Fant4stic Michael B Jordan is "Flame On!" The Human Torch - Part 2

[Dasher10]

Has anyone seen the movie? How do we know it will be terrible? I love have people are writing this movie off simply because they don't like the casting, or director or whatever. People were writing Guardians of the Galaxy off as being a flop or medicore before it even hit theaters last year and we all know how that turned out.

I certainly was. Mostly since I only knew James Gunn from PG Porn and Tromeo and Juliet and couldn't see him doing a PG-13 rated film. I was wrong.

I WANT to be wrong about Fantastic Four. I don't want Fantastic Four to be another Green Lantern. I want it to really impress me. I want it to get a sequel. I want the interdimensional travel angle to allow for a Disney/Fox crossover film based on Time Runs Out/Secret Wars. I'm just going to wait for reviews first. It's one thing to have high expectations and be disappointed like I was with Die Another Day. It's far more preferrable to go in not expecting much and leave impressed.

 

[Dasher10]

And I do know that Fox do pay attention to fans on the web and there's a very good chance they read this forum.

If they are reading this, I suggest merging universes with Marvel while keeping the FF and X-Men casts with some sort of event movie. I'd also improve the FF costumes to at the very least give them matching uniforms. They can wear blue, red, white or black, just have them match and give them an insignia.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Has anyone seen the movie? How do we know it will be terrible? I love have people are writing this movie off simply because they don't like the casting, or director or whatever. People were writing Guardians of the Galaxy off as being a flop or medicore before it even hit theaters last year and we all know how that turned out.

I said sometime near the beginning of this effort that good films generally come from 3 key components:

1. A good script
2. A good director
3. A studio that fully supports the effort and provides an appropriate budget and resources.

The script for this film was written by Jeremy Slater. Jeremy Slater has written 1 other film. That film, The Lazarus Effect, has a Rotten Tomatoes Score of 14%.

Going into this, the director seemed like the most promising aspect of the film, but since that time we've heard nothing but bad things. He acts like a child on Twitter, he was fired from his upcoming job and credible rumors indicate he was so incompetent on the job that others had to fill in more often than not.

The studio from the beginning has treated this film like a dead raccoon. They didn't present anything at comic-con, and promotion for this film - now just over two months away - has been nonexistent. And from what we know, it seems this film will have the lowest budget of any recent, major comic-book release.

So just from those key points, things don't look good. Add to that casting that seems completely inappropriate - with an actor playing Johnny who is older than the actor playing Reed. Production design that doesn't look anything like the Fantastic Four etc. etc. etc. and things go from not looking good to 'wow, this is looking grim'.

I'm still one of the more open-minded people around here, but if I had to make a judgement right now based on everything we know, I can't see much to be optimistic about.

 

[Zarex]

Semi serious question - Is Fox trying to put reviewers on notice with all this crap? "You better not give this film a bad review or you're going to be seen as racist."

The reason I think it might not be crazy to think that's part of the strategy is the timing. Nobody has been talking about Jordan's race. Most fans got over that more than a year ago, but we're just about two months out and getting to the point promotion should be starting.

Instead of having Jordan come out and talk about the actual movie, they have him come out and try to revive this dead horse that has been beaten to death.

I don't believe things like this just happen by accident. I think they're doing this somewhat intentionally.

I see it as more of a rallying cry to potential movie goers than a message to reviewers. "Are you going to let a bunch of racist trolls sitting in their mothers' basements determine who gets cast in comic book movies?"

 

[Dasher10]

I said sometime near the beginning of this effort that good films generally come from 3 key components:

1. A good script
2. A good director
3. A studio that fully supports the effort and provides an appropriate budget and resources.

The script for this film was written by Jeremy Slater. Jeremy Slater has written 1 other film. That film, The Lazarus Effect, has a Rotten Tomatoes Score of 14%.

Going into this, the director seemed like the most promising aspect of the film, but since that time we've heard nothing but bad things. He acts like a child on Twitter, he was fired from his upcoming job and credible rumors indicate he was so incompetent on the job that others had to fill in more often than not.

The studio from the beginning has treated this film like a dead raccoon. They didn't present anything at comic-con, and promotion for this film - now just over two months away - has been nonexistent. And from what we know, it seems this film will have the lowest budget of any recent, major comic-book release.

So just from those key points, things don't look good. Add to that casting that seems completely inappropriate - with an actor playing Johnny who is older than the actor playing Reed. Production design that doesn't look anything like the Fantastic Four etc. etc. etc. and things go from not looking good to 'wow, this is looking grim'.

I'm still one of the more open-minded people around here, but if I had to make a judgement right now based on everything we know, I can't see much to be optimistic about.

Well, the cast are all competent actors. That's one thing. The other thing is that either we'll get a better sequel or the rights will revert to Marvel.

