Old MCU Fantastic Four Discussion Thread

[Jordacar]

Somebody help me out with this thought. What if the Yancey Street Gang had some kind of neo-Nazi element?

See, Ben was heavily based on Jack Kirby, and one of Jack's core philosophies was "Punch Nazis." So I was trying to figure out an excuse for Ben to channel that mood, and the old Yancy Street Gang came to mind.

Now, the idea of the gang being anti-semetic doesn't gel with their comics history where Ben's brother was the leader for a while (before he got stabbed). They don't have to be any kind of KKK local chapter from jump, but I feel like there's room for some new-fangled proud boys-type of thing creeping in that Ben's gotta go down and break up. I just wanna see Ben punch some Nazis, okay?

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

The original FF origin isn’t great, but I like the aspect of Reed’s hubris being the primary cause for teams existence. This element has always been good fodder for drama especially when it comes to Ben and his guilt for basically turning his friend into a monster.

The problem with the adaptions is they miss the element of the team’s mutation largely being the fault of Reed Richards. Reed’s arrogance and is what “ruined” the FF’s lives, it was his idea to steal the spaceship and drag his best friend and girlfriend to a space adventure. Because he knew he was culpable in their transformations, he decided to market and brand the team as celebrities in order to avoid being treated like freaks and monsters.

No matter what they do with the origin, I want them to retain the aspect of the accident being largely Reed’s fault and his guilt because of it. Especially when it comes to Ben. Reed is way more responsible for his best friend Ben’s life being ruined than Peter Parker is responsible for uncle Ben’s life ending.

I think too much emphasis is put on them going to space. The key is it has to be overly ambitious, pushed by Reed and ultimately with consequences he hadn’t anticipated.

A Negative Zone origin would be fine with me as long as they emphasize those key elements.

And in some ways a negative zone origin would be MORE appropriate and MORE faithful than a space origin.

In 1961, space was an unknown frontier. It’s not the same now, and they’ll have to either create a new space mystery or do something like the negative zone.

And this concept is a large part of the reason I don’t want Sue or Johnny to be trained professionals.

I want Reed believing there’s no danger and no reason he can’t bring a couple untrained lay-people with him. Then I want him to feel the full weight of that guilt.

That effect will be greatly dulled if Sue and Johnny are part if some organized mission.

I also want Ben to object and not want to go along but I want the others to cajole him into it.

 

[BobJM]

MARVEL’S FANTASTIC FOUR
directed by John Watts

Reed Richards
Jay Ellis, 38

Sue Storm
Ana de Armas, 32

Johnny Storm
Anthony Ramos, 29

Ben Grimm
Channing Tatum, 40

Mad Thinker & the Awesome Android:
Tom Hanks (& Billy Magnussen, voice & mo-cap)

HERBIE (v.o.): Bill Hader
ROBERTA (v.o.): Maya Rudolph
Alicia Masters: Rose Byrne
Wyatt Wingfoot: Booboo Stewart
Willie Lumpkin: Carl Weathers
Leland Baxter: Stan Lee (photograph reference only, no CGI recreation)
Uatu: Jeffrey Wright

Victor von Doom
Cillian Murphy, 44

synopsis

After exposure to cosmic rays during an unauthorized spaceflight in an experimental rocket ship, Mister Fantastic, Invisible Woman, Human Torch, & the Thing utilize their newfound superpowers and band together to defend the world against perilous threats as the Fantastic Four.

Today, Marvel’s First Family square off against the nefarious criminal mastermind known only as the Mad Thinker and his Awesome Android, an artificial lifeform with super strength, durability, and ability to mimic their powers & more! As the Android evolves beyond its programming & breaks from the Thinker’s oppressive control, the Fantastic Four must find a way to save the universe from this god-like being—even if it means a trip into the Negative Zone!

