Fox vs. Sony - who is worse?

[bullets]

Josh Trank's approach is a moderate to low budget. It looked fine to me.

Fox has made a lot of good decisions lately.

 

[Jason Kane]

Getting Fox to invest in a new X-character is like pulling teeth which is why its ridiculous seeing so many people jump to Fox's defense. Singer did not erase Fox's poor practices when logan when back in time....

- They had 9 years to get another Daredevil off the ground and miss the deadline.

- It took 8 years to do another F4 film.

- 7 years for a Deadpool film.

- The Silver Surfer is in purgatory.

- And Despite the musings by Millar and Kinberg a XM/FF crossover can NOT be done without Marvels consent. So charge them for taking out of their @sses.

Lord knows when you'll get a Gambit or X-Force film, yet these same people are reluctant of Marvel getting this franchise back for fear it will "Take to long to reboot it and make spinoffs"???

SMDH......REVERT BACK TO MARVEL OR SHUT UP!!!

Bless this post!

 

[Shanio1]

Defiantly sony.

 

[CaptainWagner]

Josh Trank's approach is a moderate to low budget. It looked fine to me.

Fox has made a lot of good decisions lately.

Yeah, while Trank's film may not look like the FF we know and love, it doesn't look bad, which is more than can be said for Sony's leaked plans for the Spiderman franchise.

 

[bullets]

It's too soon to tell about Fantastic Four , but yeah that was at least better than the trainwreck I had envisioned.

At least Fox got the X-men back on track where Sony still has no idea what to do about Spider-man

 

[metaphysician]

You want to talk about public opinion, here's the CinemaScore ratings for those movies:

Punisher: War Zone: B-
Elektra: B
Origins: B+
Hulk: B-
TASM2: B+
Spiderman 3: B+
Silver Surfer: B
X3: A-
Spirit of Vengeance: C+
Iron Man 3: A

One of these things is not like the other.....



But honestly, how did we even get on this argument in this thread?

Honestly, this kind of points to CinemaScore being basically useless. Even a movie as terrible as Ghost Rider 2 ( assertion backed by both reviews and box office ) still manages a C+, with other poor movies scoring in the B range? Whatever its trying to measure, its not doing a useful job. If its that easy to score a high grade on CinemaScore, then they really should apply a negative curve to the test, to better distinguish the actual performance of different movies. After all, if the test is so easy that any competent movie should score an A- or better, your rating system should clearly portray that a B is a failure.

 

[CaptainWagner]

Honestly, this kind of points to CinemaScore being basically useless. Even a movie as terrible as Ghost Rider 2 ( assertion backed by both reviews and box office ) still manages a C+, with other poor movies scoring in the B range? Whatever its trying to measure, its not doing a useful job. If its that easy to score a high grade on CinemaScore, then they really should apply a negative curve to the test, to better distinguish the actual performance of different movies. After all, if the test is so easy that any competent movie should score an A- or better, your rating system should clearly portray that a B is a failure.

CinemaScore measures a movies success with the general audience. As the Transformers movies have proven, a movie doesn't need to be good to be popular with the GA.

 

[metaphysician]

CinemaScore measures a movies success with the general audience. As the Transformers movies have proven, a movie doesn't need to be good to be popular with the GA.

Its not the height of the ratings, its the narrowness. CinemaScore barely lets you distinguish the immediate viewer reaction between really good and really bad movies, because almost all movies end up with scores in the top 15% of their range. If their measurement system means they will never, ever use the entire bottom half of the possible score? They should just cut off that entire half, and spread the top half across a larger set of numbers, so you can better distinguish differences in reaction.

 

[hedgehogvampire]

Hmm... This is difficult I love the original Spider-man movies from Sony but I also loved many of the X-men movies too. I know many people weren't happy with the original Fantastic 4 but I thought it was fine, it was't the greatest comic book movie but far from the worst. Also personally I liked Amazing Spider-man 2 I did not have really any problems with the movie, but I could see why people were not happy with it. But I guess over all I guess Sony is worse off, mostly because of the mess that is happening right now for them and that Sony only has Spider-man so I don't understand what else you could do with the character that would be new to audience. Fox on the other hand has both the X-men which you could make different types of movies out of and the Fantastic 4.