 

[MakeMinesMarvel]

If they cast a Caucasian Female as the Ancient One I don't wanna hear anymore about a Black Torch

 

[marvelrobbins]

I said sometime near the beginning of this effort that good films generally come from 3 key components:

1. A good script
2. A good director
3. A studio that fully supports the effort and provides an appropriate budget and resources.

The script for this film was written by Jeremy Slater. Jeremy Slater has written 1 other film. That film, The Lazarus Effect, has a Rotten Tomatoes Score of 14%.

Going into this, the director seemed like the most promising aspect of the film, but since that time we've heard nothing but bad things. He acts like a child on Twitter, he was fired from his upcoming job and credible rumors indicate he was so incompetent on the job that others had to fill in more often than not.

The studio from the beginning has treated this film like a dead raccoon. They didn't present anything at comic-con, and promotion for this film - now just over two months away - has been nonexistent. And from what we know, it seems this film will have the lowest budget of any recent, major comic-book release.

So just from those key points, things don't look good. Add to that casting that seems completely inappropriate - with an actor playing Johnny who is older than the actor playing Reed. Production design that doesn't look anything like the Fantastic Four etc. etc. etc. and things go from not looking good to 'wow, this is looking grim'.

I'm still one of the more open-minded people around here, but if I had to make a judgement right now based on everything we know, I can't see much to be optimistic about.

The script was rewritten heavily by simon Kinberg who wrote DOFP which has 91% on RT.You should know final drafts are more what film will be.

 

[marvelrobbins]

If they cast a Caucasian Female as the Ancient One I don't wanna hear anymore about a Black Torch

agreed for truth.going from bald old white guy to female and being ok but god forbid human torch is black.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Well, the cast are all competent actors.

I'm not sure if you mean this as a back-handed compliment or not, but the talent of the cast is one of the things that is often pointed to as something special about this film.

But compared to people like Christian Bale, Edward Norton, Robert Downey Junior, Chris Evans, Eric Bana, Jennifer Connelly, William Hurt, Sam Elliot, Andrew Garfield, Patrick Stewart, Ian McKellen, Michael Fassbender, Hugh Jackman, Halle Berry, James McAvoy, Chris Hemsworth, Natalie Portman, Gwyneth Paltrow, Jeff Bridges, Chris Pratt, Zoe Saldana, Bradley Cooper, Mark Ruffalo, Scarlett Johannson, Jeremy Renner, Samuel L. Jackson etc. etc. etc.

Does this cast even stand out?

I mean it's not like "Thank God we've finally got a decent cast for a superhero film. All those previous films have made do with talentless hacks."

 

[Eddie]

The script was rewritten heavily by simon Kinberg who wrote DOFP which has 91% on RT.You should know final drafts are more what film will be.

The majority of Simon Kinberg's films have a pretty lousy RT score. He has a whopping two films as a writer that people actually liked. Let's not point to DoFP's reception and ignore Jumper, X-Men: The Last Stand, and more.

 

[Zarex]

If they cast a Caucasian Female as the Ancient One I don't wanna hear anymore about a Black Torch

So if I accept a race change for one role I am then obligated to accept all of them? That doesn't make any sense. And the only one talking anymore about a Black Torch is the guy playing a Black Torch.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

The script was rewritten heavily by simon Kinberg who wrote DOFP which has 91% on RT.You should know final drafts are more what film will be.

Oh, you mean the guy who wrote XXX State of The Union (16%) , Jumper (16%) and This Means War (26%)?

I'm feeling much better now.

 

[marvelrobbins]

Oh, you mean the guy who wrote XXX State of The Union (16%) , Jumper (16%) and This Means War (26%)?

I'm feeling much better now.

So your dismissing his work on DOFP and as script doctor of First Class?

 

[Eddie]

So your dismissing his work on DOFP and as script doctor of First Class?

I'm fairly sure that Willie, like myself, is pointing out that YOU are dismissing his work on several other films. It goes both ways, y'know?

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I'm fairly sure that Willie, like myself, is pointing out that YOU are dismissing his work on several other films. It goes both ways, y'know?

Yep. The idea that Simon Kinberg is some kind of great writing talent is simply ludicrous. We've seen his body of work and it's not good.

Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

The average Rotten Tomatoes score for all films credited to Simon Kinberg as writer that have RT scores - 48%.

 

[TeeKay]

Kinbergs script for DoFP wasnt even that great either. He was lucky because he bad Singer, who's actually a good storyteller to steer him in the right direction. Anyone read the first draft of Dofp? Its quite obvious some things were rewritten and someone polished Kinbergs script.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

Kinbergs script for DoFP wasnt even that great either. He was lucky because he bad Singer, who's actually a good storyteller to steer him in the right direction. Anyone read the first draft of Dofp? Its quite obvious some things were rewritten and someone polished Kinbergs script.

