Man kills his daughter After She Unplugs His XBox

[Spider-Bite]

Yes we are. I do not dissagree with you there. But killing to set an example or revene isn't the answer and doesn't work. As you pointed out Texas is enforcing the death penalty more than anyone. And yet people are still killing each other. Neither the deat penalty or life in prison will stop that. Most crimes are either commited by individuals with mental instabilities, gangs(poor people), or someone who snaps(crimes of passion). Setting an example will never stop those with mental defects(which the birth of them get higher and higher everyday) since mostly they have trouble stopping themselves from doing wrong even though they don't want to. Pedophiles cannot stop their attractions for kids the sameway gays can not stop their attraction for men(not saying being gay is a mental defect.) Point is all sexual orientation is 100% mental. A bipolar individual cannot stop his mood swings from going lovey dovey to murderous and it only takes that instant for a murder to happen. Poor people have nothing to lose already so death sentences could mean squat since they're already putting their life on the line with people on the street. Crimes of passion can happen without the individual realising he did it until afterwards(trust me I know.) One time I was so emotionally cornered my body just moved on its own and destroyed my mothers furniter without me wanting to do it.
Anyway to sum it up, the death penalty won't change anything. It'll just show how cruel and unusual America can be at times. You want to give prisoners a real punishment? Put them in jail with no privllages except visits and maybe libraries. Don't let them have a gym, internet access, a basket ball court, or anything else. Let them think about what they've done all day and do hard labor like printing plates, digging fields,ect.

I have to point out that 99% of the time pedohphiles have no sexual attraction for children. They aren't doing it because they think children are hot, they doing it for the sole purpose of abusing them. It's a crime of passion and control.

And even if they did think they were hot, so what? I see hot adult females all the time, whom I'm physically attracted to. That doesn't mean I have to go rape them.

They still have free will. I do believe in the victim of society argument, but criminals have free will.

Basketball or enjoyable activities are essential to telling the criminal, I can have a good life on the outside. It can be the driving force of their choosing to live a good life when they get out. They already have plenty of time to think about what they've done. I don't doubt that 99% of them spend a great deal of their time in prison thinking about what they've done.

And it's too dangerous to put tools like that in the hands of dangerous criminals.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Not unless you're a piece of ****

People snap and shout at their kids

They snap and throw a plate against the wall.

They don't punch a baby in the face twice

If you can do that, you aren't human

LOL, I know. I couldn't believe my eyes when I read that.

"Hey, I snapped a killed a little girl.....It happens. *shrug*"
HaHaHaHa WHAT?!?

 

[jaguarr]

Yes we are. I do not dissagree with you there. But killing to set an example or revene isn't the answer and doesn't work. As you pointed out Texas is enforcing the death penalty more than anyone. And yet people are still killing each other. Neither the deat penalty or life in prison will stop that. Most crimes are either commited by individuals with mental instabilities, gangs(poor people), or someone who snaps(crimes of passion). Setting an example will never stop those with mental defects(which the birth of them get higher and higher everyday) since mostly they have trouble stopping themselves from doing wrong even though they don't want to. Pedophiles cannot stop their attractions for kids the sameway gays can not stop their attraction for men(not saying being gay is a mental defect.) Point is all sexual orientation is 100% mental. A bipolar individual cannot stop his mood swings from going lovey dovey to murderous and it only takes that instant for a murder to happen. Poor people have nothing to lose already so death sentences could mean squat since they're already putting their life on the line with people on the street. Crimes of passion can happen without the individual realising he did it until afterwards(trust me I know.) One time I was so emotionally cornered my body just moved on its own and destroyed my mothers furniter without me wanting to do it.
Anyway to sum it up, the death penalty won't change anything. It'll just show how cruel and unusual America can be at times. You want to give prisoners a real punishment? Put them in jail with no privllages except visits and maybe libraries. Don't let them have a gym, internet access, a basket ball court, or anything else. Let them think about what they've done all day and do hard labor like printing plates, digging fields,ect.

I do agree with the last part of your post. Prison should be a place of major hard labor where prisoners aren't coddled like they are today. Work hard and keep your nose clean after working of the mandatory hard labor portion of your sentence? Maybe you will qualify for a chance to get education or learn a trade and get some actual rehabilitation. Maybe.

