Mad Max: Fury Road - Part 6

Miller used CGI as a tool for his movie, not as a crutch (unlike almost every other action movie today).

I personally have no issues with CGI if it's used properly. I mean, compare the use of CGI in Fury Road to the Star Wars prequels. The difference in quality is staggering.

When people complain about CGI, I think it's more like people are complaining about HOW it's being used in film today.
 
To be fair, there's a decade+ of difference between the CGI in the Star Wars Prequels and the one in Mad Max Fury Road, not to mention that a colorful space film will need much more cgi than something specificaly set on earth.

Also, the heavy use of cgi in films like the Prequels and the likes of Avatar helped the technology evolve a lot, and enabled it to get as good as it is nowadays.
 
To be fair, there's a decade+ of difference between the CGI in the Star Wars Prequels and the one in Mad Max Fury Road, not to mention that a colorful space film will need much more cgi than something specificaly set on earth.

Also, the heavy use of cgi in films like the Prequels and the likes of Avatar helped the technology evolve a lot, and enabled it to get as good as it is nowadays.

If the prequels were made today (with all of that CGI everywhere), I firmly believe we'd still see a big difference in quality between that an Fury Road.

I mean, everything about the prequels was shot in blue/green screen. Everything. The sets weren't even real. No matter how great or advanced the CGI would look today compared to 15 years ago, I still think the prequels would look bad.

I don't hate CGI at all. The advancements in CGI have been important for film; without it, an MCU wouldn't be possible. Spider-Man would still be without a movie if CGI never existed. CGI can be great a lot of the time (like with Gollum, Rocket Raccoon, etc.), but an over reliance on it very much lessens the quality of the special effects, in my opinion.
 
I mean, everything about the prequels was shot in blue/green screen. Everything. The sets weren't even real.

Not necessarily. There were a lot of practical sets used for The Phantom Menace. Even a good chunk of Attack of the Clones was shot on location. Can't say the same for Revenge of the Sith, though. That movie is 90% blue screen.
 
there's a decade+ of difference between the CGI in the Star Wars Prequels and the one in Mad Max Fury Road[/QUOTE

They looked terrible even when they came out. Compare Clones to the Two Towers, both of which came out in the same year: no comparison. Compare CG Yoda to Gollum: the latter is light years ahead.
 
In fairness while people here don't like him Michael Bay has been doing this type of CGI use for over a decade.

Yeah that's true, I am one of the few on here who like Bay, but more young directors need to look at what Miller did in Fury Road!
 
As an example; Spider-Man. The web swinging should be CG but absolutely everything else (imho) can be done practically but isn't. When there is TOO MUCH CG then I get taken out of the scene. For me, the difference between the effects of The Matrix and the sequels is despite what was happening in the original and how 'out there' everything was it still looks 'real' unlike the sequel where I was taken out of the movie over and over again.

So I applaud the effects of Mad Max that are almost invisible and seek only to enhance the practical effects.
 
there's a decade+ of difference between the CGI in the Star Wars Prequels and the one in Mad Max Fury Road[/QUOTE

They looked terrible even when they came out. Compare Clones to the Two Towers, both of which came out in the same year: no comparison. Compare CG Yoda to Gollum: the latter is light years ahead.

The CGI in LOTR still looks better than the CGI in a lot of movies today. Though LOTR definitely had more time to work on polishing individual shots since the three films relied heavily on locations, miniatures and costumes. Episode II and III should've put a lot more time into creating sets and costumes and shooting on location, some of the stuff that was CGI had no reason to be CGI.
 
It's a shame the Hobbit just ruined quite a lot of the magic that LOTR established on making Middle Earth believable.
 
Not really. The Hobbit doesn't diminish LOTR anymore than the PT diminishes the OT. When you watch those films you are engrossed in their story, the prequels vanish from your mind.
 
^Yup. As a matter of fact I recently had a Middle-Earth marathon with my friends and after watching the films in chronological order, The Hobbit trilogy did not diminish my enjoyment of The Lord of the Rings trilogy one bit.
 
TH left me excited for LOTR. The way it ends and all.
 
So I finally grabbed this today on blu, and I will finally be watching it for the first time. Excited as hell, I already know I will love it though.
 
^Yup. As a matter of fact I recently had a Middle-Earth marathon with my friends and after watching the films in chronological order, The Hobbit trilogy did not diminish my enjoyment of The Lord of the Rings trilogy one bit.

