How would you describe Batman Returns?

[aragen]

I enjoyed Batman Returns. That was my childhood movie. I loved the mood and the car.
My parents hated the Devito Penguin but I loved him. My mom tried to shield me away from the Penguin death scene but I watched it anyway. I was 2 years old.

 

[Cain]

Well, I must be mistaken because the version I saw, she fell to her death. Cats brought her back to life. Throughout the film she got shot, choked and fell from great heights but survived. So all these things were luck escapes and coincidences? The intention of Burton was pretty obvious. She was a normal woman who, after a supernatural event, became Catwoman. It was never explicit but was certainly there.

That's the beauty of interpretation it was never explicitly stated so we really don't know which is one of the things I like about Burton's style. You want to believe a more literal circumstance happened. While there are others who believe the multiple awnings broke her fall and she came back the way she did out of extreme shock. There are those that believe when she didn't collapse when she was shot up by Shreck it wasn't because she had multiple lives, it was because of her adrenaline. Because you know stranger things have indeed happened to people in the real world believe it or not.

He won't sit back and kill people in his Batmobile, burning them alive or gunning them down with machine guns. See any of TAS, BB or TDK for a closer interpretation.

FYI Batman has gunned down villains with the machine gun from his batplane in stories by his very own creators Bill Finger and Bob Kane. The comics by these guys were instrumental in influencing both Burton movies. They were some of the only ones that he was actually exposed to by Batman movie executive producer Michael Uslan as he wasn't a comic book fan and needed stuff to reference. With such a multi-faceted character as Batman one has to ask a closer interpretation to what exactly? there is no definitive Batman though we all have our preferences as to which one we enjoy. 70's & 80's comic Batman for example is the bees knees to me but I'm sure others might like the current Batman better.

I find it catastrophic that Gotham would think Batman would just randomly kidnap and murder someone. The guy who always saves the day and vanishes, all of a sudden kills an innocent person and leaves the murder weapon.

Well to their credit this movie and it's predecessor show that Batman is not beyond being overtly brutal, still is a mystery to most in a way and that a great deal of the city is made up of dense and naive citizens. Also for what it's worth while Gordon plays a very minimal role in the film much again like in those early Golden Age comics at least he was represented as the one who gave Batman the benefit of the doubt. The one who didn't jump to the conclusion that Batman was straight up guilty in kidnapping and killing the ice princess.

Burton makes these kinds of films. Weird, twisted fairytales with supernatural themes. That's his thing. He made BR one of his many twisted films and made it somewhat interesting but it is not a Batman story.

How is it not a Batman story? because it doesn't follow conventions? that's like me saying Gotham by Gaslight and Dark Joker: The Wild aren't Batman stories cause they're so different from the norm. Yet they still are because they retain a lot of the themes from the overall mythology. So does this movie specifically vigilantism, duality and loneliness.

 

[30+Dark]

I think Jett from BOF is pretty much able to get down my thoughts on Batman Returns from his review and his blog.

And now I'm done commenting on Returns because I've just enterted complaining territory with this post.

I strongly disagree with "Jett"'s take on Returns, his hatred for that film, and that hateful blog is one of the many reasons I stopped reading BOF, and will never return.

As for Batman Returns I think its one of the greatest Batman films ever made. I can understand if someone doesnt like it because its not how they see "their" Batman, but the O.P's reasons did seem a bit weak.

 

[Batman2011]

Katie Holmes was a weakest (major) link in Batman Begins, fact. Maggie Gyllenhaal, well, I really liked her performance. "She sucked. She wasn't hot." Who says that women are supposed to be hot?

Also, we don't get mad at you because you're critizing a Batman movie. We just think that your reasons of hating Batman Returns are lame.

So what if my reasons are lame? I've met other people online who have lame reasons for criticizing Batman Begins. They say stupid crap like this:

"Batman Begins is a good over the top action movie but it doesn't feel like a Batman movie."

"Nolan's Gotham City doesn't feel like Gotham City to me."

