F'dup Chapters in American History(The Trump Years) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 29

[Schlosser85]

So Barr might be getting impeached too over lying in his testimony.

 

[MaceB]

Straight up lying under oath right? Maybe Barr can be made an example of, and it'll jar some other whistle blowers out of the shadows.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

The Washington Post - At Trump golf course, undocumented employees said they were sometimes told to work extra hours without pay

 

[godisawesome]

I mean look... I don't want to yell at anybody. I'm glad that you like Sanders. I like Sanders. I mean.. I hope he wins honestly. What a trip that would be. And it's possible... the pendulum swings back and forth, and since Trump is a wide swing to the right, it's possible that the country is poised to go far to the left.

And I know how it feels. I know it sucks, because this argument is shoved in our faces every single election. Be safe. Don't be selfish. It feels like blackmail. So I don't want to do that... but I can't deny that I'm scared. It seems that you're scared of a repeat and so am I. You - that the DNC will screw us again; me - that millennials won't be engaged enough to vote if the primaries don't go their way. I think both of those worries can be warranted at the same time.

Further than that, you kinda say, "well, support a progressive, and the millennials will be engaged." And I agree with that. I just want to cover our bases. If a progressive isn't chosen, then I hope there's no shenanigans on the DNC's part... and if there's no evidence of such, then I hope millennials (which I am one by the way) will be able to support the moderate candidate. This is still a center to center right country in a lot of ways... it could easily happen that Biden pulls ahead, without any evidence of anything untoward by the DNC.

In my view, we have a lot of candidates yes... but we're lucky... they're almost all acceptable in my view. Because yes - this election is a referendum on Trump. Beating Trump and saving the Supreme Court should be winning issues in and of themselves... and I honestly think that's the way we should go. In my view... I'm sorry to say... this is a party first kinda vote election season. I'm gonna vote for the person who wins the primary... bottom line. And I hope people can keep that in mind... to keep our eye on what the real goal is here.

You are though. You are very determined that the right course of action is to just vote for who ever is on the ballot in 2020. I am pointing out, that isn't a winning strategy. Especially as you talk down to others about how they need to learn to compromise to do it. Like people haven't been doing this and suffering for it for a very long time now. This is what MSNBC is doing, what the Democratic party is starting to do, and I can already see the anger and apathy setting in.

Did trying to hide Hillary work in 2016? I say this as a person who voted for her in both the primary and the general. Did trying to hide who she was work out in the general? I am curious how talking about who Biden is, what he himself has done and said, is somehow sabotaging anything?

Okay, full disclosure, I’m what currently qualifies as a moderate Democrat, coming from being a Never Trumper and pushed further left by how entrenched and intrinsic Trumpism’s core deceits and weaknesses are becoming to the Republican Party. So understand that what I’m going to say is going to come from someone who is not truly Progressive, and is trying to describe what kind of strategies Progressives need to apply if they want actually start “breaking the wheel,” regardless of my opinions about some of the tenants and ideals of progressivism. So if I screw it up, we know where my screw up was born from. Okay? Okay.

If Progressives refuse to be “good little soldiers,” than they still need to be “damn dangerous allies.” The Tea Party shows that inter-party insurgency groups can pull a mainstream party kicking and screaming its direction, even while instigating brutal battles in the primary season. The trick is to make sure that even when defeated, you still have a seat at the table to menacingly stab your knife into by being a powerful, enthusiastic, and unshakeable voting bloc in the regular election.

Each generation eventually gets politically active enough to dominate the polls and elections, but usually it takes so long that by the time the generation finally ascends to practical rule, they’ve moderated or regressed. The exceptions come when a generation speeds up their involvement quickly enough to seize the reins while still full of youthful energy for the battles needed of you want to be revolutionary.

