Fant4stic "Flame On!" The Human Torch Thread

[Jennifer Walters]

If you go to cracked.com you can find it...it's a new article...there are bad words in it and can't be posted here

Literally on the front page last I checked too.

 

[Kelly]

But most of the comments aren't "I think he's a bad actor so I don't want him cast." This thread is full of "I'm a purist and changing the race fundamentally changes the character" or "black superheores would never be cast as white!" Which are racist statements. The only thing we really know about Michael B. Jordan is that he has already played a character quite similar to Johnny in Chronicle, and he has a working relationship with the director. So all this drama and debate isn't because of his acting ability.

You act like he's Denzel Washington or something....he was in a movie you liked, great.

If the other guys up for the part are as good as he is or better and "look" the part better, then I'm sorry, as I have said before it will look pretty strange to me. If not, the other guys up for the part are mediocre, then fine let the casting stand.

And just because some here are purist's does not make them racist, any more than those wanting Johnny to have blond hair in the first two movies made them haters of brown haired guys, or guys with buzz cuts...you are making a very, very, very serious judgment of people based on a few posts, knowing nothing about them at all. Those kinds of judgments really need to stop...I'm speaking of calling posters ON THIS BOARD racist because they have given a simple opinion that they would like this character to stay the race of the comics, I could really careless what someone says on another site. The other site isn't on my radar...

And no sir, comments like that ARE NOT racist, they are simply an opinion of someone that has known this character one way for decades, and simply want them to stay that way....as I said, you continue down this road of posting, there will be consequences.

 

[Human Torch]

I just get perturbed when people act like wanting a character who has been depicted as white for 40-80 YEARS to remain as originally conceived, as tantamount to opposing the Civil Rights Movement.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Just like to point out. I never once said that a minority person can't rise above those struggles by the way. Good for your neighbors. Proud of them and happy for them.

I'm just saying when you're a part of a minority you just have to work harder at it than a white straight dude, because unlike them they are not afforded the privilege of being the default setting for humanity.

People never think twice about a white straight dude. And that ties in to your character when you face a struggle such as that and why you can't change the skin tone of a minority character.

 

[Spider - Man]

As soon as you can tell me one thing that white straight men suffer from that comes from the fact that they are white in skin tone or straight and date women.

Then I'll call myself a racist.

But until then...

Yeah, standing by that comment, because it's the truth. A white straight guy will NEVER know the struggles of a minority culture. Simply because he doesn't have them. All of a white straight dude's struggles comes from ulterior things. Like being poor, etc, etc.

Not the fact that they are white or straight.

Oh, by the way white GAY man here. Not that it has anything at all to do with this conversation or the Human Torch.

Ok, I'll be happy to. I worked at a well-known university in the mail department. My supervisor was on older black man who I was told after a while didn;t like white people though I ever really picked up on anything. I was the only white guy in the department 2 other guys who were younger than me and black. We got along great, hung out after work, played pickup and whatnot. I was a temp to hire and had worked there for over a year. ONe of the other 2 guys got married and got a jb somewhere else. They brought in another black guy who was cool and we got along. 2 months after he started, one of the positions became permanent. Guess who the super gave it to?

So don't tell me what a straight white man will NEVER know anything about because of his skin color. See, that's the big lie that allows double standards like those espoused in this thread to be called legit. Its a bunch of ********.

 

[Kelly]

Well, I've been part of a minority far longer than probably most of you on here....I gained the right to vote long after most on here (as far as history goes).

But I am now the majority 51% and changes are coming.....

 

[Spider - Man]

Just like to point out. I never once said that a minority person can't rise above those struggles by the way. Good for your neighbors. Proud of them and happy for them.

I'm just saying when you're a part of a minority you just have to work harder at it than a white straight dude, because unlike them they are not afforded the privilege of being the default setting for humanity.

People never think twice about a white straight dude. And that ties in to your character when you face a struggle such as that and why you can't change the skin tone of a minority character.

I swear I'm gonna bring them over here and let them read your post and then videotape them telling you how out of touch you are. They would literally laugh in your face. 'Privilege of being the default setting for humanity'? Really?

