Grant Morrison....W. T. F?

[Cain]

Makes sense that "a fate worse than death" = Batman taking a life with a gun. Two if you count that Darkseid reincarneted through Terrible Dan Turpin. Makes sense he'd feel disgusted to be Batman for a while.

 

[Motown Marvel]

I wouldn't say it's that ridiculous in premise, just that it was poorly executed.

i disagree with the idea it was poorly executed, but thats a far more rational opinion/criticism than what i've seen around here. anyone who thinks this is the worst batman story in recent memory clearly never read Lapham's "city of crime".

 

[CConn]

I was just going to mention that story.

That made me want Wolverine to pop into a panel and kill Batman just to end the misery.

 

[Cain]

If it's between reading trash like Grotesk or a Batman story by Grant Morisson, I'll take Morisson anyday.

 

[batpawn]

Also, Broken City was god damn awful. Azzarello turned Batman from the worlds greatest detective into an idiot who couldn't solve the murder of a petty thug, while the Joker, who was locked up in Arkham the entire god damn time, somehow knew for no reason at all other than Azzarello wanted to shoe-horn in an appearance. Ugh.

was he any better in hush? seriously, i find it pretty irritading that people don't really seem to get "why" he couldn't solve the puzzle. we got a batman who went on with the case in a completely different view point. sure, he is the world's greatest detective, but if there is anything that could distract him, if there is some kind of his own "kryptonite", it is his own past and past trauma. he just couldn't see the boy being the murderer, because he saw himself inside of the boy. i think that azzarello handled that pretty well and delivered a wonderful noir story. i don't need my batman to be this over the top, larger than life character. so broken city pretty much was an enjoyable run of it's own, imo.

@topic
since miss devin grayson and ed brubaker left the batman comics, i thought that the comics really fell apart. in my opinion, all batman comic between 2003 to 2006 were just ridiculous, even the controversial larry hama run was more entertaining than the pseudo-serious stuff from that time period. i can understand why people don't like morrison's run, and that's okay. but that doesn't change anything on the matter of fact that i REALLY love it. it has got in one point the dark and serious batman without getting too serious with the material itself. maybe i'm just an old morrison fanboy

 

[Daredevil_2003]

^ Sounds like it.

After some thought and a few alcoholic beverages I think I'm gonna give Morrison's run another chance...see if I was just too shocked and therefore put off by it at first read.

 

[Majic Walrus]

was he any better in hush? seriously, i find it pretty irritading that people don't really seem to get "why" he couldn't solve the puzzle. we got a batman who went on with the case in a completely different view point. sure, he is the world's greatest detective, but if there is anything that could distract him, if there is some kind of his own "kryptonite", it is his own past and past trauma. he just couldn't see the boy being the murderer, because he saw himself inside of the boy. i think that azzarello handled that pretty well and delivered a wonderful noir story. i don't need my batman to be this over the top, larger than life character. so broken city pretty much was an enjoyable run of it's own, imo.

...

 

[Daredevil_2003]

Ok I'm up to 670, again. Still not really diggin it. It's better than the first read, but overall I'm still far from impressed and not liking the style and content. But, I'll keep plodding through and see if it has a satisfying conclusion. Or at least one where all this crap makes sense...

 

[AceOfKnaves]

I couldn't even stomach most of R.I.P. I tried and it just didn't happen. Friggen awful. Batman should not be written like a Jesus that knows when anything and everything might happen. His excuse at the end for not breaking down? Holy **** I wanted to burn the comic.

 

[Dark Victory]

I don't know...a lot of people hate his current run and I haven't enjoyed some issues, but all of his arcs are worth the money(yes, even the overpriced hardcover, Resurrection of Ra's) just for that one issue or one panel like the Joker in Batman And Son screaming "I FINALLY KILLED BATMAN IN FRONT OF A BUNCH OF VUNERABLE, DISABLED KIDS!!!!"...

...or like that annual in Resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul...

...or like Bruce pimp-stomping one of the fake batmen in The Black Glove...

...or like Bruce "breaking up" with Jezebel in R.I.P....

Hell, I bet Grant's next arc, Bruce comes out of nowhere, kicks some ass and tea bags Dr. Hurts dead body Halo style after Hurt embarrassingly killed himself by reading DK2.

 

[usmcrice0311]

picked up #683 and 684 today, all i can do is sigh

 

[Dark Victory]

^#682 and #683 were tie-ins to Final Crisis. It was awesome to see Bruce's history in a wacked out way even if they were confusing(I haven't read Final Crisis so I was lost). Det. Comics #851 and Batman #684 were a two part arc by Denny O'neil.

 

[Daredevil_2003]

Wow...The Joker's really nucking futs in this run...the most entertaining thing about it, so far. You think they'll keep the scars or retcon 'em as soon as Grant pisses off (hopefull soon )?