 

[MakeMinesMarvel]

Hmm... This is difficult I love the original Spider-man movies from Sony but I also loved many of the X-men movies too. I know many people weren't happy with the original Fantastic 4 but I thought it was fine, it was't the greatest comic book movie but far from the worst. Also personally I liked Amazing Spider-man 2 I did not have really any problems with the movie, but I could see why people were not happy with it. But I guess over all I guess Sony is worse off, mostly because of the mess that is happening right now for them and that Sony only has Spider-man so I don't understand what else you could do with the character that would be new to audience. Fox on the other hand has both the X-men which you could make different types of movies out of and the Fantastic 4.

Don't worry your not an elitist there's nothing wrong with liking other studios

 

[Flint Marko]

Its not the height of the ratings, its the narrowness. CinemaScore barely lets you distinguish the immediate viewer reaction between really good and really bad movies, because almost all movies end up with scores in the top 15% of their range. If their measurement system means they will never, ever use the entire bottom half of the possible score? They should just cut off that entire half, and spread the top half across a larger set of numbers, so you can better distinguish differences in reaction.

Agreed. Green Lantern got a B, which is a pretty generous grade for that train wreck.

 

[Flint Marko]

I started this thread back in December as a way to gauge this forums thoughts on which studio mishandled their marvel properties more; now that Sony has given in and began cooperating with Marvel, and Fox's FFINO rights grab has bombed, do most people still feel that Sony is the worst offender of the two? I realize the poll is closed but I felt it was a question worth asking.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

Absolutley. since 2011 Sony gave us, Ghost Rider SOV, Amazing Spider-Man and Amazing Spider-Man 2, meanwhile Fox have given us X-Men First Class, The Wolverine, X-Men Days of Future Past, Kingsmen and Fan4stic.

Fox track-record is far stronger.

Don't worry your not an elitist there's nothing wrong with liking other studios

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I started this thread back in December as a way to gauge this forums thoughts on which studio mishandled their marvel properties more; now that Sony has given in and began cooperating with Marvel, and Fox's FFINO rights grab has bombed, do most people still feel that Sony is the worst offender of the two? I realize the poll is closed but I felt it was a question worth asking.

It is hard to even answer this at the moment because of the massive changes at Sony Pictures in the last few months. I would certainly say prior to this year, that Sony was easily more inept than Fox. But we don't really know what they will be like going forwards. Tom Rothman being in charge there doesn't give me a lot of hope though.

Fox should just give up on Fantastic Four though. They clearly have no idea how to make that property work.

 

[Boom]

Sony is worse collectively.

 

[Erzengel]

Fox has never gotten FF right. So they're 0-3. Then they have Wolverine Origins and X-Men: The Last Stand. That's 5 stinkers. Not including Elektra.

Sony has Spider-Man 3 and TASM2?

I know I voted Sony because of Fox's success with the Wolverine, FC and DOFP, but on my list of the worst CBM ever. Fox has more than a few in that bottom list.

 

[DACrowe]

The Fantastic Four is bad. It is worse than Spider-Man 3. But it is worse than X-Men: The Last Stand.

Still, a screw up here does not change the fact that X-Men: First Class and X-Men: Days of Future Past are great (better than Marvel Studios' 2015 films, I might add) and that The Wolverine started strong and was still decent in the end, despite an insipid finale. I'd also take that over Marvel's 2013 contemporaries from that year (Iron Man 3, Thor 2).

Sony has not made a good superhero movie since Spider-Man 2. In 2004. And while Spider-Man 2 is better than anything Fox has done, both The Amazing Spider-Man films and Ghost Rider films are worse than most superhero movies.

There is a reason the X-Men movies are stronger now than ever and Spider-Man got rolled into Marvel Studios. Now, however, perhaps the Fantastic Four should be as well.

 

[Filmfreak]

Let's put things in perspective here. Fox has done some terrible films in the past and the new FF seems to be their crown jewel but they're in a really good row with the X-Men movies. FC and DOFP were both fantastic, better than any MCU film for my taste, Deadpool looks amazing and I have high hopes for Apocalypse as well. Even the second Wolverine which was more of an ok movie was significantly better than the first one and I'm pretty sure the third one is going to be even better.

Sony on the other hand has more recent flops and not enough great movies to balance it out even though I personally like the first Amazing Spider-Man. But I'd say the worst Fox movies are definitely worse than the worst Sony ones. If we look at their current state though, Fox is definitely in a better place right now even with the atrocious 4 on the table.

