BvS Is anyone else not excited about Superman and Batman? I feel nothing but dread. - Part 2

[Mysteryman]

I am not aware of any scenes in the other Superman films where he is given the suit and special significance is attached to it .

 

[The Batman]

Does anyone else feel that the first moment when you see Clark in his suit during MOS, that moment felt..."unearned?"

Not necessarily "unearned", but definitely underwhelming.

It's strange that Batman in the TDK trilogy was much more into the symbolism aspect, when Superman is supposed to be the most symbolic, iconic superhero there is and Snyder/Goyer took that away just to be more edgy and modern, IMO.

I felt more hope watching Batman in BB than I did watching Superman in MOS.

Nolan knew how to make his hero flawed, yet inspiring at the same time. I did not really feel that Superman was inspiring during MOS, though he did save a lot of people.

 

[Mrs. Wayne]

Not necessarily "unearned", but definitely underwhelming.

Yes. Underwhelming and fast, but not, "unearned,".

 

[Boy Scout]

I am not aware of any scenes in the other Superman films where he is given the suit and special significance is attached to it .

Him being given the suit isn't the important thing; it's seeing him in it for the first time. MOS, being an origin film, was supposed to build up to that moment (arguably the most important moment in any origin movie) and then deliver it in a way that made all the previous build up and anticipation worth it. In my opinion, it didn't. He just put on that suit and...that was that.

 

[Tra-El]

I'm on record for adoring MoS. Actually can't get enough of it since it's the Superman movie I've always wanted and it delivered.

Though, one of the things I felt underwhelmed with was the suit reveal for sure and I've said this numerous times.

People want to cite the trailers and have a little "comparison" in how the scene felt in the trailers and how it felt in the movie. I don't necessarily agree with that aspect of things. I look at it differently and for me, the fault lies in showing that moment in the trailers to begin with.

For an origin story, the buildup to the suit, especially SUPERMAN, is supposed to be seen for the FIRST TIME with the audiences. Not only did the trailer reveal this scene, it also showed the entire sequence of the reveal (the cape flowing, walking in the distance, Kal looking over the land with his cape blowing, etc).

Though the trailers for MoS were one of the best I've EVER seen, the fault, for me when it came to the scene in the movie was that we already saw it. Frame by frame and that's where I think they dropped the ball was showing it in the trailer(s). IMHO, they should have completely left it out and replaced it with something else.

If we've seen that sequence only for the first time in the movie and not the way the trailers were edited, it probably wouldn't have fallen so flat to people who believed it did so.

 

[Mysteryman]

I think the whole film was about him becoming Superman , the suit was a part of that .
I do think there is a difference between becoming a hero and fully accepting all of the responsibilities that come with it .
I hope we see more of the second part in the next film.

 

[Mysteryman]

While I agree that the suit reveal should have been saved for the film itself
They wanted to draw in Non Superman fans.
The suit was a BIG part of that effort .

 

[The Endless]

I hope in DoJ we see a Superman who has fully embraced his responsibilities. Superman has this huge burden, but he never lets it get him down. He's a superhero who does his thing with a smile on his face. He waves at people when he flies by. He gives big speeches at parades and memorial days. And he's always got time for the little people. He doesn't just turn up to stop world ending threats.

That's the Superman i want to see.

Of course Man of Steel is basically "Superman Begins". But the vision of Snyder and Goyer makes me apprehensive that we'll never see the Superman i described in my first paragraph.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

Did anyone like the suit reveal from Smallville a bit more? Even though the dialogue was a little over the top, I liked the imagery.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

Snyder should deliver visuals displaying his speed as seeming normal with him, yet everyone else slows down. It's an effect that just makes sense for Superman and the audience.

 

[The Endless]

I'd like to see a scene like in Morisson's All Star. Where Superman is seemingly in like 5 places at once. Saving a kid from getting hit by a car. Catching a falling construction worker. Then ends up as Clark Kent just catching the elevator to work.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

I'd like to see a scene like in Morisson's All Star. Where Superman is seemingly in like 5 places at once. Saving a kid from getting hit by a car. Catching a falling construction worker. Then ends up as Clark Kent just catching the elevator to work.

