Fant4stic "Flame On!" The Human Torch Thread

[Jennifer Walters]

I never once said it AUTOMATICALLY comes with being a member of a minority. And if I did I wasn't thinking much about word choice that day.

Often times it does. However it's entirely possible depending on circumstances and situations for it not to as well.

 

[strugler]

That is changing right now, any poster calling another poster a racist because they'd like an actor to be cast who looks like a character that has been around half a century, will be infracted in the same way a racist comment would be infracted.

Dude, you are awesome!!!

All boards moderators should do this!

I am tired of seeing people calling their fellow board members racist just because they want the character on film to resemble the one on the source material.

 

[JP]

Dude, you are awesome!!!

All boards moderators should do this!

I am tired of seeing people calling their fellow board members racist just because they want the character on film to resemble the one on the source material.

There is nothing wrong with that.


But when you say things like "I can't begin to think of the RAMIFICATIONS of casting a black human torch" or "A black man can't be a superhero because that's suspicious!" Well, ****. Those are blatant racist statements.

 

[terry78]

Dude, you are awesome!!!

All boards moderators should do this!

I am tired of seeing people calling their fellow board members racist just because they want the character on film to resemble the one on the source material.

You already know it's not that cut and dry.

 

[Spider‑Man]

it has little to do with weight. Rebel is a loud and brass woman. Sue is not. I'm tired of this redicuous attempt at an argument.

Mbj is handsom, charismatic, funny, and just about the right age. He just happens to be black. On the other hand the only thing rebel has in common with sue is her blonde hair.

Sad that this is the best that some of you can do.

acting!!!

 

[Jennifer Walters]

You already know it's not that cut and dry.

Exactly. Frankly a little disappointed in how this whole thing is being handled in that department.

Feels more like the people who aren't doing anything wrong are the ones getting punished than the ones towing the lines of racism and then also being blatantly so.

 

[strugler]

You already know it's not that cut and dry.

It could be. Let's first make a difference between a racist comment and and non racist one:

A- If a member states that they dont want the superhero (who is white in the source material) to be black but are ok for the superhero to be changed to Asian or Hispanic, then THAT IS RACIST

B- If a member states that they don't want the superhero to be black because the source material, that has been around for more than 50+ years has that same hero as white, then they are NOT RACIST

Heck i am moroccan from north Africa and i would be so pissed off if they make Batman a moroccan dude or Hulk from north africa.

 

[Spider‑Man]

I never once said it AUTOMATICALLY comes with being a member of a minority. And if I did I wasn't thinking much about word choice that day.

Often times it does. However it's entirely possible depending on circumstances and situations for it not to as well.

Wow are you a lawyer?

 

[Jennifer Walters]

There is more at play in most of these comments than simply ''I don't want Johnny to be black because he's white in the comics and I want to respect that."

That's all there is to it really.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Wow are you a lawyer?

No. Do you think I should become one?

 

[terry78]

I've seen people express the desire for Storm to remain white without all the "make MLK and Black Panther white" commentary. I have no issue with those.

 

[Spider‑Man]

There is more at play in most of these comments than simply ''I don't want Johnny to be black because he's white in the comics"

That's all there is to it really.

I think the fact that you say 'most' just shows how you choose to focus on specific ones while disregarding the validity of the real 'most'.

 

[JP]

Strugler, when someone wants a white character to stay white because that's how it's always been, that's just closed minded, but not at all racist. You're right about that.


But when someone wants a white character to stay white because being black is unrealistic, or throws off the team balance, or has unfathomable ramifications, well that is all blatantly racist. And that has been a good chunk of the replies in this thread.

I've seen people express the desire for Storm to remain white without all the "make MLK and Black Panther white" commentary. I have no issue with those.

Neither do I.

 

[Spider‑Man]

No. Do you think I should become one?

'I never said...and if i did...' Sounds like lawyer-ese to me.

 

[Donut]

Did Jordan even audition ? The director & him keeps saying how they are good friends. It sounds like this is a friend helping a friend out situation

 

[Jennifer Walters]

I think the fact that you say 'most' just shows how you choose to focus on specific ones while disregarding the validity of the real 'most'.

No. I say "most" because some people are actually capable of expressing their desire to see Johnny be as accurate to the drawings without delving into saying things like ''Why can't Malcolm X/Black Panther/Luke Cage..." or saying things that have negative undertones/or even blatant racism and hatred towards black people or hell even some of these comments are down right offensive to some modern day family units as well.