Maybe I should watch it in that order instead of release wise, which just frustrates me, and I know many argue that the cartoonish-ness works for the Hobbit since it is originally a lot lighter than the LOTR books, but it didn't need the CGI for that.
 
GDT's vision sounded very cartoony and probably would not have needed all that CGI.
 
There's always going to be a sense of something being off with CGI in most cases. Even Mad Max FR has that issue too, the sand storm sequence is the only time the film takes me out of the story because it's the only obvious CG effect. It's also why many people think The Hobbit films look inferior to the LOTR movies despite having 10 years of more advanced technology behind it. With practical sets and effects and miniatures there's a lot more weight to the imagery, CGI for the most part still feels very hollow.
 
I am fine with the sandstorm scene. The only scene I took issue with was the aftermath of Nux's demise when you see the very elaborate, very CGI shots of Doof's guitar and Immortan's whatever it was. That shot was very Peter Jacksonish and didn't sit right with me.
 
Yeah that's true, I am one of the few on here who like Bay, but more young directors need to look at what Miller did in Fury Road!

One of the first examples I saw of using subtle CGI like the Fury Road caps was the featurette on the freeway chase Bay did in Bad Boys II. More film makers should definitely put more thought into how and where they use the CGI in sequences.
 
If the prequels were made today (with all of that CGI everywhere), I firmly believe we'd still see a big difference in quality between that an Fury Road.

I mean, everything about the prequels was shot in blue/green screen. Everything. The sets weren't even real. No matter how great or advanced the CGI would look today compared to 15 years ago, I still think the prequels would look bad.

Not realy, they built plenty of sets, there's even a thread in the Force forums with all that, even the Mustafar scene in Episode III required a heavy fusion between major pratical effects and cgi.

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/practical-effects-in-the-prequels-sets-pictures-models-etc.50017310/

Episode I actualy had more miniatures and sets than any of the original films, what made it suck wasn't simply that, it had to do with poot script, Lucas no longer being all that strong a Director, and their designs being cartonish. Part of what sold that film at the time was it featuring some of the finest work of cgi in it's time, back then people were actualy saying that cgi was the future and that it worked better because you could do anything with it.

Saying the Prequels were only done in CGI and green screen is the kind of statement that's making Prequel apologists take those that didn't like the Prequels less seriously, there were multiple reasons those films were disappointing, and it wasn't simply because of the quantity of CGI, it goes far deeper than that.

Here's a comparison of the number of special effects shots between various movies:

http://www.upcomingvfxmovies.com/svfx-shots-race/

The prequels had around as many effects shots as Avengers, but didn't have as many as such films as Captain AMerica: The Winter Soldier, Guardians of the Galaxy, Avengers 2 or King Kong. As you can see, the problem isn't as simple as just saying "it was all cgi, so it would have sucked nowadays too". The Marvel films don't actualy seem to worried with overreliance on CGI, had the Prequels been releaed today, they probably would have looked similar to them.

Episode III's cgi has actualy aged realy well, most of what doesn't work had to do with Lucas's Direction.

The reason the Prequels sucked had to do with George Lucas having been interested in technology for film over the years, but not having trained his "Film Director muscle". Everyone who knew him says he used to be a lazy person, he himself admited that, then once he wanted to become a film Director, he started working very hard, and his stress only seemed to stop after the end of the original trilogy, culminating with the skywalker ranch's construction being complete and his divorce with Marcia (according to what has been said, it had to do with him have become a workaholic during the making of the original trilogy).

After that, it seems like he took a long pause, writing and producing stuff like Indiana Jones and Howards the Duck now and then, but mostly keeping quiet. He didn't Direct anything during this time, add his reputation as the "creator of Star Wars" to that, and he probably felt like James Cameron feels right now. The difference is that Lucas seems to be the kind of person where Directing doesn't come naturaly, so him not Directing any film for more than 20 years didn't help at all.

Regarding the visuals of the Prequels, Episode I actualy looked pretty good a lot of times, space looked stunning in it. If you take a look at what went wrong, it wasn't simply the cgi, look at the aliens that weren't so, like the ones of the trading federation, they looked kinda bad, for more examples you can also look at the new Yoda puppet.