I say keep 'em...I like the scarred look ever since I first saw Bermejo's concept drawing a couple years ago.

 

[CConn]

O'Neil's arc sucked.

 

[margon]

yeah it was kinda depressing. if he never writes anything again that will be his last Batman story

 

[Cain]

O'Neil's arc sucked.

That's quite an understatement. This guy needs to just stay retired and leave the plotting to the current generation of writers. It's a good thing I just read but didn't buy 'tec 852 and Batman 684 had I spent $6 on it I'd be a lot more upset. The upcoming Gotham Gazzette sounds like everything I expected this underdeveloped lame ass story to be.

 

[Drz]

I liked the art on the story, but i didn't like how Gordon kept calling Nightwing a son and how he didn't barely have any faith on him at all. I did enjoy seeing Nightwing stressed of Bruce's disappearance and how he mentally prepares himself for a fight withouth his mentor anymore.

 

[TruerToTheCore]

just for that one issue or one panel like the Joker in Batman And Son screaming "I FINALLY KILLED BATMAN IN FRONT OF A BUNCH OF VUNERABLE, DISABLED KIDS!!!!"...

did you get what Morrison was trying to say with that or was it all for nothing?

 

[margon]

^ what do you reckon it is? what's the deal with the kids he cannot be talking about the readers right ha ha?

I took that whole intro scene as throwing out and saying goodbye to the last decade of gritty 'real crime' nonsense in batman comics. Also it's foreshadowing what batman may likely end up doing to Darkseid in FC6. "I killed Batman" is because Joker put Bruce on the path to this "death" of sorts many years ago, and the first page is telling us straight up what the run we're about to read is all about. Joker set about killing batman when he drove him to the Thogal ritual, an event which is just emblematic of Batmans whole career, trying to understand and conquer evil/death/the gaping void. Joker killed Batman by playing the game with him so relentlessly, the Thogal is just shorthand for that and a device for the hallucinations weirdness/fun. but now Batman seems poised to face down death/evil itself so maybe they'll both just cancel each other out, batman & joker

(Morrison just throws away important points and reincorporates useless Silver Age ones).

the heck are you talking about? his whole run is about coalescing various eras of continuity into one. It's love letter to batman mythology. you either haven't been reading properly or you've made up your mind and you're prejudiced for some reason . what's been thrown out? whether or not you agree it's quality or not is one thing but to say it disregards continuity is not really a matter for subjective opinion, the fact that he's basically humping continuity is too overbearing

I can see how you'd say the silver age stuff is useless- zur en rah and the league of heroes could have easily been left behind - but the point is that's they're merely devices to tell a contemporary story (which is all new) about delving into the past and re-examining the whole history and batman's purpose from then to now. why are you hatin on this?

 

[BubbaGump]

^ what do you reckon it is? what's the deal with the kids he cannot be talking about the readers right ha ha?

I took that whole intro scene as throwing out and saying goodbye to the last decade of gritty 'real crime' nonsense in batman comics. Also it's foreshadowing what batman may likely end up doing to Darkseid in FC6. "I killed Batman" is because Joker put Bruce on the path to this "death" of sorts many years ago, and the first page is telling us straight up what the run we're about to read is all about. Joker set about killing batman when he drove him to the Thogal ritual, an event which is just emblematic of Batmans whole career, trying to understand and conquer evil/death/the gaping void. Joker killed Batman by playing the game with him so relentlessly, the Thogal is just shorthand for that and a device for the hallucinations weirdness/fun. but now Batman seems poised to face down death/evil itself so maybe they'll both just cancel each other out, batman & joker





the heck are you talking about? his whole run is about coalescing various eras of continuity into one. It's love letter to batman mythology. you either haven't been reading properly or you've made up your mind and you're prejudiced for some reason . what's been thrown out? whether or not you agree it's quality or not is one thing but to say it disregards continuity is not really a matter for subjective opinion, the fact that he's basically humping continuity is too overbearing

I can see how you'd say the silver age stuff is useless- zur en rah and the league of heroes could have easily been left behind - but the point is that's they're merely devices to tell a contemporary story (which is all new) about delving into the past and re-examining the whole history and batman's purpose from then to now. why are you hatin on this?

the heck are you talking about? his whole run is about coalescing various eras of continuity into one. It's love letter to batman mythology. you either haven't been reading properly or you've made up your mind and you're prejudiced for some reason . what's been thrown out? whether or not you agree it's quality or not is one thing but to say it disregards continuity is not really a matter for subjective opinion, the fact that he's basically humping continuity is too overbearing

Well I gave up 3 issues into RIP but I've been following Morrison since Batman and Son. I decided it wasn't worth shelling out money over. My prejudice has been frustratingly set in stone and it's not likely to change. Listen, I don't flame Morrison or go into the RIP threads bashing him to bits. A passing remark about how I prefer Dini in the Detective threads, but I'm just expressing my view point. They're hardly harmful passing remarks. I'm a conservative Bat-fan, though I feel there are good "out-there" stories and bad "safe" stories as well. In my opinion, Dini's doing good well-told "safe" stories and Morrison's doing a bad out-there story. I don't shove it down anyone's throat. In fact, I just ignored RIP after I stopped following it. No biggie.