NOTE: The Android is an amalgamation of the comics version, Marvel’s Super Adaptoid, & Bruce Timm’s DCAU AMAZO (i.e. redemption arc & “emancipation from creator” storyline). In the film, we also learn that Adaptoid’s voice is patterned after Thinker’s estranged son (also played by Magnussen in the film)—even our villains have a heart, and a family. The Android, who will later be referred to as Andy, can pop up in later She-Hulk seasons as he does in the comics source material, or member of the Future Foundation. Andy’s ascension to godhood incites an intervention from Uatu the Watcher.

In a plan to defeat the Awesome Android, Reed hypothesizes that the only way to combat its positive power output is with a direct negative input (science!) which can be achieved by tapping into the Negative Zone. The team will learn along the way that the ‘cosmic’ rays that gifted them their powers weren’t cosmic at all, but energies from the Negative Zone leaking into our universe—one such rupture in reality that’ll capture the attention of Annihilus and his Annihilation wave for a later sequel / MCU event.

POST-CREDITS: Dr. Doom sits in his throne room, replaying footage of the Fantastic Four in action on every monitor (replaying the scene earlier where they met Uatu, but much to Doom’s frustration, the Watcher wasn’t captured on video. Camera pulls out to a quick glimpse of his castle overlooking Latveria before cutting to BLACK.

concept art / visual story cues

Monster Isle (opening action sequence)
An excavation by Harvey Elder’s dig company has unearthed the Moloids on a remote island in the Pacific Ocean. Our intro to the FF is them rescuing the workers & helping restore peace for the disturbed Moloids.

(Moloids should be humorous, but still a threat to the civilian workers—Marvel’s “Minions”)

Future Foundation
The Future Foundation is already established to “solve everything.” At his keynote speech, Reed introduces his family & retells their first mission, i.e. their origin story, aided with holographic & video elements—first hints that Reed still feels guilt over the accident & blames himself / his hubris).

Andy the Awesome Android

Mad Thinker

The Fantasticar
The car’s converted from Reed & Ben’s beloved minivan from college for cross-dimensional travel.

The Negative Zone

Feature multiple costumes for different missions, ie. traveling into the Negative Zone

HQ / Baxter Building
Leland Baxter bought Avengers tower as a STEM passion project, hoping the building & its resources would attract the world’s brightest young minds to push beyond the frontiers of the known universe. He’s since passed, but left his massive fortune for the next generation to shape the future.

HERBIE & ROBERTA
Baxter Building’s support robots have their hands full with the FF—especially baby Franklin, who they watch while the team’s away on dangerous adventures.

Post-credits

sequel characters casting

King Namor: Yoson An
Norrin Radd / Silver Surfer: Mena Massoud

Lucia von Bardas: Matilda De Angelis
Red Ghost: Sharlto Copley
Mole Man: Jermaine Clement
Annihilus: Temeura Morrison
Kang: Jonathan Majors
Galactus: Keanu Reeves

Black Bolt: Henry Cavill
Medusa: Charlize Theron
Maximus the Mad: Andrew Scott
Gorgon: Édgar Ramírez
Karnak: Dev Patel
Triton: Chris Pang
Crystal: Elle Fanning

Dr. Amadeus Cho: Jin Ha
Abigail Brand: Katee Sackhoff
Gen. Franklin Storm: Sam Neill

note: not all casting is final & subject to further edits

 

[Crimz]

I hope they play up that Reed is eccentric a bit, especially when it comes to finding something new. I think it's a trait that can really endear audiences to him. Plus you have to be really eccentric to do what Reed does.

 

[Detective Conan]

Disney on December 10 will announce its upcoming slate. While the studio will solidify what Deadline revealed recently — that the Tom Hanks-starrer Pinocchio, Peter Pan and the Emma Stone-starrer Cruella will bypass movie theaters to become Disney+ releases— the studio will also announce new projects from Marvel, Lucasfilm and Pixar that will encompass TV as well as theatrical. It will be a gesture toward not abandoning the exhibitors. The WarnerMedia guys can perhaps make the same case – they took the beating releasing Tenet in the summer, and will provide a stream of films during the lean months of 2021 while other studios have abandoned the turf – but I’m not sure it has been received as the one-off plan it is purported to be.