The reason the death penalty doesn't work as a deterrent, though, is because it's really not enforced without prejudice. Not even in Texas. The appeals system is flawed and allows death row inmates to tie their cases up in the courts for years which is very expensive. If it were enforced on a widespread basis with limitations on all of the appeals and things that prevent an execution from going through, nearly guaranteeing a death sentence would be carried out, it might be more effective. If not, at least that person isn't sucking up tax dollars or potentially hurting another human being ever again due to their defect. Either way, society wins.

jag

 

[hippy fascist]

It's already like that.

you are only increasing the number of people they will victimize when they get out. I'm not calling you a criminal, but if we make that choice, then we are just as guilty as if we committed the crime ourself.

they don't want to go anyways


that means spending more tax dollars on them. it's the opposite of "quit spending tax dollars" It costs a lot more when you sentence somebody to death, and it makes us more like the criminals. If killing people is a horrible crime, than the government sure as hell shouldn't be doing it.

My mate craig works a 60hr week and can barely afford the roof over his head and three squares. Let alone cable tv, internet access, etc.So if prisoners have more luxuries than a guy working his ass off to stay afloat, how exactly is that a deterent?

 

[Spider-Bite]

I Oh, and prison rape isn't about sex, it's about power (same as regular rape). It's about dominance and exercising control over others. That's why it happens in prison, not because it's sexy fun.

jag

that doesn't usually happen in prison, because nobody wants to end up in solitary confinement for the next 10 years. I'm sure it was like that 20 years ago, but now days it isn't.

 

[jaguarr]

It's already like that.

Uhhh...no, it's not. My brother is a cop. I have friends that are cops. I have worked in the court system. I have friends who are prison guards. Trust me...there are plenty of people who see nothing wrong with going to prison and in fact view it as a way to get street cred and get a vacation from the streets.

you are only increasing the number of people they will victimize when they get out. I'm not calling you a criminal, but if we make that choice, then we are just as guilty as if we committed the crime ourself.

Errr....how is making prisoners do hard labor increasing the number of people they will victimize when they get out? And how is it criminal to make people who have committed criminal acts do something PRODUCTIVE for society instead of leeching off of it?

they don't want to go anyways

Wrong. See my comments above. Not all of them want to, sure, but there are plenty that don't care if they go to prison.

that means spending more tax dollars on them. it's the opposite of "quit spending tax dollars" It costs a lot more when you sentence somebody to death, and it makes us more like the criminals. If killing people is a horrible crime, than the government sure as hell shouldn't be doing it.

Let's see....~$120k a year over the course of say....40 years vs. a $5 bullet and the cost of a crematorium. I fail to see the financial downside.

jag

 

[jaguarr]

that doesn't usually happen in prison, because nobody wants to end up in solitary confinement for the next 10 years. I'm sure it was like that 20 years ago, but now days it isn't.

The prisons are horribly overcrowded and they can't even keep up with the prison population overflow with the new prisons they are constructing. If you think they have the capacity to just throw anyone who gets out of line like that into solitary confinement....let alone for ten years....you're mistaken. Prison rape happens and more often than you seem to think as my prison guard friends will attest to.

jag

 

[Sloth7d]

I do agree with the last part of your post. Prison should be a place of major hard labor where prisoners aren't coddled like they are today. Work hard and keep your nose clean after working of the mandatory hard labor portion of your sentence? Maybe you will qualify for a chance to get education or learn a trade and get some actual rehabilitation. Maybe.

The reason the death penalty doesn't work as a deterrent, though, is because it's really not enforced without prejudice. Not even in Texas. The appeals system is flawed and allows death row inmates to tie their cases up in the courts for years which is very expensive. If it were enforced on a widespread basis with limitations on all of the appeals and things that prevent an execution from going through, nearly guaranteeing a death sentence would be carried out, it might be more effective. If not, at least that person isn't sucking up tax dollars or potentially hurting another human being ever again due to their defect. Either way, society wins.

jag

I don't think thats true. Like I said alot of crminals have nothing to lose in the first place or sufer from mental dfects at birth. A sociopath is not going to care what you threatin him with. He's going to commit crimes anyway.
Also, alot of crimes cannot be proven 100% without a shadow of a doubt. Yet guilty verdicts are still handed out because the Jury has a good feeling that so and so did it. With this the death penalty couldn't be so strictly enforced even if we wanted it to be.