As for the humping continuity though--he did. Infinite Crisis pretty much wiped the Silver Age and started fresh with Batman Year One (in my eyes, the perfect way). Morrison brought all that craziness back in a way that wouldn't fit in the current continuity. So yes, it's fact--he screwed continuity and that's not subjective at all.

I can see how you'd say the silver age stuff is useless- zur en rah and the league of heroes could have easily been left behind - but the point is that's they're merely devices to tell a contemporary story (which is all new) about delving into the past and re-examining the whole history and batman's purpose from then to now. why are you hatin on this?

I'm not hating on it. I hate it, but I'm not hating on it, if it makes sense. Aside from some passing remarks I've been quietly passive on RIP. I've just ignored it and kept on following the other Batman titles. I frankly don't care about it, and as a consumer I'm entitled to ignore arcs I don't care about. It's just not my type of story and it's a story I don't like like anyway. I cannot...will not allow myself to like this arc /Loeb (who I also cannot and will not allow myself to like either).

I'm a highly biased poster, but I’m not that outspoken. I make my views heard but I’m hardly hating on RIP. And by the way, it’s been nice arguing back and forth with you as you seem pretty respectful and well composed unlike a bunch of other crazy ****ers here.

 

[MaskedManJRK]

I've been enjoying Morrison's run from the beginning, really. I don't quite get why it's confusing to so many people. There's things that didn't quite make sense during it (espicially during the R.I.P. arc), but I trusted in Morrison to tie it all back up in the end.

And before you ask--no, I haven't taken any of Morrison's interdemensional space drugs to get it. If I did, I wouldn't be sitting here typing on a superhero message board--I would be writing comics and making some money.

Oh, on some complaints given for Broken City--there are slight inconsistancies, but that is mostly because it was never meant to be in the main title. It was going to be a one-off graphic novel, but was split up when the DC editors realized there was a block missing after Hush. Even still, the only possible difference is the change from Killer Croc, and even then, I believe it was said that they found a way to change him back off-panel at the end of Hush.

I also don't get why there's talk of him "crossing the line." He never killed anyone--which, if you'll remember the movie, is his "one rule"--and stuff like putting a thug's hand near a turning car fan isn't really all that different from, say, threatening a thug with pouring acid on him (B:TAS "Clayface") or Batman throwing someone off a high building to pull him up when he decides to talk (Det. Comics #822).

 

[jewmaican20]

O'Neil's arc sucked.

It's a sad day indeed when I have to agree wholly with such a statement.

Actually, "sucked" is being kind.

I haven't felt this embarassed for one of my writing heroes since Stan Lee's The Last Fantastic Four Story from last year.

 

[Saint]

cain was absolutely right when he said that batman comics sucked from 03-06...you'd think they'd try to keep some momentum after hush, but they dashed it with hack writing

Is Winnick's run included in your denouncement? I think that would be a tremendous mistake.

 

[The Joker]

Agreed. I loved Under the Hood.

 

[TruerToTheCore]

^ what do you reckon it is? what's the deal with the kids he cannot be talking about the readers right ha ha?

I took that whole intro scene as throwing out and saying goodbye to the last decade of gritty 'real crime' nonsense in batman comics. Also it's foreshadowing what batman may likely end up doing to Darkseid in FC6. "I killed Batman" is because Joker put Bruce on the path to this "death" of sorts many years ago, and the first page is telling us straight up what the run we're about to read is all about. Joker set about killing batman when he drove him to the Thogal ritual, an event which is just emblematic of Batmans whole career, trying to understand and conquer evil/death/the gaping void. Joker killed Batman by playing the game with him so relentlessly, the Thogal is just shorthand for that and a device for the hallucinations weirdness/fun. but now Batman seems poised to face down death/evil itself so maybe they'll both just cancel each other out, batman & joker

More or less, yes. I know many took it as just another ****ed-up Joker moment, but it was more symbolic. Batman with a gun shooting the Joker in the face during a totally exagerrated over-the-top situation (I mean, disabled kids on a helicopter watching Batman getting killed)as a metaphor for the Batjerk, and then the real Batman arriving, even throwing the Joker into a garbage dumb, just to hear that he is still alive. Grim n' grity. One of the few good moments in Morrison's run.