Sure past mistakes can neither be erased nor they should and their more recent one doesn't help their case but if anyone seriously thinks that we're talking about the same Fox overall as the one before Rothman left then they're seriously blindfolded.

 

[Mjölnir]

I voted Sony way back, but luckily they made a good decision to join the MCU, even if that of course has more to do with the state of Sony as a whole, rather than just the Spider-Man franchise. Hopefully this will bring us the most comic like Spidey yet.

Fox has the worst franchise ever with what they've done with the Fantastic Four, so they've gone down a bit right now, but they are doing very well with the X-Men again, and Deadpool seems to be another great step.

I wish they had continued with Vaughn for the new X-Men though. First Class was better than DoFP imo, although mainly due to a clearly more solid and consistent script (but Vaughn was involved in the screenplay writing).

 

[Flint Marko]

Sonys cooperation with Marvel is certainly worth considering. That completely changes things in my opinion.

Absolutley. since 2011 Sony gave us, Ghost Rider SOV, Amazing Spider-Man and Amazing Spider-Man 2, meanwhile Fox have given us X-Men First Class, The Wolverine, X-Men Days of Future Past, Kingsmen and Fan4stic.

Fox track-record is far stronger.

I've seen you defend ASM on more than one occasion. You've continually made it clear that you wished that franchise would have continued, yet now you're acting like they're a blemish on their record. Quite the double standard.
And no, if we're looking at the track records, Fox has 7 out of 12 failures on their Marvel properties. That isn't a track record that is "far stronger".

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

And no, if we're looking at the track records, Fox has 7 out of 12 failures on their Marvel properties. That isn't a track record that is "far stronger".

I would say it is. Sony has 2 good movies out of 7, neither of which are from the last ten years. That's just pathetic.

 

[Flint Marko]

I would say it is. Sony has 2 good movies out of 7, neither of which are from the last ten years. That's just pathetic.

I actually find the first ASM to be fine. I don't think it should count as a failure, but I won't defend it too vehemently.
I also don't think Sony has made a movie as bad as Elektra, XMO:W, DD, or the three FF movies. Maybe ghost rider SOV but it's been a while since I've watched that movie.

 

[DACrowe]

Sonys cooperation with Marvel is certainly worth considering. That completely changes things in my opinion.

I do not think throwing in the towel and conceding that they cannot make good superhero movies in this new decade to be a mark of positivity and worthy of consideration. If anything, it is a sign of abject surrender and kind of pathetic.

I love the first two Spider-Man movies. But clearly those were successes in retrospect because of Sam Raimi. Everything bad about TASM films and GR can be seen in the margins of SM3 and even SM1 to a certain extent.

Since Rothman has left, the X-Men movies have been just as good if not better than most of the MCU. Of course this is my opinion, but it shows that Fox learned and grew. Sony never did. Essentially ceding creative decisions to Disney is not a mark of artistic inspiration.

 

[Flint Marko]

I do not think throwing in the towel and conceding that they cannot make good superhero movies in this new decade to be a mark of positivity and worthy of consideration. If anything, it is a sign of abject surrender and kind of pathetic.

I love the first two Spider-Man movies. But clearly those were successes in retrospect because of Sam Raimi. Everything bad about TASM films and GR can be seen in the margins of SM3 and even SM1 to a certain extent.

Since Rothman has left, the X-Men movies have been just as good if not better than most of the MCU. Of course this is my opinion, but it shows that Fox learned and grew. Sony never did. Essentially ceding creative decisions to Disney is not a mark of artistic inspiration.

Is it throwing in the towel when you're making the best business and creative decision possible? Sony as a company was in shambles, their problems go far beyond the clutter that was ASM 2 (I still hold onto the idea that ASM 1 was fine). Joining up with Marvel was a no-brainer, I'm not quite sure if I'd call that "throwing in the towel" and I certainly wouldn't call it "pathetic".
And, again, I still say Sony has never made a movie near as bad as several Fox's films, including the one currently in theaters.

 

[DACrowe]

You must have missed those two Ghost Rider movies and The Amazing Spider-Man 2 then.

It makes great business sense. But creatively, yes, it is an admission of incompetence. They cannot make good Spider-Man movies, so they are literally ceding major creative control and an unknown amount of stake in the film's grosses to Disney. For fans, it's great. And I believe (and really hope) Marvel will make great Spidey movies. But only because Sony has failed to do that for over a decade. That speaks volumes.