 

[Mad Ones]

Yeah, its a load. I live in a nice neighborhood and I've worked hard to acquire everything I have. My neighbors on either side are black, great guys. We exchange gifts every Christmas and cook out a lot in the summer. One drives a Mercedes and the other a BMW. I drive an Acura. One is retired executive from McDonald's and the other works at IBM. Both, I'm sure, have/make more money that me. Far from resenting, I am very happy for them. Either of them would tell you to stick that 'white straight privaledge' straight up your ass, victim.

Wow. I have no words. So according to you racism and homophobia don't exist, and people claiming otherwise are victims? What you just said in no way negates the fact that white privilege exists. Yes there are wealthy racial minorities. It doesn't negate the social trend of the socio-economic status of racial minorities. Do some research outside of you neighbors, maybe?

 

[Kelly]

OK guys, we are going to chill....right now!

We are going to wait to see if this rumor comes true, and we will discuss other possibilities if they present themselves, or we will discuss this choice if it does come to reality as the choice for Johnny.

As of right now, the movement of these posts is moving towards trouble.

So chill, or move on to another forum.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Ok, I'll be happy to. I worked at a well-known university in the mail department. My supervisor was on older black man who I was told after a while didn;t like white people though I ever really picked up on anything. I was the only white guy in the department 2 other guys who were younger than me and black. We got along great, hung out after work, played pickup and whatnot. I was a temp to hire and had worked there for over a year. ONe of the other 2 guys got married and got a jb somewhere else. They brought in another black guy who was cool and we got along. 2 months after he started, one of the positions became permanent. Guess who the super gave it to?

So don't tell me what a straight white man will NEVER know anything about because of his skin color. See, that's the big lie that allows double standards like those espoused in this thread to be called legit. Its a bunch of ********.

Magnify this case of unproofed reverse racism against you times ten thousand.

Congrats you now have the struggles of a black man, gay man, bi man, lesbian woman, a woman, other minority.

It's a DAILY thing for us. Not a once in a blue moon thing. We have to work hard like your neighbors to get everything. So do you guys, but you have a MUCH easier job at doing it because society doesn't few you in any strange ways because you have been the root of all social power since practically the dawn of civilized humanity.

 

[Kelly]

I'm going to assume you did not read my warning....

 

[Jennifer Walters]

I'm going to assume you did not read my warning....

I posted that after. Yes.

Maintaining civility. Backing off it.

 

[Mad Ones]

You act like he's Denzel Washington or something....he was in a movie you liked, great.

If the other guys up for the part are as good as he is or better and "look" the part better, then I'm sorry, as I have said before it will look pretty strange to me. If not, the other guys up for the part are mediocre, then fine let the casting stand.

And just because some here are purist's does not make them racist, any more than those wanting Johnny to have blond hair in the first two movies made them haters of brown haired guys, or guys with buzz cuts...you are making a very, very, very serious judgment of people based on a few posts, knowing nothing about them at all. Those kinds of judgments really need to stop...I'm speaking of calling posters ON THIS BOARD racist because they have given a simple opinion that they would like this character to stay the race of the comics, I could really careless what someone says on another site. The other site isn't on my radar...

And no sir, comments like that ARE NOT racist, they are simply an opinion of someone that has known this character one way for decades, and simply want them to stay that way....as I said, you continue down this road of posting, there will be consequences.

I hated Chronicle. But Michael B. Jordan had a lot of qualities similar to Johnny Storm so the casting actually kind of makes sense to me.

I have never called anyone racist. Ever. I even made a post about how there's a difference between statements that are racist and people intentionally being racist. I don't think a lot of "purists" are racists. But their statements contribute to making a very racist discourse regarding colour blind casting.

And I can't believe I'm the one getting threatened. Someone just said that people pointing out white privilege are playing the victim, and I'm the one who will suffer consequences?

That cracked article made this board look pretty bad all over the Internet. I guess no one really cares.

 

[Mad Ones]

I also posted mine after I read your post. I'm just not going to come back to this thread.

Peace.