Legendary Challenges WarnerMedia Over ‘Dune’ & Godzilla Vs. Kong’? – Deadline

The chances of one of those new Marvel announcements being made on Thursday will be FF related are pretty low but I’ll still keep an eye on it just in case.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Legendary Challenges WarnerMedia Over ‘Dune’ & Godzilla Vs. Kong’? – Deadline

The chances of one of those new Marvel announcements being made on Thursday will be FF related are pretty low but I’ll still keep an eye on it just in case.

I actually think the odds are pretty good. We know, with near certainty, that FF has a production company, but nothing has been officially announced. In terms of new Marvel projects (as opposed to new information on projects we already know about), FF should be one of the next announcements in line.

 

[Marvel united]

I think too much emphasis is put on them going to space. The key is it has to be overly ambitious, pushed by Reed and ultimately with consequences he hadn’t anticipated.

A Negative Zone origin would be fine with me as long as they emphasize those key elements.

And in some ways a negative zone origin would be MORE appropriate and MORE faithful than a space origin.

In 1961, space was an unknown frontier. It’s not the same now, and they’ll have to either create a new space mystery or do something like the negative zone.

And this concept is a large part of the reason I don’t want Sue or Johnny to be trained professionals.

I want Reed believing there’s no danger and no reason he can’t bring a couple untrained lay-people with him. Then I want him to feel the full weight of that guilt.

That effect will be greatly dulled if Sue and Johnny are part if some organized mission.

I also want Ben to object and not want to go along but I want the others to cajole him into it.

Tbh, I agree with this. I know the concept of the F4 being a team of a team of qualified scientists was popularized by the films and subsequent adaptations, but I find the idea of the Fantastic Four being purely the result of Reed's own hubris much more interesting

You have 4 people from very different walks of life, brought together by this tragedy; by Reed's arrogance. If Reed is so arrogant as to believe he can bring them along for the ride, it makes it all the more tragic what happens to them. They should've never been on that ship

Plus Story and Trank made them all scientists, so going back to the og origin would be a fresh change of pace.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Tbh, I agree with this. I know the concept of the F4 being a team of a team of qualified scientists was popularized by the films and subsequent adaptations, but I find the idea of the Fantastic Four being purely the result of Reed's own hubris much more interesting

You have 4 people from very different walks of life, brought together by this tragedy; by Reed's arrogance. If Reed is so arrogant as to believe he can bring them along for the ride, it makes it all the more tragic what happens to them. They should've never been on that ship

Plus Story and Trank made them all scientists, so going back to the og origin would be a fresh change of pace.

And I think that starting out in the first film if this is revealed to the audience AND Reed's dialog and actions in the movie show this to not just be lip service in the script but genuine then they have already started down a road to NOT make him just Stark 2.0.

And that's big for me.

 

[Loden Greatstorm]

Legendary Challenges WarnerMedia Over ‘Dune’ & Godzilla Vs. Kong’? – Deadline

The chances of one of those new Marvel announcements being made on Thursday will be FF related are pretty low but I’ll still keep an eye on it just in case.

We can only hope for the best....

 

[Zarex]

Tbh, I agree with this. I know the concept of the F4 being a team of a team of qualified scientists was popularized by the films and subsequent adaptations, but I find the idea of the Fantastic Four being purely the result of Reed's own hubris much more interesting

You have 4 people from very different walks of life, brought together by this tragedy; by Reed's arrogance. If Reed is so arrogant as to believe he can bring them along for the ride, it makes it all the more tragic what happens to them. They should've never been on that ship

Plus Story and Trank made them all scientists, so going back to the og origin would be a fresh change of pace.

I'm all for having the 4 be novice explorers, but I like them having skills that will enable to get them out of whatever sticky situations they find themselves in. Going on a mission with MD Sue and skilled mechanic Johnny doesn't mean they won't find themselves in over their heads when they are facing down an army of evolved alien insects.

And I don't at all see them as folks from different backgrounds. Ben and Reed were college roomies and (according to at least one story) served together during WWII. Yeah, Reed is standoffish and Ben is everybody's pal, but the two of them are more alike than they are different. And the same goes for the Storm siblings.