Millennials are going to surpass and supplant the Baby Boomers eventually. But of Progressives want to get $#!+ moving, than they need to be even *more* active in general elections than in primaries, and ruthless enough to get unenthusiastic voters up and into the polls even if they lose a primary fight. You want to back up AOC and the New Deal? Than you need to send a message to Democratic leadership and it’s more moderate old guard that the army of Progressove voters is too damn active to ignore, to give what champions you do have major, and especially *reliable,* firepower, and to make your bloc powerful enough to launch new candidates with enough base AND party support to “storm the beaches.”

Pragmatism sucks, but pragmatism gives you a bite. And what Democrats need to be assured of in 2020 is that no matter how maimed or healthy the party is afterwards from the primary fight, it’s still got a big enough and bad enough bite to *crush* Trump in the election.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Okay, full disclosure, I’m what currently qualifies as a moderate Democrat, coming from being a Never Trumper and pushed further left by how entrenched and intrinsic Trumpism’s core deceits and weaknesses are becoming to the Republican Party. So understand that what I’m going to say is going to come from someone who is not truly Progressive, and is trying to describe what kind of strategies Progressives need to apply if they want actually start “breaking the wheel,” regardless of my opinions about some of the tenants and ideals of progressivism. So if I screw it up, we know where my screw up was born from. Okay? Okay.

If Progressives refuse to be “good little soldiers,” than they still need to be “damn dangerous allies.” The Tea Party shows that inter-party insurgency groups can pull a mainstream party kicking and screaming its direction, even while instigating brutal battles in the primary season. The trick is to make sure that even when defeated, you still have a seat at the table to menacingly stab your knife into by being a powerful, enthusiastic, and unshakeable voting bloc in the regular election.

Each generation eventually gets politically active enough to dominate the polls and elections, but usually it takes so long that by the time the generation finally ascends to practical rule, they’ve moderated or regressed. The exceptions come when a generation speeds up their involvement quickly enough to seize the reins while still full of youthful energy for the battles needed of you want to be revolutionary.

Millennials are going to surpass and supplant the Baby Boomers eventually. But of Progressives want to get $#!+ moving, than they need to be even *more* active in general elections than in primaries, and ruthless enough to get unenthusiastic voters up and into the polls even if they lose a primary fight. You want to back up AOC and the New Deal? Than you need to send a message to Democratic leadership and it’s more moderate old guard that the army of Progressove voters is too damn active to ignore, to give what champions you do have major, and especially *reliable,* firepower, and to make your bloc powerful enough to launch new candidates with enough base AND party support to “storm the beaches.”

Pragmatism sucks, but pragmatism gives you a bite. And what Democrats need to be assured of in 2020 is that no matter how maimed or healthy the party is afterwards from the primary fight, it’s still got a big enough and bad enough bite to *crush* Trump in the election.

What they will do and what they should do are two different things. You can't force them to be pragmatist. You can give them someone they want to vote for, though.

The problem with the bold bit is Pelosi and Schumer are showing that isn't how they interpret it. They take it as a green light to do what they have been doing, and when this is pointed out to them, they actually crap on progressive voters. Pelosi has done it multiple times. How does that motivate anyone to follow you, when they know you will just do what you want anyways?

The right gets their voters with a combination of fear and sticking it to the other side. That won't work for the left. Especially after being told to do that in 2016, and the result being what it was.

I will do my duty, whatever that is in 2020. The progressive voices I listen to say that is what those on the left should do. But so many won't, if they don't get a candidate that motivates them. And considering what happened in 2016, wouldn't you think that should get through to those closer to the center/right in the Democratic party?

 

[Sithborg]

Man, I should tune into Harris' time at Barr's hearing tomorrow. That is going to be amazing. I'm sure Booker and Gilebrand will try to showboat, but neither are quite as effective as Harris' laser focused, prosecutorial questioning. She must have been a terrifying DA.

 

[MaceB]

I hope they really dig in on the lying under oath. That's a big deal. It certainly looks like that's what he did. And if so, he should resign.

 

[samsnee]

Now he's just retweeting firefighters who say they will vote for him because the Firefighters Union threw their weight behind Biden (he's up to 50 retweets)

 

[Lighthouse]

On one hand, I got some big problems with Joe Biden. On the other, he seems to cause Trump a great deal of distress and makes him to act even more erratic than usual.

