Game of Thrones - Book Readers' Thread - - - - - - - Part 24

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[Fist of Khonshu]

Does knowing it's coming completely the soften the blow when it actually comes to time to reap the costs of those actions (or on this case lack of action lol)? It's like someone who leads a very unhealthy lifestyle year after year knowing that it will probably have consequences down the road but knowing that their ongoing habits are going to cost them doesn't necessarily make it that much easier when it does cost them.

Pretty much.

ASOIAF is his creation, his "baby". And what's happened is akin to letting someone else finish raising your kid from age 12 on. He was paid and had some instant gratification with things that followed but it's a bitter pill to swallow now.

I'm alive certain that if he could go back and do things differently, he would --either delaying the deal with HBO, or revising his schedule to eliminate lots of relatively unimportant trips and diversions.

 

[TheFuture]

Good points, can't really argue. Maybe the dejection he's feeling right now will serve some good in propelling himself to the finish line.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Good points, can't really argue. Maybe the dejection he's feeling right now will serve some good in propelling himself to the finish line.

Yep. As nice as it was that he did the Dunk and Egg stuff...do that after you finish your series. Tolkien didn't stop in the middle of LOTR to write The Silmarillion. As he says, he doesn't have anyone to blame but himself.

 

[Roose Bolton]

He actually wrote Dunk and Egg just after he finished writing the first novel, around the same time he was working on Clash.

 

[Infinity9999x]

He actually wrote Dunk and Egg just after he finished writing the first novel, around the same time he was working on Clash.

Really? No way, then why did he slow down so much after Storm? Just old age?

 

[Roose Bolton]

Because he wanted the series to have a time jump after Storm to show the story was at a different point and wrote the beginnings of that, but then rewrote it when he realised that he'd have to either include a lot of flashbacks to what these characters (especially the children characters) were doing in that gap, or else make it that Autumn lasted for a few years and nothing happened in the intervening time. Neither idea appealed to him so he rewrote it to set in the immediate aftermath of Storm.

It was stuff like that, because he was setting up the next phase of his story he had to juggle and rewrite a lot of his planned material.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Because he wanted the series to have a time jump after Storm to show the story was at a different point and wrote the beginnings of that, but then rewrote it when he realised that he'd have to either include a lot of flashbacks to what these characters (especially the children characters) were doing in that gap, or else make it that Autumn lasted for a few years and nothing happened in the intervening time. Neither idea appealed to him so he rewrote it to set in the immediate aftermath of Storm.

It was stuff like that, because he was setting up the next phase of his story he had to juggle and rewrite a lot of his planned material.

Interesting. Though I could see why that would majorly slow him down for writing book 4, not sure why it's taken him so long between books 4 and 5 or 5 and now Winds of Winter. But, as I said earlier, the man is getting older, and I doubt that is going to help him speed up his ability to kick out material.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Books 4 and 5 were originally supposed to be one big novel, so a lot of his problems with writing them are connected. 5 especially was worse because he had several elements with Meereen that gave him trouble and needed to be rewritten, which he ultimately managed to get through by utilising Ser Barristan.

I think afterwards he definitely slowed down, but that's because after ADWD came out he basically had the dual role of writing the books, and also working as producer and screenwriter for the show, which he said is something he struggled with in terms of going between the script and prose. Plus the interviews and and promotion he did for the show. It's why he ultimately removed himself entirely from the process after season 4.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Books 4 and 5 were originally supposed to be one big novel, so a lot of his problems with writing them are connected. 5 especially was worse because he had several elements with Meereen that gave him trouble and needed to be rewritten, which he ultimately managed to get through by utilising Ser Barristan.

I think afterwards he definitely slowed down, but that's because after ADWD came out he basically had the dual role of writing the books, and also working as producer and screenwriter for the show, which he said is something he struggled with in terms of going between the script and prose. Plus the interviews and and promotion he did for the show. It's why he ultimately removed himself entirely from the process after season 4.

Ah, that makes sense. And looking back at the books, it's easy to see as well. I hope he finds a way to streamline things a bit more, because as I was saying at the end of last thread, he's getting dangerously close to Robert Jordan territory in terms of becoming lost in his own world.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Well I think the Greyjoys have significance in terms of being enemies and allies to Dany and moving her character further to where it needs to be, spiritually and geographically (though Aeron is entirely his own thing, which makes his inclusion in the show bizarre as hell.) The Martells too, though only one of them is a current POV, they're intertwined with the coming Dance of the Dragons. So I can see the why, and maybe the how of him choosing to add some of these new characters. Maybe not all of them, as I don't know what on earth Areo Hotah could possibly build up to, but who knows.

Surprisingly enough, I think the most relevant to core ASOIAF plot is actually Jon Connington, "Griff", mainly for the implications he brings to R+L=J

 

[Infinity9999x]

Well I think the Greyjoys have significance in terms of being enemies and allies to Dany and moving her character further to where it needs to be, spiritually and geographically (though Aeron is entirely his own thing, which makes his inclusion in the show bizarre as hell.) The Martells too, though only one of them is a current POV, they're intertwined with the coming Dance of the Dragons. So I can see the why, and maybe the how of him choosing to add some of these new characters. Maybe not all of them, as I don't know what on earth Areo Hotah could possibly build up to, but who knows.

