CoherentChaos
Civilian
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- Oct 21, 2013
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Avoided this at first since I assumed it'd only be a huge cluster****. Maybe it was, I only skimmed.
Guess I'll give my piece. To preface, I voted Thor. In an all out fight, Thor wins this. (Hulk is my love, Hulk is my life, but I can see logic and reason) Maybe not instantly since I hold that Hulk is insanely durable, but be it the third, fourth or fifth lightning strike, Hulk gets KO'd at some point and Hulk, while physically stronger, doesn't really have anything offensively to get through Thor's own insane durability, whereas Thor does have the offensive power to eventually nuke anything (hell, he'd probably take out Prime Surtur if given enough time before the Asgard kamikazee attack) into the dust.
But let me clear up a few things:
Hulk didn't dodge the Mjolnir toss in the helicarrier. He caught it. I personally don't believe catching=dodging. I also think he only got angry from the hammer uppercut so I don't think he's afraid of getting hit by it. I think he wanted it and saw the throw as an opportunity to wield it... Given that his next move was to intensely try to lift it I think that makes it very clear that he wanted it for himself.
Secondly, I'm thinking that his fall from the helicarrier probably didn't deal more damage than the wall tearing hammer smash in the arena. Hulk was dazed and sitting on his ass for a bit after that, enough to even allow Thor to approach him so calmly. I think the key difference here, while both events would leave Hulk lazing about among a bunch of debris (be it the arena wall or the building's ceiling), is that in the arena he had an opponent to motivate him to get back up. In the building that Henry Dean Stanton apparently supervises, he only had pigeons fluttering away and presumably not a soul in sight or anything to maintain aggression. I'm visualizing him sitting there, dazed, and eventually calming down and reverting back to Banner thanks to zero stimulation after the fall. Aside from being KO'd, pre-Ragnarok Hulk required stimulation to remain in his form and I think people are forgetting about that when they're thinking of Banner being in the rubble.
Of course, maybe Infinity War will answer this more clearly since Hulk will yet again be falling through a roof, probably from an immense height, and then reverting to Banner in the rubble.
Chance Jackson, I appreciate the moxxy but even as a hardcore Hulk fan I have to say that pre-Ragnarok Thor had the chops to beat Hulk in a serious fight. That Thor was busting cities and Jotun landscapes when he cut loose. His Ragnarok upgrade definitely makes it easier for him though.
Also despite Taika's statement, I still hold that the correct way to write these characters would be (which may very well be different from how it actually is) that Hulk is stronger in the physical sense, with Thor being a close match that come short, but is substituted by better fighting skills, being a smaller and faster target, and of course, if he wasn't restricted to brawling, could leave Hulk KO'd in an electrified crater if he really wanted to.
Like seriously, while they're usually used interchangeably, I propose that there's a big difference between the words strength and power in these discussions and one should be careful in how they use each to precisely convey what they're saying. And honestly I'm getting tired of having to say "stronger in the physical sense" or "physically stronger" every single time. Give me the ability to just say the words "strong" and "strength" by themselves and have everyone know exactly what I'm talking about. It's 2018 people, the time's come for a vernacular change in geek language.
Oh, oh, and I'd say both belong in Powerhouse. Despite all the strength vs power debate ****, they're in the same league of being the team's big guns.
Guess I'll give my piece. To preface, I voted Thor. In an all out fight, Thor wins this. (Hulk is my love, Hulk is my life, but I can see logic and reason) Maybe not instantly since I hold that Hulk is insanely durable, but be it the third, fourth or fifth lightning strike, Hulk gets KO'd at some point and Hulk, while physically stronger, doesn't really have anything offensively to get through Thor's own insane durability, whereas Thor does have the offensive power to eventually nuke anything (hell, he'd probably take out Prime Surtur if given enough time before the Asgard kamikazee attack) into the dust.
But let me clear up a few things:
Hulk didn't dodge the Mjolnir toss in the helicarrier. He caught it. I personally don't believe catching=dodging. I also think he only got angry from the hammer uppercut so I don't think he's afraid of getting hit by it. I think he wanted it and saw the throw as an opportunity to wield it... Given that his next move was to intensely try to lift it I think that makes it very clear that he wanted it for himself.
Secondly, I'm thinking that his fall from the helicarrier probably didn't deal more damage than the wall tearing hammer smash in the arena. Hulk was dazed and sitting on his ass for a bit after that, enough to even allow Thor to approach him so calmly. I think the key difference here, while both events would leave Hulk lazing about among a bunch of debris (be it the arena wall or the building's ceiling), is that in the arena he had an opponent to motivate him to get back up. In the building that Henry Dean Stanton apparently supervises, he only had pigeons fluttering away and presumably not a soul in sight or anything to maintain aggression. I'm visualizing him sitting there, dazed, and eventually calming down and reverting back to Banner thanks to zero stimulation after the fall. Aside from being KO'd, pre-Ragnarok Hulk required stimulation to remain in his form and I think people are forgetting about that when they're thinking of Banner being in the rubble.
Of course, maybe Infinity War will answer this more clearly since Hulk will yet again be falling through a roof, probably from an immense height, and then reverting to Banner in the rubble.
Chance Jackson, I appreciate the moxxy but even as a hardcore Hulk fan I have to say that pre-Ragnarok Thor had the chops to beat Hulk in a serious fight. That Thor was busting cities and Jotun landscapes when he cut loose. His Ragnarok upgrade definitely makes it easier for him though.
Also despite Taika's statement, I still hold that the correct way to write these characters would be (which may very well be different from how it actually is) that Hulk is stronger in the physical sense, with Thor being a close match that come short, but is substituted by better fighting skills, being a smaller and faster target, and of course, if he wasn't restricted to brawling, could leave Hulk KO'd in an electrified crater if he really wanted to.
Like seriously, while they're usually used interchangeably, I propose that there's a big difference between the words strength and power in these discussions and one should be careful in how they use each to precisely convey what they're saying. And honestly I'm getting tired of having to say "stronger in the physical sense" or "physically stronger" every single time. Give me the ability to just say the words "strong" and "strength" by themselves and have everyone know exactly what I'm talking about. It's 2018 people, the time's come for a vernacular change in geek language.
Oh, oh, and I'd say both belong in Powerhouse. Despite all the strength vs power debate ****, they're in the same league of being the team's big guns.
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