"Nolan created a realistic crime drama but as soon as Batman shows up he looks like he doesn't belong there."

These are all lame reasons for criticizing Batman Begins in my opinion. What they're really trying to say is Batman Begins didn't feel like a Tim Burton movie.

 

[The Joker]

Well Pat Hingle doesn't have white hair does he?

So what? Michael Gough and Michael Caine were not balding or had a moustache like Alfred of the comics does. Did that bother you, too?

Did Ledger's Joker bother you having long greasy hair, messily applied make up, and a cut smile?

And why do smart asses like you get mad at me for criticizing a Batman movie?

Smart asses? Don't get touchy just because people question your logic and opinions. If that bothers you, then just don't say anything, because that's what these message boards are for. Discussing opinions.

Second, I am not mad at you. Why would I be mad at you? What you think doesn't affect me in any way whatsoever. I find alot of flaws with your logic of disliking this movie because alot of your criticisms can be applied to Nolan's movies.

Do you honestly believe that Batman directors can do no wrong?

Of course not. Where did I say that?

All of the directors, ALL of them have made mistakes.

 

[Batman2011]

Smart asses? Don't get touchy.

Well it sounded like you guys were getting touchy when I criticized Batman Returns. Anyway Batman Returns is just like Superman II it's not as good as the original...The Dark Knight is the exact opposite a lot of people think The Dark Knight is better than Batman Begins.

 

[theMan-Bat]

Thanks, Cain. Great answers. You saved me from all that typing.

Well it sounded like you guys were getting touchy when I criticized Batman Returns. Anyway Batman Returns is just like Superman II it's not as good as the original...The Dark Knight is the exact opposite a lot of people think The Dark Knight is better than Batman Begins.

I think Batman Returns is better than all of them. To each his own.

 

[Swordmaster]

I love Batman Returns, my favorite of the first four Batman films. I always make a point to watch it at least twice around the Christmas season.

 

[Bat Attack]

This thread should be closed. It's pointless, and is, to put it frankly, a blemish on these forums.

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

Some people are just way too picky, and whine like little children not getting the toy theyre begging their mommy for lol.

 

[Darkseid1]

So what if my reasons are lame? I've met other people online who have lame reasons for criticizing Batman Begins. They say stupid crap like this:

"Batman Begins is a good over the top action movie but it doesn't feel like a Batman movie."

"Nolan's Gotham City doesn't feel like Gotham City to me."

"Nolan created a realistic crime drama but as soon as Batman shows up he looks like he doesn't belong there."

These are all lame reasons for criticizing Batman Begins in my opinion. What they're really trying to say is Batman Begins didn't feel like a Tim Burton movie.

and this post just summed up your reason for this thread. you didnt like Returns because it didnt feel like a Nolan film.

I honestly dont understand how someone can nit pick one directors Batman movie and completely look over all the "wrong" and "not true to the character" crap that another bat director does.

and Burtons vision has had more of an impact on the rest of the Batman world than any other director. Fact. So he must have done something right, huh?

 

[Bat-Mite]

I don't think it sucks at all. As a matter of fact, I think it's superior to it's predecessor by far. Loved Michelle Pfeiffer as Catwoman, and Devito was both hilarious and tragic as the Penguin. And, of course, Keaton and Gough were both magnificent. I still love the part where Batman's cruising through the empty streets of Gotham in the batmobile at night. Sure, there were a few parts of the film that were over the top, but that's to be expected with Tim Burton.

 

[StylishHokie21]

Well it sounded like you guys were getting touchy when I criticized Batman Returns. Anyway Batman Returns is just like Superman II it's not as good as the original...The Dark Knight is the exact opposite a lot of people think The Dark Knight is better than Batman Begins.

Not exactly. I think Superman 2 is better than the original, so I don't know where you got that from. I consider The Dark Knight better than Begins because it improves on a lot of things. The Dark Knight still has its flaws though just like Batman Returns does.

 

[El Payaso]

Not exactly. I think Superman 2 is better than the original, so I don't know where you got that from. I consider The Dark Knight better than Begins because it improves on a lot of things. The Dark Knight still has its flaws though just like Batman Returns does.