Surprisingly enough, I think the most relevant to core ASOIAF plot is actually Jon Connington, "Griff", mainly for the implications he brings to R+L=J

Yeah, as far as both the Greyjoys and Martells are concerned, I'll have to see how they actually play out. So far they haven't influenced much. And as I said before, if Crows Eye ends up being essentially defeated by Danny and she just takes his ships...then I don't really mind the condensing of it in the show.

Griff is the one that most surprised me in terms of not being included...which makes me wonder if he really is who he thinks he is. Or if he'll actually end up contributing much to the overall story. In the same vein, if he goes to Westeros at the same time as Dany and tries to confront her and she just roasts him, I don't mind him being cut either.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Well I've a mind that Victarion gives his ships to Dany willingly at this point, given how fanatically in love with her Moqorro made him in ADWD (along with making him undead), so I think he'll serve as some of the added muscle she'll need getting back to Westeros. The Crow's Eye is a bit different because he's also attacking Oldtown in the books, and I can only imagine there's something in the Citadel he's looking for, which some have speculated is the Horn of Winter. That leads me to think he's a Dany villain, but also sets up the WW invasion too. A big point is made about "Dead things in the water" and Moqorro calls the Drowned God a demon in service of the Great Other.

With Griff....I think that certain young man he's raising ties into something else. ACoK described a false Prophet, and Dany is called the "Slayer of Lies". So I think there's something to that. Whereas Jon Connington, Rhaegar's close friend...well I think he and another Jon have a lot to talk about.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Well I've a mind that Victarion gives his ships to Dany willingly at this point, given how fanatically in love with her Moqorro made him in ADWD (along with making him undead), so I think he'll serve as some of the added muscle she'll need getting back to Westeros. The Crow's Eye is a bit different because he's also attacking Oldtown in the books, and I can only imagine there's something in the Citadel he's looking for, which some have speculated is the Horn of Winter. That leads me to think he's a Dany villain, but also sets up the WW invasion too. A big point is made about "Dead things in the water" and Moqorro calls the Drowned God a demon in service of the Great Other.

With Griff....I think that certain young man he's raising ties into something else. ACoK described a false Prophet, and Dany is called the "Slayer of Lies". So I think there's something to that. Whereas Jon Connington, Rhaegar's close friend...well I think he and another Jon have a lot to talk about.

I wouldn't mind seeing that. I'd br down with Victation joining the Danny camp. And I agree with you on Griff, I meant "young Griff" when I said Griff above in terms of him not being who he thinks he is.

 

[Roose Bolton]

The biggest thing with Young Griff, is that he ties into Varys and this idea that Varys isn't who he sells himself as to Tyrion and co. The show makes it seem like he's genuine about wanting to help the realm and is all for Dany as queen, whereas in the books I think with Young Griff it shows that the guy actually has an agenda that might not be so benevolent. So I wonder what exactly that means for the two portrayals.

 

[godisawesome]

I think part of GRRM's time issue also deals with the transition from very deconstructive approaches to fantasy in the first few books to what's going to be a bit of a reconstruction in the latter half. I mean, Martin's schtick was not really shocking swerves as much as applying real world consequences and logistics to fantasy tropes.

And we're now likely to have prophecies fulfilled, protagonists coming out on top, a fantasy ninja, and other stuff that, if we were just dropped into thanks to a time skip, would clash with the old style.

 

[Infinity9999x]

The biggest thing with Young Griff, is that he ties into Varys and this idea that Varys isn't who he sells himself as to Tyrion and co. The show makes it seem like he's genuine about wanting to help the realm and is all for Dany as queen, whereas in the books I think with Young Griff it shows that the guy actually has an agenda that might not be so benevolent. So I wonder what exactly that means for the two portrayals.

Good point. I wonder that too, Vary's motivations in the book did seem much more clouded, especially after he went after Kevan. I wonder how they'll play that out.

 

[Roose Bolton]

From what I've heard

Spoiler

Pycelle, at the very least dies in a different fashion than in the books.

 

[Ezio Auditore]

I watched the trailer again and saw that scene involving two shadows. One stabbing the other in the back. And people arguing whether it was Jaime backstabbing Aerys or The Mountain killing Pycelle. And im 100% sure it is Jaime. If you pay atention and pause the scene, the shadow that stabs has no helmet (you could even see Jaime's haircut) and the one being stabbed seems to have long hair and a crown.

 

[Reek]

problem is there has been no mention of any Mad King flashbacks... even in the full on season spoilers.

but who knows... I am sticking with it being Pycelle being stabbed by someone... maybe Qyburn.

(I hope its the mad king though lol )

 

[Roose Bolton]

Qyburn has a good year this season.

 

[Reek]

 

[Reek]

 

[Victarion]

There was telepathy at play in deciding Hodor's fate.