Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Does this show inadvertently portray the Avengers in a bad light?

[Syncos]

Asking this is like asking why every comic character doesn't appear in every comic that exists. Separate the stories!

This!

It's like reading Marvel Comics. You don't sit there being like "Man. It just doesn't make sense that the avengers don't help Spidey stop Doc Ock this time."

You read them being excited over the crossovers you get, that make sense in the given story. If everyone was constantly crossing over, it would make it less special.

That being said, I feel like the resolution of Infitiny Wars would be a good time to do it. It wouldn't take much to show quick clips of SHIELD or The Defenders while showing earth.

 

[Vartha]

I wouldn't quite go that far.

He does tho. After Phil finds out what had happened, and he and Fury have their talk Fury calls Phil and Avenger. Phil says the Tahiti project was for Fallen AVENGERS and Fury says, right. basically.

 

[Vartha]

Because Kevin Feige & Ike Pearlmutter are beefin'.

Simple as that. Getting upset that it's not going to happen isn't going to make it happen.

you never know! Phil was brought back to life to MAKE the tv show

 

[Random490]

Because Kevin Feige & Ike Pearlmutter are beefin'.

Simple as that. Getting upset that it's not going to happen isn't going to make it happen.

They're not "beefin'" Pelrmutter would not ruin a chance at cross promotion with their most popular show and movies. Their "beef" was primarily over budgeting, which now that Fiege is reporting to Disney essentially means if a movie bombs while spending way too much money, the responsibility is on Fiege's head and Perlmutter would not be held responsible. (i.e. hiring Robert Downey Jr. outside of his contract for Civil War, a lot of extra money for a penny pincher like Perlmutter)

The among the many other possible reasons the tv show character would not appear in IW, the most likely is simply: the Russo brothers don't want them. They have enough characters, enough story, they don't need to add more if they don't want to. If the Russo Brothers wanted Netflix/AoS/etc. characters to appear Fiege would make it work, specially with his pull with Disney. Hell, I doubt he would even need to deal with Perlmutter. He could just hire the actors independently.

It's a creative decision first and foremost. Beyond that there's scheduling, actor's pay, contracts, exclusivity (Netflix wants the only place to see Daredevil is on their platform), and a host of other I don't even know about before whether or not Perlmutter has his panties in a bunch even becomes a question. It's easy for us to nitpick from the sidelines but Fiege has a very busy job without having to worry about the TV side of things. So while it's important to us and our fandom it is insignificant compared to all the things he has to do to get movies out on time with such consistent quality.

 

[Vartha]

STILL want to see Phil "reveal" himself to the Avengers. ONE character at five minutes max in IW won't hurt Beside he IS the only one who HAS been in both Film and tv

Besides, IF Marvel ever does the Kree Skrull war (maybe with Captain Marvel) They'd almost HAVE to use Phil, he has Kree blood IN HIM

 

[eon001]

The Avengers paint themselves in a bad light. Civil War was a movie that dealt with the teams **** ups in Age of Ultron.

But yea I get the point of the thread, and I would agree to some extent, I don't see it as a bad thing though.

 

[fire117]

STILL want to see Phil "reveal" himself to the Avengers. ONE character at five minutes max in IW won't hurt Beside he IS the only one who HAS been in both Film and tv.

I myself would like to see the Avengers learn Coulson is alive, it's long overdue in my opinion. Plus I remember hearing there were plan to originally have Coulson show up in iron Man 3 or Thor the Dark World, but that sadly didn't happen.

Plus if the MCU is all connected, it's time to connect the shows to the films more by having characters from the shows in the films.

My nephew joked, that in IW after the Avengers defeat Thanos, they might go to dinner and see Coulson there having a romantic dinner with May and that would be how the Avengers learn Coulson is alive.

 

[Vartha]

I can see that. I agree, it's been a long time coming that Avengers learn Phil's alive.
I can't see how it would effect Shield's job of keeping things from the general public that they don't need to know about.

 

[fire117]

I can see that. I agree, it's been a long time coming that Avengers learn Phil's alive.
I can't see how it would effect Shield's job of keeping things from the general public that they don't need to know about.

Well great minds think alike.

I don't see how it would affect SHIELD's job either.

 

[BullMcGiveny]

Overall, do you guys think that this show inadvertently makes the Avengers look bad/incompetent in the grand scheme of the MCU?

I mean after the events of "Winter Soldier", we saw the fallout of Cap's actions when it came to taking down SHIELD and how it affected the lives of every innocent SHIELD agent.

If you scrutinize events in plenty of MCU movies (perhaps you could say a lot of CBM/blockbuster fair), you might draw possibilities that portray heroes in a bad light.

That was a problem I had with the SHIELD movie, frankly. It posited that Black Widow was taking a huge personal risk by releasing the SHIELD files... And then she plays the 'I'm an Avenger' card and gets off scot free, and the movie doesn't acknowledge the implication that every other loyalist SHIELD agent is screwed.

Generally, there's a current of 'these are the characters whose lives matter' to most MCU movie.

The other stuff, not so much. In a Doylist sense, the Avengers don't interfere because ABC can't hire the actors playing them.

 

[Octavias]

I mean one wouldhave to think The inhumans movie was sabotaged by Aos using them ... there probably is some bad blood there

 

[Havok83]

I dont even think about the Avengers when watching this

 

[fire117]

I dont even think about the Avengers when watching this

Well I do.

