I dunno, I'm totally a Batman fan all the way, but that seems to me like shortchanging Superman.
And Batman, in Nolan's world, is original by choosing to use the bat elements, even though he was greatly influenced by ideas that were all around him in a formative part of his life.That's not even really the issue at hand. I'm not talking about Bruce choosing the bat elements for himself, or choosing to become something so one did before. That's always going to be unique to Batman, and it would be foolish of anyone to say otherwise. Nolan indicated that he wanted Bruce to find his own way, as far as being a masked vigilante goes. That he wanted Batman to be original. I'm saying...whether BATMAN BEGINS showcased Zorro as influencing him, The Scarlet Pimpernel, etc...the concept of a masked vigilante existed prior to Batman becoming one. I suppose we could pretend things like masked vigilantes never existed in the DARK KNIGHT universe, though. Since nothing else does.
LOL, exactly! I inmediately thought of The League Of Shadows training when he said that.I guess he hasn't seen BB in a long time...
Exactly.
I hope he 'opens his mind' a little, really. I'm sure things could work out just fine if they really want it. A World's Finest movie with Bale and Routh would be so awesome (with the right story, that is), IMO!
I dunno, I'm totally a Batman fan all the way, but that seems to me like shortchanging Superman.
And Batman, in Nolan's world, is original by choosing to use the bat elements, even though he was greatly influenced by ideas that were all around him in a formative part of his life.
It's kind of like someone finally figuring out that you could use a knife on bread and getting sliced bread.
Crook led me to this post via a thread in the TDK forums, and so now I am here to offer a rebuttal in person.
The "decision" that Nolan is referring to is the one where Wayne chooses to put on a suit that makes him look like a giant bat. Nobody even in the League of Shadows had gone far enough with their beliefs to do that. Ra's even said so himself: "You took my advice about theatricality a bit literally!" Their theatricality was only used to make them seem more than human as a group, not individually. They don't make any effort to differentiate themselves from one another - they're all ninjas.
This is important because even though Batman shares many of the same work methods as the LoS, he differs from them in one major way - he has an identity. Ra's Al Ghul, as portrayed in BB, is simply a title for the current LoS leader. If one dies, another takes over. In Nolan's version, guy with ninja skills who dresses up as a bat = Batman = Bruce Wayne. He is identifiable. If Wayne dies, Batman ceases to exist. The same can be said for Superman. Superman IS Clark Kent. If Kent disappears, a substitute cannot step in as Superman.
Having an identity makes Wayne's decision in BB a momentous one, because he's devoting his entire life to this mission, and he is a mortal human being. If there are crimefighters with super-powers already existing in Bruce Wayne's world, that lessens the importance of that decision. In fact, it almost cheapens it, making him seem like a little whiny kid who only wants to play dress-up with the big boys, when the movie says that it's anything but.
Right, but in that case LoS still kept up the image that Ken's Ra's was the real one, when he wasn't. Either way, "Ra's Al Ghul" is not a discrete identity.