TDK might have flaws but damn, it was so close to perfection that any flaw (if there is any) is just part of the beauty of it. TDK was so much better than Begins in every aspect I cannot but praise the Nolan brothers for it and thank God for Goyer not writing the dialogues.

TDK might be flawed but it's better than Batman Retuns. And I tell you I totally love Returns.

 

[Bat Attack]

TDK might have flaws but damn, it was so close to perfection that any flaw (if there is any) is just part of the beauty of it. TDK was so much better than Begins in every aspect I cannot but praise the Nolan brothers for it and thank God for Goyer not writing the dialogues.

TDK might be flawed but it's better than Batman Retuns. And I tell you I totally love Returns.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[StylishHokie21]

TDK might have flaws but damn, it was so close to perfection that any flaw (if there is any) is just part of the beauty of it. TDK was so much better than Begins in every aspect I cannot but praise the Nolan brothers for it and thank God for Goyer not writing the dialogues.

TDK might be flawed but it's better than Batman Retuns. And I tell you I totally love Returns.

Oh...I agree with you completely. I found TDK to be better than Returns and Begins myself. I consider TDK and Batman 89 to be the best Batman movies, but that's just me.

 

[Ziggyman]

...Never really liked 89...And haven't seen 89 or BR in awhile...But I think Returns is better!

 

[El Payaso]

Oh...I agree with you completely. I found TDK to be better than Returns and Begins myself. I consider TDK and Batman 89 to be the best Batman movies, but that's just me.

Just you? B89, TDK and Superman TM are the three cornerstones of the superhero movies genre.

 

[deathfromabove]

The reasons that you give us are biased on a simple point of view. You are not analizing the movie, you are just giving critics without a solid foundation.

im sorry but i had to

 

[El Payaso]

you had to what.

 

[Bat Attack]

Just you? B89, TDK and Superman TM are the three cornerstones of the superhero movies genre.

Haha, same here! Each one brought something new to the genre.

 

[StylishHokie21]

Just you? B89, TDK and Superman TM are the three cornerstones of the superhero movies genre.

I'm glad I'm not the only one.

 

[Eagle_23]

I love Batman Returns (3rd best of all the movies, behind TDK and BB).

 

[Rasputin911]

The film would be better with just Catwoman and Shreck. Corrupt, predatory buisinessman and violent thief/vigilante. DeVito's penguin just seemed like Jack's Joker with a perverted side and short-man syndrome, and it was very hard to take him seriously at all. He gave you laughs, but we already had that with Joker. He distracted from the well-acted and thematically serious Catwoman/Shreck.

And i agree with the people who are saying that Burton seemed to not give one rat-**** about accuracy to comics.

He's a good director (Sweeney Todd was awesome, so was NBC, and B89 was good), but he went too far in his own direction with this movie.

 

[Infinity9999x]

I've never been a huge fan of BR. As a kid I absolutely hated it. The Penguin scared the crap out of me. When I watched it again a few years ago I thought it was okay. Really, it's just a bit too bizarre for me at times. I liked it enough up until the Penguin has his army of Penguins go out to blow up Gotham and I was just going....."um..yeah" I loved B89, but that was still slightly plausible (for a comic movie).

Now, I do love the dynamic between Catwoman and Batman, and the overall mood Burton has for the movie. And Keaton and Gough were great as Bats and Alfred.

However, many things, such as Catwoman becoming Catwoman after she falls out of a window and gets liked/nibbled on by cats...had me just scratching my head. Also, I was wondering why in the heck Burton gave Penguin clown goons, when they would have fit sooo much better with Jack's Joker. The Joker's the one that should have the demented/crazy looking clown goons. It fits with his character better. The Penguin should have had Jack's goons.

So overall, I thought BR was okay, I don't think it sucks, but it wasn't great. I'd rank it fairly low on the Bat movie scale though.

TDK
B89
B:MOTP
B:ROTJ
BR