 

[psylockolussus]

I voted no as this show has no effect whatsoever in the Avenger films.

 

[fire117]

I voted no as this show has no effect whatsoever in the Avenger films.

Well it should as all the shows and films in the MCU are connected, it needs to be shown more that the shows have an effect on the films. not just the films affecting the shows.

 

[SPO2 Dalisay]

Well it should as all the shows and films in the MCU are connected, it needs to be shown more that the shows have an effect on the films. not just the films affecting the shows.

I think you can say the show has effected the movies, well Age of Ultron from the show's point of view. For the good we had the Rogue One moment, to jump franchises, where the intelligence for the opening raid was were the Bus was lost. The bad was Coulson rebuilding a helicarrier which was crewed by ex SHIELD Agents like Maria Hill who was working for Stark/The Avengers as their public job.

Besides the Inhumans I really don't know how the much smaller SHIELD, sometimes an American intelligence agency focusing in on Inhumans, at other times back on the most wanted list fits in with the movies since then.

 

[LTuser]

This is interesting. Jemma was "killed" in the Hydra mutiny, which took place while she was at the academy. So we have to assume Hydra moved much earlier in this timeline than the original one.

Presumably that means there was no avengers in this world. It would actually be interesting to get some references to that stuff. Maybe Banner never became the hulk, or Tony Stark was killed or something. Cap is probably still in the ice.

That's a good point. In the Framework, Hydra seems to have come out years before the avengers were even created. So maybe CAUSE of that, Banner never got located, Stark was kept in line, and no one bothered fishing out cap from the sea.. BUT it wouldn't explain why none of the others had any impact.. What was Black widow or Hawkeye up to? Dr Strange? Dr Zelwig?

Maybe Avengers didn't know they were back during CW?

How so, it was shield (well their helicarrier) who saved their butts in Sokovia!

Vartha claimed that the Avengers have not acknowledged the return of SHIELD and then furthered the point by suggesting that maybe the Avengers weren't aware that SHIELD was back during the Civil War.

My point is that this is not true. The Avengers knew that SHIELD existed during Age of Ultron (after the fall, but before Civil War)...and Cap even acknowledged their existence.

And since Fury, was both active in SHIELD and in the Avengers, you'd have thought both sides would know of one another.

Maybe not personally, but that "they are still there, working with us"..

No. The Avengers deal with bigger threats such as Loki and Ultron, whilst SHIELD (even if they are worldwide threats) deal with smaller ones.

So the Kree showing up, or the whole Hive angle to have been an Avengers level threat?

Or the possible battle with the Inhuman community (end S3) an Avengers level threat?

STILL want to see Phil "reveal" himself to the Avengers. ONE character at five minutes max in IW won't hurt Beside he IS the only one who HAS been in both Film and tv

Besides, IF Marvel ever does the Kree Skrull war (maybe with Captain Marvel) They'd almost HAVE to use Phil, he has Kree blood IN HIM

SO has Sam L (Fury) Sif, and Maria hill..

I dont even think about the Avengers when watching this

I do.. We had quite a few crossings of the lines in S1-2-3. BUT very little since.

 

[DalekbusterFitz]

So the Kree showing up, or the whole Hive angle to have been an Avengers level threat?

Or the possible battle with the Inhuman community (end S3) an Avengers level threat?

They're nothing compared to Loki, Chitauri or Ultron.

 

[ZIPBAGS]

Well if the Avengers don't know Coulson is alive...they do now...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLzf-kQ3RM8

They are all over law and military enforcement as "Most Wanted"

 

[SPO2 Dalisay]

Well if the Avengers don't know Coulson is alive...they do now...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLzf-kQ3RM8

They are all over law and military enforcement as "Most Wanted"

True and Daisy holding a big Inhuman stick makes it more than something that Tony Stark should be writing off as a FBI problem.

 

[wampa1]

I imagine The Avengers have a "we'll help if asked" kinda mentality.

 

[SPO2 Dalisay]

I imagine The Avengers have a "we'll help if asked" kinda mentality.

On the other hand they have Maria Hill running their intel unless she is now just the Captain of a helicarrier flying around doing something. So while "The Avengers" as an organization have always known perhaps the Avengers field commander and soldiers and patron with Captain America technically a war criminal or something did not have the need to know.

Phil Coulson being on the post office bulletin board with the FBI Most Wanted is still not a guarantee to get Tony Stark's or anybody else's notice. In the real world besides Osama Bin Laden I could not name any most wanted and I remember the old FBI show with Eferm Zimbalist Jr where I think they used to put them on the broadcast.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I imagine The Avengers have a "we'll help if asked" kinda mentality.

Agreed, plus former ties to SHIELD and the mismanagement in bringing in Cap might keep the UN from getting them involed since they may not be partial in trying to apprehend Coulson.

 

[LTuser]

They're nothing compared to Loki, Chitauri or Ultron.

I disagree. The Kree imo was as big an issue as the Chitarri..

 

[SPO2 Dalisay]

I disagree. The Kree imo was as big an issue as the Chitarri..

Potentially the Kree are, given someone like Ronin and his forces but they have only been in small scouting team numbers on Earth before the Lighthouse. And now May and Mac have been able to hold their own in hand to hand combat with Kree mercenary guards. As well as standard hand weapons having the same effect on them as a human soldier.