The script for DOFP was horrid. I'm utterly baffled that people sing its praises. The only reason DOFP turned out OK was because of the acting and the direction. Kinberg is a hack and we will see the real Kinberg when this film hits theaters. Unless of course Kinberg tries to throw Trank under the bus and say that he had nothing to do with its failures.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

If they cast a Caucasian Female as the Ancient One I don't wanna hear anymore about a Black Torch

Agree completely. But the only ones who keep talking about "Black Torch" are the defenders of this film?

 

[Eddie]

The script for DOFP was horrid. I'm utterly baffled that people sing its praises. The only reason DOFP turned out OK was because of the acting and the direction. Kinberg is a hack and we will see the real Kinberg when this film hits theaters. Unless of course Kinberg tries to throw Trank under the bus and that he had nothing to do with its failures.

And the writer list for his one other positively reviewed film (the first RDJ Holmes) includes the approximate population of a small town.

 

[psylockolussus]

I'm not sure if you mean this as a back-handed compliment or not, but the talent of the cast is one of the things that is often pointed to as something special about this film.

But compared to people like Christian Bale, Edward Norton, Robert Downey Junior, Chris Evans, Eric Bana, Jennifer Connelly, William Hurt, Sam Elliot, Andrew Garfield, Patrick Stewart, Ian McKellen, Michael Fassbender, Hugh Jackman, Halle Berry, James McAvoy, Chris Hemsworth, Natalie Portman, Gwyneth Paltrow, Jeff Bridges, Chris Pratt, Zoe Saldana, Bradley Cooper, Mark Ruffalo, Scarlett Johannson, Jeremy Renner, Samuel L. Jackson etc. etc. etc.

Does this cast even stand out?

Oh lord. Because the casting department had to compare the actors they hired for this film to those actors that you mentioned.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

The cast is up and coming talent, they're still establishing themselves but have been noted as going places. All of those actors are already established, the only difference between them this time.

If they cast a Caucasian Female as the Ancient One I don't wanna hear anymore about a Black Torch

Well those against a black Torch argument is "he shouldn't be different from the comics"

So naturally every single person against the casting on that principle must also be against the ancient ones casting, otherwise they're a hypocrite.

If said people are okay with that casting then that proves their issue isn't with comic accuracy they're just using that to disguise their real issue.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

Has anyone seen the movie? How do we know it will be terrible? I love have people are writing this movie off simply because they don't like the casting, or director or whatever. People were writing Guardians of the Galaxy off as being a flop or medicore before it even hit theaters last year and we all know how that turned out.

Too many talk as if the movie has already come and gone and been that quality.

I said sometime near the beginning of this effort that good films generally come from 3 key components:

1. A good script
2. A good director
3. A studio that fully supports the effort and provides an appropriate budget and resources.

The script for this film was written by Jeremy Slater. Jeremy Slater has written 1 other film. That film, The Lazarus Effect, has a Rotten Tomatoes Score of 14%.

Going into this, the director seemed like the most promising aspect of the film, but since that time we've heard nothing but bad things. He acts like a child on Twitter, he was fired from his upcoming job and credible rumors indicate he was so incompetent on the job that others had to fill in more often than not.

The studio from the beginning has treated this film like a dead raccoon. They didn't present anything at comic-con, and promotion for this film - now just over two months away - has been nonexistent. And from what we know, it seems this film will have the lowest budget of any recent, major comic-book release.

So just from those key points, things don't look good. Add to that casting that seems completely inappropriate - with an actor playing Johnny who is older than the actor playing Reed. Production design that doesn't look anything like the Fantastic Four etc. etc. etc. and things go from not looking good to 'wow, this is looking grim'.

I'm still one of the more open-minded people around here, but if I had to make a judgement right now based on everything we know, I can't see much to be optimistic about.

It fills nearly all of those.

The directors last movie was in the 80s on RT.

His personal quirks are moot as lots of artists throughout history have bizarre oersonal lives but stellar at their work.

The script was essentially re-written by Simon Kinberg whose last movie is at 91% RT.

 

[Farren]

I feel like Kinberg's writing is probably hovering between "mediocre" and "serviceable" (but I should clarify that I mean serviceable in more positive sense of the term). It's hard to judge his work because he's co-authored so many things, but I've yet to see him deliver anything really special. He's not doing much harm but he's not really elevating a project or giving it a distinct voice either.

 

[Mad Ones]

Kamala Khan, the new Ms. Marvel, is doing pretty well for Marvel. There are rumors that she's already being considered for the MCU. Just saying.

When? 2025? 2030? 2035? I'd rather have a film with some diversity now rather than wait decades. I love Kamala but I'm not holding my breath for her movie and this post just proves how difficult it is to create a new character and make them profitable enough that the studio will invest in a movie.