, paid for my Trump, if you take the test and it shows you're an Indian.'"

So:

1. No debate has taken place between Trump and Warren.
2. She's got Indian heritage (like me, although I have more), but she's not an Indian (like me, she's white).

It's like if I said, "Hey, MaceB, if we ever play Tecmo Bowl against each other and you score 100 points, I'll give you a million dollars." Two weeks later, while playing Tecmo Bowl by yourself, you score a 100 points.with Bo Jackson and the Raiders. Would you then seriously suggest that I owe you a million dollars?

There's no bet.

There's no need for you to come up with an reason to get your guy off on a technicality. No one with any familiarity with the Career Con Man in Chief actually thought he was going to pay up.

 

[Handsome Rob]

There's no need for you to come up with an reason to get your guy off on a technicality. No one with any familiarity with the Career Con Man in Chief actually thought he was going to pay up.

Contingencies in contracts (which a bet is) are highly important and relevant. They're not "technicalities." This is basic business law stuff that I learned in undergrad.

 

[Donner]

Oh my god, are you honestly implying that if Trump had made a legal bet, he would have lived up to it?

This is unbelievably ridiculous. And not really the point of any of this.

 

[Handsome Rob]

There's no need for you to come up with an reason to get your guy off on a technicality. No one with any familiarity with the Career Con Man in Chief actually thought he was going to pay up.

Also, I know it's pointless to say this, but I'll do it anyway: I didn't vote for Trump. I wrote in the candidate I wanted to win the R nomination. I'll do it again if Trump's the candidate in 2020. Trump and Bill Clinton are residents of the same moral swamp. I would never have voted for Clinton, because I don't have respect for the man. I couldn't vote for Trump and consider myself principled in any way.

But, I'm not going to take a position opposite to what I would normally do just because of the person involved. If I were on a jury, I could not in clear conscience insist that a contract was enforceable if a contingency in it had not been met. That's beyond politics.

So, just because I'm siding with X person doesn't mean he's "my guy."

 

[MaceB]

Yeah, it's obviously not legally binding. It's more of a "do what you say" / integrity issue. The guy mocked this women without any evidence... it's a downright trend at this point. And now we've got him... he made fun of her and he was wrong. He should pay, because that's what he said he'd do. But barring that, he should at least apologize.

But this is Trump we're talking about, so that won't happen either.

 

[Ouch]

She should send him an invoice.

 

[Schlosser85]

Trump isn't exactly known for paying his debts.

 

[Mike5575]

Elizabeth Warren is a fraud. Boston Globe issued a correction. Fauxahontus is only 1/1024th Native American.

Boston Globe botches math in big Elizabeth Warren scoop on Native American ancestry

 

[Schlosser85]

We have way more relevant things to be focusing on than Warren exaggerating her Native American ancestry.

 

[Ouch]

Elizabeth Warren is a fraud. Boston Globe issued a correction. Fauxahontus is only 1/1024th Native American.

Boston Globe botches math in big Elizabeth Warren scoop on Native American ancestry

Such a racist.

 

[Donner]

Elizabeth Warren is a fraud. Boston Globe issued a correction. Fauxahontus is only 1/1024th Native American.

Boston Globe botches math in big Elizabeth Warren scoop on Native American ancestry

Fauxahontas?

Are you insane?

 

[MaceB]

Elizabeth Warren is a fraud. Boston Globe issued a correction. Fauxahontus is only 1/1024th Native American.

Boston Globe botches math in big Elizabeth Warren scoop on Native American ancestry

Im confused. Did Elizabeth Warren ever say that she was a certain threshold of Native American? Did she lie in any way? What makes her a fraud?

 

[Zarex]

Also, I know it's pointless to say this, but I'll do it anyway: I didn't vote for Trump. I wrote in the candidate I wanted to win the R nomination. I'll do it again if Trump's the candidate in 2020. Trump and Bill Clinton are residents of the same moral swamp. I would never have voted for Clinton, because I don't have respect for the man. I couldn't vote for Trump and consider myself principled in any way.

But, I'm not going to take a position opposite to what I would normally do just because of the person involved. If I were on a jury, I could not in clear conscience insist that a contract was enforceable if a contingency in it had not been met. That's beyond politics.

So, just because I'm siding with X person doesn't mean he's "my guy."

I'm not calling you a Trump with the truth, but I do find it interesting how many of the Trump apologists on these boards (and elsewhere) didn't actually pull the lever for the guy. How the heck did he win?!

Anyhoo, I was sorta in the same boat in that Hillary was in no way, shape or form my choice. But I love my country and the idea of supporting a fascist-leaning, white-supremacist like Trump as President was not an option.

 

[Ouch]

I'm not calling you a Trump with the truth, but I do find it interesting how many of the Trump apologists on these boards (and elsewhere) didn't actually pull the lever for the guy. How the heck did he win?!

Anyhoo, I was sorta in the same boat in that Hillary was in no way, shape or form my choice. But I love my country and the idea of supporting a fascist-leaning, white-supremacist like Trump as President was not an option.

"I didn't vote for him, but I will defend every single thing he does."