 

[Spider - Man]

Wow. I have no words. So according to you racism and homophobia don't exist, and people claiming otherwise are victims? What you just said in no way negates the fact that white privilege exists. Yes there are wealthy racial minorities. It doesn't negate the social trend of the socio-economic status of racial minorities. Do some research outside of you neighbors, maybe?

Funny for someone with no words you seem to have...some words.

I want you to quote where I said racism doesn't exist. It absolutely does. It just isn't all white on black like you have somehow convinced yourself. Tell me, if my neighbors can achieve what they have, what is the excuse that other black people can't. My neighbors would tell you they had no special privilege, just a desire for something better. They worked hard, did the work in school and college and got what they wanted. EVERYONE has obstacles they have to overcome. My neighbors would also tell you that they weren't held back by anything having to do with their race. I say the ones who say they are just use that as an excuse to not have to try. Otherwise you have to believe that if it weren't for the 'white man' every black person would be a raging success. Is that what you think?

I'll tell you this, if there IS some special privilege reserved for white people, I wish someone had told me about it. Much more likely that it doesn't exist except in the heads of people who need an excuse to be victims.

 

[Kelly]

I posted that after. Yes.

Maintaining civility. Backing off it.

Thank you....

You make great points, please don't think that I'm stifling those points. They would just be better made in another thread specifically for that discussion.

 

[roach]

That cracked article made this board look pretty bad all over the Internet. I guess no one really cares.

I care. When I saw the article and recognized the hype I was a little embarrassed.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

So Human Torch's CGI. It'll probably be substantially better than in the 2007 film.

 

[Kelly]

And every other comic book site out there....we are actually pretty tame to some I've read.

What happened here is what I figured would end up happening. There is less talk about the movie as a whole, and more talk about racism and now homophobia??? that has reached far past this specific movie. All over a rumor...

And I'm sorry, but I am not going to allow an article by someone "giving THEIR OPINION" to justify calling people a clearly, strong, strong word because of their opinion. Not going to happen. And yes it has been done here, by those that are saying they haven't, there are MANY ways of doing so without coming right out and saying it, and the insinuations are running rampant, so this discussion is now closed.

Once we have the actual person in the role, we will start with that...OR, if you have other choices you would like to see in the role, we will go with that as well.

OR, as pr0xyt0xin has so beautifully done, taken us into another discussion about the Torch.... : )

 

[Spider - Man]

So Human Torch's CGI. It'll probably be substantially better than in the 2007 film.

Unless they try to go with practical fx this time around! YIKES!

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

HAHA. I think the firebenders in The Last Airbender used a lot of practical effects.

Then again, no one was actually on fire.

 

[Kelly]

So Human Torch's CGI. It'll probably be substantially better than in the 2007 film.

I wasn't totally upset with the CGI in the first, I know there was a lot of "ringing of hands" about it leading up to the movie, but not too many complaints about after the movies were made.

I did notice that it was better more fluid in the second movie, than the first....so I'm going to assume that this will be even more so in this movie. I hope.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

I wasn't totally upset with the CGI in the first, I know there was a lot of "ringing of hands" about it leading up to the movie, but not too many complaints about after the movies were made.

I did notice that it was better more fluid in the second movie, than the first....so I'm going to assume that this will be even more so in this movie. I hope.

Oh yeah, that's my point. Like, I don't remember any issues in the other two movies. So seven years later we might be in for a real treat.

 

[Spider - Man]

HAHA. I think the firebenders in The Last Airbender used a lot of practical effects.

Then again, no one was actually on fire.

I remember years ago when talk of an FF movie was going around there was mention of doing the torch like they did the stuntment on movies like Towering Inferno and light him up for real in a special suit, let him jump off a building into an airbag abnd douse him with extinguishers! Glad that got nixed!

I also remember the reason they had Herbie in the cartoon instead of the Torch was because they were afraid tht's just what kids would try to do in immitating the Torch! Crazy!

 

[Kelly]

Oh yeah, that's my point. Like, I don't remember any issues in the other two movies. So five years later we might be in for a real treat.

I remember people BEFORE the first movie seeing "raw footage" freaking out...but didn't hear anything afterwards. I'm hoping that we see MUCH BETTER CGI all the way around. ESPECIALLY WITH "stretchy boy"....