And those people don't deserve to be bunched in with the others. And those are the ''few" not the ''most."

 

[Kelly]

Please report the posts that show this racism and we will take care of it.

With that said, we are moving back to the character of Johnny Storm, and possible casting...NOT the the said racism, or implied racism of some posters. If what they have said falls into the category of "racist" report it.

Now...move on.

 

[strugler]

We should all move on because it does not really matter, this is a fox movie which means there a big chance it will tank and all these comments will be wasting energy for nothing.

I am done getting excited for a fox/marvel movie. Hopefully we will get a good FF movie when the rights, ultimately, revert back to marvel studios (one of the few studios who know how to treat their characters)

 

[Kelly]

We should all move on because it does not really matter, this is a fox movie which means there a big chance it will tank and all these comments will be wasting energy for nothing.

I am done getting excited for a fox/marvel movie. Hopefully we will get a good FF movie when the rights, ultimately, revert back to marvel studios (one of the few studios who know how to treat their characters)

Your optimism is astounding....

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

You must not go in many casting threads.

I've been in many casting threads. I've been in threads where bodybuilders were suggested for Captain America. I was there when people wanted Triple H for Thor.

Some of the more extreme arguments against Jordan are illogical and strawman.

I believe this is where the disconnect is taking place. The Johnny Storm version of The Human Torch has a history going back to 1961, 1939 if you include the similar looking Jim Hammond. For iconic characters, such as a key member of Timely's Big Three and Marvel's First Family, tradition is everything.

Storm and Hammond are different characters so I don't think Hammond should be mentioned at all.

And when has Marvel ever stuck to tradition when it comes to the movies? The X-Men didn't wear their traditional uniforms. The FF movies didn't stick the comics either. Neither does Marvel Studios movies and they've been successful. So has some of X-Men's movies.

Film is a different medium. The FF movie is an adaptation, not an exact translation of the comics. Name one Marvel movie who's story and characters were exactly like the comics?

Comics are a visual medium, which is why fans get giddy when we see RDJ, Henry Cavill and Chris Hemsworth sporting a "leapt off of the comic book page" appearance while in full costume. We've already seen Johnny Storm countless times through the decades, and due to the nature of his powers Johnny spends only a fraction of his time in comics or on screen fully alflame. Given the fact that Spider-man is fully masked, I was actually onboard the Donald Glover as Peter Parker bandwagon. I was a fan of his work on Community and felt he would fit seemlessly into the role. A racial recast of Johnny Storm not only changes his iconic appearance, it also requires an alteration in the relationship to his genetic sibling. That may not matter to you, but to others it appears as though Trank is considering making unnecessary changes to beloved characters.

What makes Donald Glover as Spider-Man okay and Johnny Storm not? Spider-Man is masked, but Johnny Storm is on fire.

It alters his relationship with Sue, but that could be easily explainable. It's not like they have to have close DNA to get their powers. They're not mutants. It could even open up new stories for this new interpretation.

A hefty Sue may be a problem for you, while a black Johnny may not coincide with my vision for the character. Both opinions are equally valid.

If you're serious enough about it, then fair enough. Can you at least choose a hefty actress that's more like Sue at least for your vision?

Here's another thing though. It's not about your vision, it's about Tranks vision for the character, and f he chooses Jordan he has an idea in mind for the character that at least is worth some curiosity.

So I ask you and others again. What is being lost in translation other than visual appearance? What won't we get from the character?

At the least I can see him doing as good a job as Evans has and it's not a race thing.

 

[Project862006]

Did Jordan even audition ? The director & him keeps saying how they are good friends. It sounds like this is a friend helping a friend out situation

could anti jordan supports reach any further

so now he is just given the job now and hasn't earned it with talent

 

[Eddie]

could anti jordan supports reach any further

so now he is just given the job now and hasn't earned it with talent

To be fair, many actors actually do get jobs without auditioning. I don't know that the comment made was "anti Jordan" or anything.

 

[Kelly]

Jessica Alba got the part of Sue without auditioning. She simply met with Story and Gruffudd and got the part. Then I saw her casually talking with the head of Fox at the "I, Robot" premiere, and I thought...well holy crap, she got the part. Happens all the time... I don't like it, but it does happen.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

could anti jordan supports reach any further

so now he is just given the job now and hasn't earned it with talent

I don't think Donut was suggesting that.

 

[Kelly]

I myself, would really like to see Colton Haynes in the part, I hadn't actually thought about him until someone brought him up the other day.

I think he would be a great addition...