 

[hippy fascist]

not only that but it assumes every guard is a shining beacon of honesty. Like cops many take these jobs for a feeling of power. It's not so hard to believe that if a crooked guard hates you he's going to look the otherway while you get butt****ed. Hell, it's perfect, you get a dose of pain and he has plausible deniability

 

[jaguarr]

Well, like it or not, the current mode of coddling criminals in prison is not working. The prison population in the U.S. is the largest per capita in the world and still growing at an alarming rate. Our prisons can't hold all of them and we can't build enough prisons. Something is severely broken. Not just with our prison system but with our society.

jag

 

[huskerwebhead]

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

If killing people is a horrible crime, than the government sure as hell shouldn't be doing it.

Killing INNOCENT people is a horrible crime.
Was it a horrible crime when US soldiers killed Nazi soldiers to end the agressive spread of their murderous, sadistic regime?
No.

Would it be a horrible crime if a man was raping a dude's wife right in front of him and the dude picked up a shovel and hit the rapist on the head and he died?
No.

 

[Sloth7d]

Killing INNOCENT people is a horrible crime.
Was it a horrible crime when US soldiers killed Nazi soldiers to end the agressive spread of their murderous, sadistic regime?
No.

Would it be a horrible crime if a man was raping a dude's wife right in front of him and the dude picked up a shovel and hit the rapist on the head and he died?
No.

Actually itsmore like killing in self defense is okay. If you go out and kill a known murderer pre emptively, you're still going to jail.

 

[hippy fascist]

not if you've got enough cash

 

[Spider-Bite]

My mate craig works a 60hr week and can barely afford the roof over his head and three squares. Let alone cable tv, internet access, etc.So if prisoners have more luxuries than a guy working his ass off to stay afloat, how exactly is that a deterent?

does your friend want to go to prison?

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Actually itsmore like killing in self defense is okay. If you go out and kill a known murderer pre emptively, you're still going to jail.

d00d, I'm just saying, people who share his view think killing.is.wrong.period.
Not so.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Uhhh...no, it's not. My brother is a cop. I have friends that are cops. I have worked in the court system. I have friends who are prison guards. Trust me...there are plenty of people who see nothing wrong with going to prison and in fact view it as a way to get street cred and get a vacation from the streets.

I'm sorry but your painting a picture of reality that does not exist. this is not the way it is.

Errr....how is making prisoners do hard labor increasing the number of people they will victimize when they get out? And how is it criminal to make people who have committed criminal acts do something PRODUCTIVE for society instead of leeching off of it?

the only labour you can make them perform wont be useful to society. that's why when they had to hard labour all they had to do was carry hard heavy lumps of cement back and forth on the prison property. It's not safe to let them do anything for the outside world while they are in prison.

If your talking about work release for people in jail, that's different. but those are people serving sentences smaller than a year, and it's not hard labour, it's just labour.

And they aren't leaching. They are paying their debt to society for the crime they have committed.

Wrong. See my comments above. Not all of them want to, sure, but there are plenty that don't care if they go to prison.

It's going to be very rare, and I mean very rare. Your talking one out of a million.

Let's see....~$120k a year over the course of say....40 years vs. a $5 bullet and the cost of a crematorium. I fail to see the financial downside.

jag

because your not looking at it from a judicial perspective. There is a mandatory five appeals that must be exhausted, with a minimum of five years before the last one can be exhausted. But it usually goes on for decades to allow time for new evidence to be discovered. It must be approved by several levels of government. I thought you said you worked in the courts?

These measures are in place to prevent us from executing the innocent. Killing people is not something the government takes lightly. It costs a lot more to sentence somebody to death than it does to sentence them to life in prison.

 

[Spider-Bite]

The prisons are horribly overcrowded and they can't even keep up with the prison population overflow with the new prisons they are constructing. If you think they have the capacity to just throw anyone who gets out of line like that into solitary confinement....let alone for ten years....you're mistaken. Prison rape happens and more often than you seem to think as my prison guard friends will attest to.

jag

most people stay in line to avoid it. solitary confinement isn't creating any overcrowding problems. nobody wants to spend 20 years in a room the size of a closet.

 

[jaguarr]

How am I painting a picture that is not reality when I get my perspective from people who work with criminals and IN the friggin' prisons?

And, yes, if they're eating my up tax dollars without giving anything back in return...they are leeching. Period.