That would look so good in live action too. I hope Snyder isn't afraid to deliver fun visuals cause of the slow mo stigma.

 

[Flint Marko]

Not necessarily "unearned", but definitely underwhelming.

Extremely underwhelming. The reveal also didn't make much sense to me, as I never really understood how Kal's suit was magically on the scout ship that had been hidden under the ice for close to 80,000 years. Seems mighty convenient.

 

[Tra-El]

Extremely underwhelming. The reveal also didn't make much sense to me, as I never really understood how Kal's suit was magically on the scout ship that had been hidden under the ice for close to 80,000 years. Seems mighty convenient.

I never understood the nitpicks with this scene. I don't think it really needs to be explained as we actually SEE the suit onboard a Kryptonian scout-ship.

Not only that, but we know Kryptonian's had guilds and crests for each individual family so it's not that out-of-the-ordinary thinking that the Super-suit Kal wore was onboard the scout ship as one of Jor-EL's as he took Kal right to it. As Jor-EL said to Lois, he designed these ships and he overturned the ships compatibility to Earth's atmosphere and with his consciousnesses uploaded into the ships mainframe, the suit could also have been prepared beforehand for that moment one day if Kal ever made his way to. Jor-EL did indeed leave the command key in Kal's ship for such a reason if he ever discovered himself.

We also see Jor-EL show Kal the symbol on his chest and we saw it again in the beginning scenes on Krypton. Simply put, the suit was already onboard the scoutship as one of Jor-EL's. That was never a problem for me and didn't need explanation.

 

[The Batman]

Of course Man of Steel is basically "Superman Begins".

The thing is, even though "Batman Begins" was an origin story, I found that Batman was not lacking in any way. If BB were the only Nolan Batfilm, I would be satisfied because Bale's Bats, while in his first year, still felt like how Batman should be for the most part.

I don't feel that way about MOS' Superman.

 

[hafizbat]

The thing is, even though "Batman Begins" was an origin story, I found that Batman was not lacking in any way. If BB were the only Nolan Batfilm, I would be satisfied because Bale's Bats, while in his first year, still felt like how Batman should be for the most part.

I don't feel that way about MOS' Superman.

That's a great point. In fact, Bale felt most like Batman in BB, compared to TDK and Rises, where "Bruce" was much more of a focus.

 

[MrsKent26]

Firstly, thanks for the responses to my query a couple pages back.

Does anyone else feel that the first moment when you see Clark in his suit during MOS, that moment felt..."unearned?"

I wouldn't use the word unearned, but I would say that moment was disproportionate to the scale of the movie and a symptom of a larger problem within the narrative.

The story of superman has a tendency to be a bit overwrought and self-important, sometimes to a fault. I don't think that's completely inappropriate considering the idea of a god-like savior coming to Earth is...Biblical. This certainly wasn't lost on MOS with all the "change the world" talk and if there's any scene that should get the "This is big deal!" treatment, it would be the first visual of superman. The shot of him emerging wasn't bad on its own. When displayed during the trailers, it had the aura of a legend emerging and seemed befitting of a grand event. It was the lead up to that that went awry. It was part of the larger problem known as "Too much Jor-el."

To make that moment meaningful, it should have come from superman himself, but instead, Jor-el preached about Krypton and gave Kal a suit. I believe it was partly Kal's choice; obviously he didn't need to listen to Jor and was ready to do this after learning about his heritage. It still would have made things grander if Kal had found the suit himself and come up with the revolutionary idea known as superman (rather than a hologram of a dead man spinning tales about how a son his living body had no idea would survive should live). In this case, the culmination of Kal's idea coming to fruition would have been that beautifully composed shot of Superman exiting the ship.

There was a poster who called MOS the greatest story ever and compared it to the bible. I have forgotten his name but if you don't believe me I am sure a few posters will back me up.

Fair enough. There was that one dude and he even admitted it. Not really a common phenomenon though.

 

[Tra-El]

The thing is, even though "Batman Begins" was an origin story, I found that Batman was not lacking in any way. If BB were the only Nolan Batfilm, I would be satisfied because Bale's Bats, while in his first year, still felt like how Batman should be for the most part.

