Honestly, what are your thoughts on Kill Bill?

[Heretic]

Are you serious? I honestly can't tell if you are being a troll or being serious because if it's the latter, that is the biggest overreaction I've seen in a hot minute.

Not only am I serious, I am not over-reacting. According to Tarantino...Superman disrespects us...you CAN NOT claim otherwise without just flat out misrepresenting the scene.

In fact...here is the quote:

"Superman didn’t become Superman. Superman was born Superman. When Superman wakes up in the morning, he’s Superman. His alter ego is Clark Kent. His outfit with the big red “S” – that’s the blanket he was wrapped in as a baby when the Kents found him. Those are his clothes. What Kent wears – the glasses, the business suit – that’s the costume. That’s the costume Superman wears to blend in with us.

Clark Kent is how Superman views us. And what are the characteristics of Clark Kent? He’s weak… He’s unsure of himself… He’s a coward.

Clark Kent is Superman’s critique on the whole human race."

Undeniable...Superman views us as weak, unsure cowards. You CAN NOT argue that this is not the point of that dialogue. That scene created an inaccurate view of Superman that has since infected even the comic books.

 

[Lorus]

Not only am I serious, I am not over-reacting. According to Tarantino...Superman disrespects us...you CAN NOT claim otherwise without just flat out misrepresenting the scene.

In fact...here is the quote:

"Superman didn’t become Superman. Superman was born Superman. When Superman wakes up in the morning, he’s Superman. His alter ego is Clark Kent. His outfit with the big red “S” – that’s the blanket he was wrapped in as a baby when the Kents found him. Those are his clothes. What Kent wears – the glasses, the business suit – that’s the costume. That’s the costume Superman wears to blend in with us.

Clark Kent is how Superman views us. And what are the characteristics of Clark Kent? He’s weak… He’s unsure of himself… He’s a coward.

Clark Kent is Superman’s critique on the whole human race."

Undeniable...Superman views us as weak, unsure cowards. You CAN NOT argue that this is not the point of that dialogue. That scene created an inaccurate view of Superman that has since infected even the comic books.

You're overreacting to a ridiculous degree. All that is one fictional character's personal interpretation of another fictional character. It characterises Bill, nothing more, nothing less. If you're looking at it as Tarantino's thesis on the character of Superman that is to inform all future interpretations then you're being ridiculous. Do you also think Tarantino believes black people to be genetically predisposed to subservience?

 

[Heretic]

You're overreacting to a ridiculous degree. All that is one fictional character's personal interpretation of another fictional character. It characterises Bill, nothing more, nothing less. If you're looking at it as Tarantino's thesis on the character of Superman that is to inform all future interpretations then you're being ridiculous. Do you also think Tarantino believes black people to be genetically predisposed to subservience?

Ah...so you're suggesting that this scene was just an intentionally incorrect monologue/throwaway scene. I disagree.

Unfortunately, since the release of the movie I have seen... oh my...hundreds???...of people use this scene as their basis of telling me who Superman is. These people don't read the comics, but this view of Superman influenced who they believe Superman is.

Regardless of Tarentino's intention, the effect was the same. While it is not solely to blame for the public's rejection of the definitive Superman, it certainly did not help matters. Of course, much of the blame goes onto the false idea that Superman is too powerful, too hard to write because of his goodness. In fact, the things that make him different don't make him hard to write so much as make the possible obstacles different. People want Superman to be like Batman and Wolverine, including the writers and editors at DC apparently.

 

[Tanin]

Since DC Owns him that is their right to change him as much as they'd like. It wouldn't be the first time.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Are you serious? I honestly can't tell if you are being a troll or being serious because if it's the latter, that is the biggest overreaction I've seen in a hot minute.

I hated Godfather because of that one guy's shoes. I'm not kidding, one look at those awful shoes and poof! movie ruined. What the hell was FFC thinking? To this day I can't watch it because of those stupid shoes.

 

[Heretic]

I hated Godfather because of that one guy's shoes. I'm not kidding, one look at those awful shoes and poof! movie ruined. What the hell was FFC thinking? To this day I can't watch it because of those stupid shoes.

You are comparing shoes to literally THE scene in the film??? The scene with that Superman monologue in Kill Bill is essentially the "money" scene of the entire two films...and is the centerpiece of that scene. Shoes, to my recollection, are hardly an issue at all in The Godfather.

 

[Heretic]

Since DC Owns him that is their right to change him as much as they'd like. It wouldn't be the first time.

Sure...they have the right to take an iconic character and turn him into something trendy that might make them some quick money.

As a fan though...I prefer to think that characters, once defined, should remain true to that definition. Some characters are defined quickly, others may take decades of reworking until you get the right balance. In 2013, it is pretty clear that Batman is The Dark Knight...and therefore going back to the goofy Adam West styled Batman wouldn't be right for the character.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

You are comparing shoes to literally THE scene in the film??? The scene with that Superman monologue in Kill Bill is essentially the "money" scene of the entire two films...and is the centerpiece of that scene. Shoes, to my recollection, are hardly an issue at all in The Godfather.

