MCU vs thread....controversy and chaos

[Zarex]

I recall a Fantastic Four comic from years ago where Thing went up against an alien with Kitty Pryde's powers. All the alien did was phase his hand inside Thing's body and twist a couple organs. That put Ben down pretty fast...

That was Vision's classic attack, imo the best finishing move in comics. We saw him using it with the Ultron-bots, but I don't think movie Vision has tried it with any humans. It could be that it seems a smidge rapey.

Though he is best known for his brilliant crowd scenes, this may be my favorite George Perez panel.

 

[Iceman]

Wakanda vs Ta-Lo:

I wouldn't say its exactly "ambiguous". The residents of Ta-Lo have wuxia kung fu, its as simple as that.

Doesn't really matter here, though. Wakanda has both an advanced tech military and *faaaaar* more numbers. If it were something like "50 random Wakandan soldiers vs 50 random Ta-Lo warriors", sure, Ta-Lo probably would take it. . . but its not. And there's nothing really keeping Wakanda from just dropping airstrike after airstrike on wherever the Ta-Lo forces are located. They'll survive better against such than ordinary human fighters, but Wakanda can just keep doing it indefinitely.

As for the Guardian Dragon, if she is in play, that certainly makes things much *messier*, but note that Wakanda's military tech ranges in power up to "force field that can cause skyscraper-sized ships dropping onto it from orbit to flat out disintegrate". They definitely should be able to take her down eventually with heavy military artillery, there just is going to be a large and bloody amount of casualties first.

This covers it for me.

Btw, awesome idea for a match up @Docker2.0

 

[Batmannerism]

Wakanda vs Ta-Lo:

I wouldn't say its exactly "ambiguous". The residents of Ta-Lo have wuxia kung fu, its as simple as that.

Doesn't really matter here, though. Wakanda has both an advanced tech military and *faaaaar* more numbers. If it were something like "50 random Wakandan soldiers vs 50 random Ta-Lo warriors", sure, Ta-Lo probably would take it. . . but its not. And there's nothing really keeping Wakanda from just dropping airstrike after airstrike on wherever the Ta-Lo forces are located. They'll survive better against such than ordinary human fighters, but Wakanda can just keep doing it indefinitely.

As for the Guardian Dragon, if she is in play, that certainly makes things much *messier*, but note that Wakanda's military tech ranges in power up to "force field that can cause skyscraper-sized ships dropping onto it from orbit to flat out disintegrate". They definitely should be able to take her down eventually with heavy military artillery, there just is going to be a large and bloody amount of casualties first.

Dude, what is wuxia kung fu as a set of superpowers ? Low level defiance of normal physics, ability to get punched and kicked lots and be knocked out but not show any blood or bruising ? Ability to do lots of flashy movements which are full of awesome grace but kind of superfluous.

Much like MCU Cap, the abilities granted by wuxia are both nebulous and arbitrary, defy physics and have no logical consistency ( e.g Cap can survive falls and impacts that would splatter a normal human - he takes near full on punches from Iron Man, and can fight on so why would he feel any of Batroc's kicks or punches?

In Cap:TWS Batroc catches Cap off guard and side kicks him off his feet, twice. This is bollocks, Cap weighs 240 pounds, GSP weighs 170, even in real life this wouldn't happen, GSP could probably make him move with a full on side kick, but he wouldnt be knocked over. I know this because I've side kicked people 70 pounds heavier than myself....it isn't that effective.
Similarly the beating Shang takes from his sister should have left quite a few marks. I don't care what kind of Iron Testicle technique he knows, that would have slowed him down)

I feel like Wuxia kung fu is only really awesome against other wuxia fighters or at least people who believe in it ( like the ten rings thugs) - the moment you start putting firearms into the mix the spell is broken, as the real life Boxer rebellion proved.

 

[Docker2.0]

Wakanda wins. Next up:

The amazing Spiderman

Vs Cull Obsidian

Who you got peeps?

 

[InCali]

That was Vision's classic attack, imo the best finishing move in comics. We saw him using it with the Ultron-bots, but I don't think movie Vision has tried it with any humans. It could be that it seems a smidge rapey.

Though he is best known for his brilliant crowd scenes, this may be my favorite George Perez panel.

IIRC, it didn't work out too well when he tried that with Thor.

 

[Docker2.0]

IIRC, it didn't work out too well when he tried that with Thor.