I don't feel that way about MOS' Superman.

I think that's the point, though. In Batman Begins, Bruce had a point to make. He literally WAS becoming the Batman in his eyes and that mindset was always there in his training. He had a reason to do what he was doing. Supes did not. He was basically blind and didn't know what was coming next.

In MoS, Supes had no guidance and didn't have an idea of who he was or if he'd even ever find out. Bruce had that Batman mentality throughout the entire movie as Superman was basically thrust into an almost impossible situation.

In Batman Begins, Bruce's mindset as Batman came pretty early and he was the Batman for a good amount of time. In MoS, Supes fully isn't comfortable in who he is until literally the end credits. MoS was literally an ENTIRE Superman origin film.

In many ways, I now feel that BvS will TRULY be the "Superman Begins" of this universe.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Did anyone like the suit reveal from Smallville a bit more? Even though the dialogue was a little over the top, I liked the imagery.

No.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Not at all, too.

 

[Flint Marko]

I never understood the nitpicks with this scene. I don't think it really needs to be explained as we actually SEE the suit onboard a Kryptonian scout-ship.

Not only that, but we know Kryptonian's had guilds and crests for each individual family so it's not that out-of-the-ordinary thinking that the Super-suit Kal wore was onboard the scout ship as one of Jor-EL's as he took Kal right to it. As Jor-EL said to Lois, he designed these ships and he overturned the ships compatibility to Earth's atmosphere and with his consciousnesses uploaded into the ships mainframe, the suit could also have been prepared beforehand for that moment one day if Kal ever made his way to. Jor-EL did indeed leave the command key in Kal's ship for such a reason if he ever discovered himself.

We also see Jor-EL show Kal the symbol on his chest and we saw it again in the beginning scenes on Krypton. Simply put, the suit was already onboard the scoutship as one of Jor-EL's. That was never a problem for me and didn't need explanation.

But it was said by one of the people in the military that the ship was in the ice for 80,000 years. So how could that have been Jor-els, is he 80,000 years old? I'm asking because I'm genuinely curious and the movie brushed right past it like it was nothing so I'm wondering what exactly I missed.

 

[Tra-El]

But it was said by one of the people in the military that the ship was in the ice for 80,000 years. So how could that have been Jor-els, is he 80,000 years old? I'm asking because I'm genuinely curious and the movie brushed right past it like it was nothing so I'm wondering what exactly I missed.

Jor-El's dead. A ghost, a consciousness. Just like Zod's ship, Jor-EL built the foundation and immediately switched the compatibility of Kryptonian atmosphere to that of Earth's. Once Supes loaded the ship with his command key, Jor-EL appeared. If he can turn Zod's spacecraft and manipulate its atmosphere, then to me, it's not hard to think that a suit that dons the House of El crest is onboard the ship, especially since it was Supergirl who crash landed here to begin with, who is apart of the EL family.

 

[Boy Scout]

I assume Jor-El used his magic powers to construct the suit while he and Clark were talking.

 

[Flint Marko]

Jor-El's dead. A ghost, a consciousness. Just like Zod's ship, Jor-EL built the foundation and immediately switched the compatibility of Kryptonian atmosphere to that of Earth's. Once Supes loaded the ship with his command key, Jor-EL appeared. If he can turn Zod's spacecraft and manipulate its atmosphere, then to me, it's not hard to think that a suit that dons the House of El crest is onboard the ship, especially since it was Supergirl who crash landed here to begin with, who is apart of the EL family.

I gotcha, I'm on the same page.
But what's that bit about supergirl, she was the one who landed the ship? Is that why one of the pods was open?

 

[Tra-El]

I gotcha, I'm on the same page.
But what's that bit about supergirl, she was the one who landed the ship? Is that why one of the pods was open?

There was a prequel comic book released before MoS hit theaters and it featured Kara as the one who crash landed the ship on Earth. In one pod in the spacecraft showed a zombie-like Kryptonian probably trapped in the pod while the open pod is supposed to be a reference to Supergirl escaping.