I really wish you wouldn't belittle and dismiss my feelings on shoes.

You're overreacting to a ridiculous degree. All that is one fictional character's personal interpretation of another fictional character. It characterises Bill, nothing more, nothing less. If you're looking at it as Tarantino's thesis on the character of Superman that is to inform all future interpretations then you're being ridiculous. Do you also think Tarantino believes black people to be genetically predisposed to subservience?

But seriously, this.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Hey guys, what are we, talkin' bout? Kill Bill? (See's conversation about shoes and Superman) I'll... I'll let myself out.

 

[Teelie]

Better than Superman's shoes I guess.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Hey guys, what are we, talkin' bout? Kill Bill? (See's conversation about shoes and Superman) I'll... I'll let myself out.

Nah, stick around. it just got sidetracked by some silliness for a bit.

 

[Heretic]

Sidetracked? I'm talking about THE KEY MONOLOGUE in THE KEY SCENE in the Kill Bill movies and how it changed the general public's view of a formerly iconic character!

 

[Whiskey Tango]

An iconic character (I dispute the formerly) that has an entire forum of his own. This is not a Superman thread, in case you missed the title, amigo.

 

[Heretic]

Nope, didn't miss the title. It is not my fault that Tarantino made a Superman monologue the key scene in his film. On a website called Superhero Hype, it should be expected that when relevant, superheroes will be discussed. Tarantino himself made Superman relevant to Kill Bill discussions. Your problem is not with me, it is with the many, many, many people who think that the Superman monologue is an accurate description of Superman.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Your problem

I don't have a problem with it, chief.

 

[Duke]

I honestly thought Kill Bill was a good action film with a nice homage to the martial arts films from the 70's era. The only thing I didn't like from it was the short animation scene in the movie, it really wasn't needed.

 

[Heretic]

Some do, apparently. These people apparently haven't seen Kill Bill, and are unaware that a misguided Superman monologue is considered the key scene in the movies...not to mention the fact that millions of people believe that Tarantino is the infallible, almost biblical word on pop culture...so this scene has been one of many factors in reducing what was an iconic character into a trendy clone of most other comic book characters.

Suddenly, critique of Tarantino is not allowed in a Kill Bill thread??? And we can't discuss the cultural impact of the most important scene in Kill Bill???

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I am a huge Superman fan (I'm sure my screen name is far too vague for any to guess that) and I don't think that Bill's spiel in Vol. 2 has had any effect on the mass audience/general populations view on Supes at all. Talk to people outside of a genrr fan internet forum and you'll see I'm right.

I remember seeing KB:Vol. 1 in the theatres 4 times and lapping it up like a starving man would a steak dinner. I will leave the withering critiques to the hard core cineaste cognacentti. I loved it then and I love it and Vol. 2 now. The Tarantino XX collection has an incredible Blu ray copy that makes it look even better at home than the theatres to my mind.

Tarantino called the Mariachi films ROBERT R.'s DOLLARS TRILOGY. Well I think KB is Quentin's James Bond universe. I would love at least 2 more films from that world. I want a film about Bill, and how he came to be, and I want a movie about Vernita's daughter seeking out Kiddo as a teen. Slim to none chance at that, but I said it and I'm not taking it back!

 

[Lord]

I think the discussion actually fits here.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

a misguided Superman monologue is considered the key scene in the movies

millions of people believe that Tarantino is the infallible, almost biblical word on pop culture

reducing what was an iconic character into a trendy clone of most other comic book characters

Is everything you say hilariously overexaggerated?

I am a huge Superman fan (I'm sure my screen name is far too vague for any to guess that) and I don't think that Bill's spiel in Vol. 2 has had any effect on the mass audience/general populations view on Supes at all. Talk to people outside of a genrr fan internet forum and you'll see I'm right.

 

[Warhammer]

Heretic, reading your responses have me literally giggling like a little school girl. Usually trolls are just assh***s, but you have me dying. Good job, man. And Whiskey's post about the shoes.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I am just gonna throw this out there... Is Heretic actually Kurosawa? Or at least a friend/supporter/acolyte of K's?

 

[Warhammer]

Maybe. There have been weirder things that happened on this forum.

 

[James]

Bill's view of Superman in Kill Bill wasn't even original, plenty of Superman comics had offered that perspective over the years.

The only part that bugged me is when Bill mentions the art not being very good...which of the several thousand artists that have worked on Superman was he referring too? That seemed like a really clumsy piece of dialogue.

 

[Heretic]

Bill's view of Superman in Kill Bill wasn't even original, plenty of Superman comics had offered that perspective over the years.

The only part that bugged me is when Bill mentions the art not being very good...which of the several thousand artists that have worked on Superman was he referring too? That seemed like a really clumsy piece of dialogue.

Not original...but it specifically spread the concept to non-comics readers. I can't even tell you how many times I've had a non-comic reader use Kill Bill as their back-up for why Superman looks down on the human race.