 

[Handsome Rob]

I'm not calling you a Trump with the truth, but I do find it interesting how many of the Trump apologists on these boards (and elsewhere) didn't actually pull the lever for the guy. How the heck did he win?!

Anyhoo, I was sorta in the same boat in that Hillary was in no way, shape or form my choice. But I love my country and the idea of supporting a fascist-leaning, white-supremacist like Trump as President was not an option.

A Democrat buddy of mine and I were having coffee and talking about the election a couple of months back. I gave him the Trump/Bill Clinton explanation, and as it turns out, he didn't vote for Hillary like I thought he would. He ended up writing in Dennis Kucinich. It was a matter of conscience for him, as well--he thought Hillary was a corrupt, dishonest politician. At some point, the lesser of two evils still becomes too "evil." So, we pulled the lever for candidates we could vote for with a clear conscience. I don't regret my vote one bit, and I'll never apologize for it.

 

[Handsome Rob]

"I didn't vote for him, but I will defend every single thing he does."

Except I haven't. I rarely talk about Trump and post criticism mainly of Democrats for reasons I've already explained on here--you can look back for yourself if you're so inclined.

 

[MaceB]

A Democrat buddy of mine and I were having coffee and talking about the election a couple of months back. I gave him the Trump/Bill Clinton explanation, and as it turns out, he didn't vote for Hillary like I thought he would. He ended up writing in Dennis Kucinich. It was a matter of conscience for him, as well--he thought Hillary was a corrupt, dishonest politician. At some point, the lesser of two evils still becomes too "evil." So, we pulled the lever for candidates we could vote for with a clear conscience. I don't regret my vote one bit, and I'll never apologize for it.

There is no compelling evidence that Hillary behaved corruptly while in office. And evil? The women helped to start one of the most charitable foundations in the world, and she's dedicated much of her career to helping children. She's a competent, overly cautious, but unpersonable politician, and that's it. Sigh... it all comes back to this irrational Hillary hate. Even 2 years after the election, these zombie lies still persist. If you are looking at Trump and Hillary, and thinking that Hillary is as anti-democratic, as pro-corporate, as corrupt as Trump, you are wrong wrong wrong. It's not even in the same ballpark.

 

[Zarex]

A Democrat buddy of mine and I were having coffee and talking about the election a couple of months back. I gave him the Trump/Bill Clinton explanation, and as it turns out, he didn't vote for Hillary like I thought he would. He ended up writing in Dennis Kucinich. It was a matter of conscience for him, as well--he thought Hillary was a corrupt, dishonest politician. At some point, the lesser of two evils still becomes too "evil." So, we pulled the lever for candidates we could vote for with a clear conscience. I don't regret my vote one bit, and I'll never apologize for it.

I never understood the write in cop out. You may has well have stayed home. Or left the circle empty.

Hillary's not Trump corrupt. And she probably would have been an awful president, but still way better than Trump. There's no comparison between her and Putin's Pet. The slogan used in the 1990s Louisiana Senate race is applicable - "Vote for the Crook. It's Important". Unfortunately, people went with the white supremacist this time.

 

[MaceB]

Hillary would have been a very competent President that probably would have done a lot of good for women, children, and minorities. She's smart, experience, and deliberate.

 

[Handsome Rob]

I never understood the write in cop out. You may has well have stayed home. Or left the circle empty.

Hillary's not Trump corrupt. And she probably would have been an awful president, but still way better than Trump. There's no comparison between her and Putin's Pet. The slogan used in the 1990s Louisiana Senate race is applicable - "Vote for the Crook. It's Important". Unfortunately, people went with the white supremacist this time.

What you call a "cop out" is actually an action on conscience. I could have not voted, but I feel I have a civic duty to vote.

Then, the question become who I vote for. I wanted a vote to be on the record as going for neither Trump nor Hillary. That's how I chose to make my dissatisfaction with those two candidates known.

 

[Donner]

Dissatisfaction is a nice privilege for straight white guys to have. Meanwhile, women are wondering if their right to choose will be taken away, transgendered people are wondering if they can serve in the military, black people are wondering if they'll even get to vote, asylum seekers are wondering when they'll ever get to see their children again, protesters are wondering if some nut will run them over with their vehicle...

 

[Ouch]

A Democrat buddy of mine and I were having coffee and talking about the election a couple of months back. I gave him the Trump/Bill Clinton explanation, and as it turns out, he didn't vote for Hillary like I thought he would. He ended up writing in Dennis Kucinich. It was a matter of conscience for him, as well--he thought Hillary was a corrupt, dishonest politician. At some point, the lesser of two evils still becomes too "evil." So, we pulled the lever for candidates we could vote for with a clear conscience. I don't regret my vote one bit, and I'll never apologize for it.

I wasn't crazy about Hillary since she is a center-right Thatcherite, but I voted for her because a vote for someone who has no shot is a wasted vote and a waste of time.

Except I haven't. I rarely talk about Trump and post criticism mainly of Democrats for reasons I've already explained on here--you can look back for yourself if you're so inclined.

Way to not get what I was saying.