 

[BobJM]

Would love for the MCU to explore Reed's hubris as the root cause of the Four's transformation. Perhaps he wanted to show off for Sue and her kid brother tagged along too, not buying a word of what Reed was selling (and wanting to look out for his sister). Ben would be there because he's always at Reed's side--as brothers & professionals.

They're not explorers per se on the outset, but they grow into those roles. And they have all specialties that aid in their adventures:

Reed's the brains. Sue's the medic. Ben's the pilot. Johnny's the mechanic.

Obviously this is very cut-and-dry, black & white characterization, but just an archetype to work off as everyone's mentioned...

 

[Eddie Dean]

Luca Marinelli as Doom is the best casting I've heard in years.

 

[BobJM]

I bet you say that to all the fan casts

 

[Eddie Dean]

Just to you, babe.

 

[BobJM]

:swoon

 

[Detective Conan]

Now that it seems that the next Spider-Man flick is doing the Multiverse are you guys interested in the MCU Fantastic Four going something similar and meeting up with the old versions of themselves? Would you want MCU Reed meeting the Reed from Fan4stic?Or something like that?

 

[BobJM]

Now that it seems that the next Spider-Man flick is doing the Multiverse are you guys interested in the MCU Fantastic Four going something similar and meeting up with the old versions of themselves? Would you want MCU Reed meeting the Reed from Fan4stic?Or something like that?

No please--I worry enough for Spider-Man 3 as it is. These franchises should be looking ahead, not cashing in on cheap nostalgia this early. And I LOVE Molina's Doc Ock; but I don't see him having a place in the MCU.

In other news, Marvel announces Ioan Gruffudd will be returning and people collectively ask "Who"? And the Evans Human Torch issue too...

 

[MilkmanDan]

Now that it seems that the next Spider-Man flick is doing the Multiverse are you guys interested in the MCU Fantastic Four going something similar and meeting up with the old versions of themselves? Would you want MCU Reed meeting the Reed from Fan4stic?Or something like that?

Visiting other realities and meeting other versions of themselves would fit the science fiction/explorer aspect of FF. However I don't know how often they can use the Multiverse thing before it gets old. And the MCU Fantastic Four hasn't even been cast yet. At least MCU version of Spidey has been well established by this point so seeing him react to other versions of himself might be interesting and fun to watch.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Now that it seems that the next Spider-Man flick is doing the Multiverse are you guys interested in the MCU Fantastic Four going something similar and meeting up with the old versions of themselves? Would you want MCU Reed meeting the Reed from Fan4stic?Or something like that?

I’ve never been a fan of multiverses... or time travel for that matter, but multiverses have been a staple of Marvel comics since I was a kid, so I think it’s coming, one way or another.

But no, I wouldn’t be a fan even of the traditional multiverses from the comics.

 

[Detective Conan]

I’ve never been a fan of multiverses... or time travel for that matter, but multiverses have been a staple of Marvel comics since I was a kid, so I think it’s coming, one way or another.

But no, I wouldn’t be a fan even of the traditional multiverses from the comics.

Well...I wouldn’t mind seeing MCU Reed beat up Miles Teller’s Reed(if he becomes the Maker that is).

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Well...I wouldn’t mind seeing MCU Reed beat up Miles Teller’s Reed(if he becomes the Maker that is).

 

[Iceman]

I hope they play up that Reed is eccentric a bit, especially when it comes to finding something new. I think it's a trait that can really endear audiences to him. Plus you have to be really eccentric to do what Reed does.

Yeah, I want this side of his character to come out.

 

[Loden Greatstorm]

Josh from the den of nerds said he expects the F4 to be in Ant-Man 3.

 

[Detective Conan]

Josh from the den of nerds said he expects the F4 to be in Ant-Man 3.

Interesting if true, but will how will they appear? Will they be explorers from the 60’s displaced in time? Or will they be from the present? Time will tell!

 

[Loden Greatstorm]

Interesting if true, but will how will appear? Will they be explorers from the 60’s displaced in time? Or will they be from the present? Time will tell!

No idea but I can't wait to find out!