And I've already said the judicial system as far as appeals go is broken and lets things go on far too long for criminals who are proven guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt. Let's see, his finger prints were all over the murder weapon, he was covered in the victim's blood when they caught him and his dna was found all over the victim. He needs to go bye-bye forever and not sponge off society anymore.

jag

 

[jaguarr]

most people stay in line to avoid it. solitary confinement isn't creating any overcrowding problems. nobody wants to spend 20 years in a room the size of a closet.

There aren't enough solitary cells to hold all the people who probably deserve to be in them for their actions while in prison. True story.

jag

 

[Spider-Bite]

How am I painting a picture that is not reality when I get my perspective from people who work with criminals and IN the friggin' prisons?

And, yes, if they're eating my up tax dollars without giving anything back in return...they are leeching. Period.

And I've already said the judicial system as far as appeals go is broken and lets things go on far too long for criminals who are proven guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt. Let's see, his finger prints were all over the murder weapon, he was covered in the victim's blood when they caught him and his dna was found all over the victim. He needs to go bye-bye forever and not sponge off society anymore.

jag

because you dont even understand the system. There have been many times where a person's guilt was proven beyong a so called shadow of a doubt, only to have them turn up innocent later.

In law opinions of proven guilt don't matter. ONly legal definitions. If your convicted than according to the law, your guilt is legally proven. In the eyes of the courts a guy convicted on he said she said, is equally proven guilty, as a guy caught on camera.

We would have excuted a hundred innocent people in Illiinois alone if not for these measures. They were on death row, and they were on it for a long time. If we did it your way they would have been killed before their innocence was proven.

and you are spending this money in exchange for having law enforcement. It would be anarchy without them, and that's what your paying for. People should not complain about that. It costs money. Nothing is free, not even security.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Let's see, his finger prints were all over the murder weapon, he was covered in the victim's blood when they caught him and his dna was found all over the victim. He needs to go bye-bye forever and not sponge off society anymore.

that's not proof. seriously. there is a number of ways an innocent person could be in that situation.

we could assume this man was a horrible father who brutalized his own daughter, but what if his fingerprints were on the weapon because he owned the weapon? what if it was in his house, and sombody in his house used his weapon to kill his daughter?

maybe he was covered in the victim's blood because he was holding his daughter. maybe his own blood has been spilled on the girl, becuase he was injured fighting off the attacker.

Now you should see how easy it is to look at it, and say "there is no possible way this man isn't guilty"

 

[jaguarr]

because you dont even understand the system. There have been many times where a person's guilt was proven beyong a so called shadow of a doubt, only to have them turn up innocent later.

In law opinions of proven guilt don't matter. ONly legal definitions. If your convicted than according to the law, your guilt is legally proven. In the eyes of the courts a guy convicted on he said she said, is equally proven guilty, as a guy caught on camera.

We would have excuted a hundred innocent people in Illiinois alone if not for these measures. They were on death row, and they were on it for a long time. If we did it your way they would have been killed before their innocence was proven.

and you are spending this money in exchange for having law enforcement. It would be anarchy without them, and that's what your paying for. People should not complain about that. It costs money. Nothing is free, not even security.

I used to WORK in the judicial system. In the state appellate courts no less. I understand the system perfectly fine. I think you've got some different ideas about how things really function within it, to be honest with you.

jag

 

[jaguarr]

that's not proof. seriously. there is a number of ways an innocent person could be in that situation.

we could assume this man was a horrible father who brutalized his own daughter, but what if his fingerprints were on the weapon because he owned the weapon? what if it was in his house, and sombody in his house used his weapon to kill his daughter?

maybe he was covered in the victim's blood because he was holding his daughter. maybe his own blood has been spilled on the girl, becuase he was injured fighting off the attacker.

Now you should see how easy it is to look at it, and say "there is no possible way this man isn't guilty"

Let me add this to the equation, then: That same guy also confessed that he killed the victim. He's guilty both by the evidence and by his own admission. Yet he fights the death penalty through appeals and writs and drags it out so that he never has to face the death penalty despite being sentenced to it. That sort of thing needs to stop and those kind of murders need to be erased from the planet.

jag

 

[Spider-Bite]

I used to WORK in the judicial system. In the state appellate courts no less. I understand the system perfectly fine. I think you've got some different ideas about how things really function within it, to be honest with you.

jag

that's why it's so shocking that you don't know these things. you can't deny anything in that post. in the eyes of the law guilty is guilty. Innocent people do get convicted, and without these measures, a lot of innocent people will get fried. That is what will happen if we do it your way.