Episode II looked terrible all around though, it truly was a case of overreliance on CGI, when it wasn't advanced enough. But then again, it also had various miniatures, the problem was that the miniatures they used weren't very good:

star-wars-prequels-cg-00.jpg

Then again, there were also some good looking models, but they weren't well integrated in the final film:

star-wars-prequels-cg-07.jpg


star-wars-prequels-cg-09.jpg

One thing that definitely didn't help was how flat most of the cinematography in the Prequels was. On the other hand, the Lord of the Rings films came out around the same time and had an amazing camera work that contributed to a "mythic feel".

It's a shame the Hobbit just ruined quite a lot of the magic that LOTR established on making Middle Earth believable.

I actualy feel that the Hobbit films were prequels that didn't take anything away from the Lord of the Rings movies. Unlike the Star Wars prequels, i think they handled most of the characters well. One can watch the Hobbit films first and not lose anything from Lord of the Rings.

With Star Wars, the prequels give a bad introduction to the story, make previous characters unlikeable, ruin the Vader twist, and all around turn a simple and straightforward story into a confusing one.

With the Hobbit you still get a proper introduction to middle earth, and while certain bits were overcomplicated, it doesn't realy detract from anything in Lord of the Rings.

I am fine with the sandstorm scene. The only scene I took issue with was the aftermath of Nux's demise when you see the very elaborate, very CGI shots of Doof's guitar and Immortan's whatever it was. That shot was very Peter Jacksonish and didn't sit right with me.

It wasn't cgi, they actualy shot the guitar and that head steering wheel in a green screen, then added it to the perspective. Some people in this thread did complaing about that "terrible cgi", then a couple weeks later, some making of information revealed it actualy wasn't cgi at all. It's kinda funny.

http://www.fxguide.com/quicktakes/mad-max-fury-roads-day-for-nights-and-practical-vfx/
 
Here's my question... When didn't SFX of the past have a certain look, yes even "practical" SFX, that it could be argued brought attention to themselves? Is this really something that is only noticeable with modern CGI? And what of all the times that you DON'T notice CGI? The many instances that it's used and you weren't even aware, and it was done so because, frankly, using CGI is actually more practical in the end for film makers than... Well practical effects that so many have such warm feelings over?

My problem with this debate is that one side seems to be making an argument, or it seems to me anyway, that practical effects are always the superior choice but in context they would actually drive up costs, are more of a pain to use and would STILL look like SFX especially without CGI to cover up things like wires ect.
 
I don't want Furiosa to be in Mad Max: Wasteland, but I'd love to see a Furiosa spin off with the wives and the two mothers in the citadel where it gets attacked and then we also get parallel flashbacks of how she ended up as an Imperator for Immortan Joe. No need for Charlize to shave her hair off since she's no longer the Imperator but the Protector of the citadel.
 
Absolutely loved this movie just watched it today. Knew I'd enjoy it. It was just superb. Beautiful shots, the stunts and the action. Everything was great movie delivered big time. One of my favorite films this year.
 
Here's my question... When didn't SFX of the past have a certain look, yes even "practical" SFX, that it could be argued brought attention to themselves? Is this really something that is only noticeable with modern CGI? And what of all the times that you DON'T notice CGI? The many instances that it's used and you weren't even aware, and it was done so because, frankly, using CGI is actually more practical in the end for film makers than... Well practical effects that so many have such warm feelings over?

My problem with this debate is that one side seems to be making an argument, or it seems to me anyway, that practical effects are always the superior choice but in context they would actually drive up costs, are more of a pain to use and would STILL look like SFX especially without CGI to cover up things like wires ect.

I will tell ya on thing tho, it was a mistake to see AOU after seeing this that same day.
 
Here's my question... When didn't SFX of the past have a certain look, yes even "practical" SFX, that it could be argued brought attention to themselves? Is this really something that is only noticeable with modern CGI? And what of all the times that you DON'T notice CGI? The many instances that it's used and you weren't even aware, and it was done so because, frankly, using CGI is actually more practical in the end for film makers than... Well practical effects that so many have such warm feelings over?

My problem with this debate is that one side seems to be making an argument, or it seems to me anyway, that practical effects are always the superior choice but in context they would actually drive up costs, are more of a pain to use and would STILL look like SFX especially without CGI to cover up things like wires ect.

There's weight to physical objects that CGI can't replicate 100%, that's why people believe directors should work more practically. The issue isn't so much which is superior, it's about how you use it and many directors use CGI as a crutch, not as a tool.
 
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