Proof or it didn't happen........

 

[Spider-Aziz]

That's not the Andrew Garfield version of Spider-Man.

I think Cull tossed Spider-Man away in Infinity War, but I don't have any means to put how this is a Spider-Man of comebacks in words, not enough feats for that.

I'll go with CULL OBSIDIAN for now, with certainty that one or two people will argue in favor of his young opponent.

 

[Luigi]

Cull Obsidian is just too strong and durable for a single Spider-Man.

Now, if it was all of three of them, then they would have a fighting chance.

 

[Docker2.0]

That's not the Andrew Garfield version of Spider-Man.

I think Cull tossed Spider-Man away in Infinity War, but I don't have any means to put how this is a Spider-Man of comebacks in words, not enough feats for that.

I'll go with CULL OBSIDIAN for now, with certainty that one or two people will argue in favor of his young opponent.

He did but it was almost like Spidey was toying with him. I don't see Cull in the league of Hulk TBH. I actually think Spiderman can take him. Spiderman seems to be up there in strength as well.

 

[metaphysician]

Cull Obsidian vs Spider-man:

It really doesn't matter which Spider-man. Cull is more nearly in the league of the Hulk than anyone else, I am highly dubious that Spider-man, any of them, could even do anything to hurt him. Note the fight between Cull and Iron Man, where even with the Bleeding Edge armor Cull was only ultimately defeated by Wong BFRing him. Note also the fight at the end of Infinity War, where Cull was matched up against the Hulkbuster Armor, and did well until Banner sent him flying into the "Cause building-sized ships dropping from orbit to disintegrate" Wakandan force field.

 

[The Caped Knight]

Wakanda wins. Next up:

The amazing Spiderman

Vs Cull Obsidian

Who you got peeps?

No contest easily SPIDER-MAN !!!

 

[InCali]

SM

 

[Luigi]

Cull Obsidian wins a close one. Next up:

Luke Cage and Iron Fist

vs.

Deadpool and Cable

Who wins?

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Danny and Luke fought the Hand, and Cable placed his hand on Deadpool's face.

CABLE AND DEADPOOL, only cause I remember Mr. Summers using telekenesis to destroy Wade's head in one comic, and show's Luke has a glass jaw under his unbreakable skin.

 

[Batmannerism]

Deadpoo

Cull Obsidian wins a close one. Next up:

Luke Cage and Iron Fist

vs.

Deadpool and Cable

Who wins?

Deadpool and Cable 9/10.

Deadpool literally cannot be killed by anything either Luke or Danny can do and Cable has the firepower to beat them both, plus a defensive shield to deal with Luke's strength and the Iron Fist.

The only way I see Danny and Luke winning is with a surprise attack that disables and disarms Cable so they can just pound Deadpool into jelly.

 

[Batgirl0202]

Cable and Deadpool by a landslide.

Cable because he's genetically identical to Nate, who was portrayed as an Omega-level mutant when first introduced. In the comics, once his infection was under control, Cable was powerful enough to go toe-to-toe with Silver Surfer. Luke and Danny would hardly pose much of a threat to him...

And of course Deadpool has that pesky healing factor to contend with. Plus, Wade plays way too dirty for either Danny or Luke, who at least attempt to uphold moral standards when fighting...

Cable & Deadpool 10/10

 

[Batmannerism]

I agree that Cable and Wade would win - but this is onscreen Cable who doesn't show any outright superpowers beyond being a Cyborg with impressive technology and a bad attitude.

If it was comic book Cable...that would kind of defeat the purpose of voting, because it's so obvious. Kind of like Galactus vs Wolverine.

But even based on his screen feats, Cable could probably beat Luke and Danny by blasting them with his hand cannon - having Wade as a distraction just helps make it that much easier - Maximum effort !

 

[Docker2.0]

I got Cable and Deadpool easily. I don't really see how Luke and Danny can win this one.

 

[Docker2.0]

Cable and Deadpool win. Next up:
Druig

Vs Loki

Who you got peeps?!

 

[Batmannerism]

This is a post full of rage at the decline of the MCU at the hands of ****ty writers.

Loki from any MCU movie 10/10. Being shanked with an Asgardian dagger enough times is going to disable Druig.

Loki from his series, where he's a pathetic, incompetent moron.... 5/10, so long as Sylvie can save his ass.