 

[Schlosser85]

Sleepy Joe isn't young and vibrant like Donald....what does Trump see when he looks in a mirror?

 

[Mani-Man]

On one hand, I got some big problems with Joe Biden. On the other, he seems to cause Trump a great deal of distress and makes him to act even more erratic than usual.

Yeah, its a bit tricky since Biden isnt not my top choice...but he is a thorn in Trumps eye and thats good.
But part of me still wants a woman to challenge Trump and win.
I know just basing it on gender is ****ty, but having a female that pisses Trump off and completely destroys him and then throws him out of the white house would be the most glorious thing that ever happened.
But of course the most competent candidate should challenge Trump in the first place, no matter the gender or skin color or so...anybody who ruins Trumps run as president is on my good side.

 

[DeadPresident]

Thinking someone has value as a candidate because they annoy a pleb like Trump is thinking like a Republican...

The Democrats should grow a spine and leave fossils like Sanders and Biden behind and back the **** out of Warren - She has the best articulated platform and is actually suggesting policies that’ll help average Americans.

 

[Mani-Man]

Thinking someone has value as a candidate because they annoy a pleb like Trump is thinking like a Republican...

The Democrats should grow a spine and leave fossils like Sanders and Biden behind and back the **** out of Warren - She has the best articulated platform and is actually suggesting policies that’ll help average Americans.

Yup, as much as i would on a personal level appreciate it...personal feelings shouldnt be the main reason for something this important.
Politics shouldnt be a circus and going as low as Trump is not helping anything in the end.
Pissing the guy off isnt as important as helping the american people.

 

[Lighthouse]

The only way Lindsey Graham could sink any lower is if, on national television, shoved his face right into Trump's ass.

 

[Schlosser85]

The only way Lindsey Graham could sink any lower is if, on national television, shoved his face right into Trump's ass.

Franklin Graham and Bill Barr and Sean Hannity would have to move over to make room.

 

[Dr Lee]

so because Trump had created a conflict of interest, then it's perfectly fine to fire the man in charge of investigating him....

that's what Barr is saying here

 

[Boy Scout]

Gonna try and stay in my lane after this, but...I understand where MaceB is coming from. There’s nothing wrong with preferring one candidate over another for whatever reason, but at the end of the day, only one of them is going up against Trump. And if we want to beat him, we need to be able to unite around that candidate and make sure that they get the votes necessary to make sure he doesn’t get a second term. And that’ll be harder to do if we spend our time praising one candidate and trashing all the rest. And I say that as someone who has issues with Biden and would prefer that he not be president.

And let’s be real for a second: it almost doesn’t matter who it is. We all know we’re going to vote for them over Trump anyway.

RE: Barr: what is it with these people? Why do they keep lying about things that are so ****ing easy to disprove? It’s insane.

 

[Silvermoon]

 

[Lighthouse]

If Barr performs this badly under a Republican senate judiciary committee, imagine how badly it'll go for him tomorrow.

 

[Lighthouse]

Great, Mike "Babies fix climate change" Lee is up.

 

[Schlosser85]

I LOL'ed when John Cornyn praised Barr for "restoring the Department's reputation for impartiality and not an arm of one administration or another".

So, the exact opposite of what's happening?

 

[Teelie]

The general assumption I have is whatever Republicans say, the opposite is true.

 

[Lighthouse]

Republicans are so corrupt its gone beyond normalization, it's actually expected. This testimony in any other decade would've lead to the AG's impeachment.

 

[DeadPresident]

That’s part of the reason Trump needs to be removed ASAP - every day he’s president further damages what healthy social and political discourse looks like.

 

[Silvermoon]

Great, Mike "Babies fix climate change" Lee is up.

I remain embarrassed for my state. I am so sorry about him (I've said it before, I'll say it again, I certainly didn't vote for him)