Just seeing thus post stirs up my unbridled hatred for the Loki show. The writers took 0 % effort to make Loki's character or abilities match any of the films.

Remember the bit where he conjures a blanket in limbo, because it's chilly ? HE'S A ****ING FROST GIANT WHO'S UTTERLY IMMUNE TO COLD !!!!!

Then there's Druig - everyone's favorite emo Eternal.

Wasn't he cute with Makaari ? WASNT HE ****ING CUTE WHEN HE MIND CONTROLLED THOSE PEOPLE INTO BECOMING A CULT FOR 500 YEARS, AND USED THEM AS HUMAN PUPPETS TO " KEEP THEM SAFE" ?

Can't believe more people didn't have a massive problem with this part of the film. Guess modern audiences are dumb, but not dumb enough to be entertained by Eternals- not a bad movie ( not a good one either although it had some good moments) but some very confused morality.

Sersi ( while planning to kill a being that will create whole suns, solar systems and planets full of life)
" The cycle of violence has to end."

Because you know better than beings billions of years old who are directly responsible for all life in the universe...right Sersi. **** off film !

IMHO Ikaris was right all along.

Oh wait, how does Druig do in a fight against Loki... well I'm going to assume his mind control won't work on a sorceror. Physically they're probably well matched, in terms of strength and durability ( maybe an edge to Druig there) but Loki's illusion powers make a surprise shanking highly likely.

Okay, my rage has dissipated.

 

[metaphysician]

Luke Cage and Iron Fist vs Deadpool and Cable:

Yeah, Team D/C should win this fairly easily. They are both more skilled and have longer range than either Luke or Danny. Luke is durable enough that if it were just him vs Deadpool, he could win via tanking. . . but Cable's guns should be more than good enough to take him down. In theory Team H4H have some options, like Danny going for an area iron fist knockdown attack and trying to gank Cable's guns. . . but to be blunt, Danny is an idiot. They aren't going to pull off anything like that soon enough to matter.

 

[metaphysician]

I agree that Cable and Wade would win - but this is onscreen Cable who doesn't show any outright superpowers beyond being a Cyborg with impressive technology and a bad attitude.

If it was comic book Cable...that would kind of defeat the purpose of voting, because it's so obvious. Kind of like Galactus vs Wolverine.

But even based on his screen feats, Cable could probably beat Luke and Danny by blasting them with his hand cannon - having Wade as a distraction just helps make it that much easier - Maximum effort !

Minor correction: Cable did demonstrate powers, both telekinesis and force fields. They were not super high end, mostly just acting as a supplement to his "Highly skilled cyborg with future guns" schtick, but they were there and they would be useful. In particular, his ability to raise a shield is part of why Plan "Iron Fist The Ground" is unlikely do anything IMO.

( I suppose you could argue "those might not be powers, they could just be tech effects of his cybernetics", but that would be splitting hairs. Even if this were true, they would still be powers available to Cable, and its much more likely that those are intended to be mutant powers, just like in the comics version. )

 

[metaphysician]

Druig vs Loki:

Boiler plate, "Eternals is one movie, not the highest quality, everyone is short on feats". Etc.

IMO, Loki should take this. Druig is an extremely powerful telepath, yes. However, on one hand: he is never shown even trying to effect the other Eternals, even when it would make a lot of sense for him to do so. There are a bunch of ways to interpret this, but most of them end up at some form of "Druig's power is not nearly so unbeatable as he might wish", with defenses against it possible.

On the other hand, we *know* Loki has mental powers. He's never used them for broad area "Make everyone in range my slave", but he definitely has high end feats, probably the best being "A teamup effort with Sylvie hijacking the mind of the Alioth". He also has proven ability to shield himself from sensory powers, the most extreme being "Heimdall, who can see the entire frickin universe, can't see me if I don't want him to".

Net result? At absolute worst, Loki goes "raise all shields", puts all his power and effort into protecting himself from mental attack or detection, and then just. . . walks up to Druig and punches him. Because while I grant that Druig is certainly buffer than a normal human ( to put it mildly ), he has zero combat skill demonstrated. Loki doesn't need esoteric powers to beat him, he can just punch the dude, or stab him, or etc.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

This moment is what I think is this battle's outcome

 

[Batgirl0202]

I'll go with Loki. He's physically powerful enough to survive a throttling from Hulk, and he's considered to be among the elite of Asgard's warriors.

Add in his other abilities and he could kick some Eternal ass