Prometheus - Part 3

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I am not a fan of Blade Runner. Watched it a couple years back after hearing so many great things about it and it is boring, full of holes, and all of the characters suck. The only amazing thing about that movie was the visuals. I thought the writing was mediocre and I think it's only exploded in recent times due to the following of Ridley Scott, who has made terrific movies and hopefully Prometheus is another one for that list.

It has not 'exploded in recent times', it flopped at the cinema, but took off in a big way once it was released on home video in the 80s. I saw the original cut at the cinema in about '91, and the theatre was pretty much full.
edit: and then of course a couple of years later they actually had quite an extensive release of the Director's cut into cinemas.

and as for the replicant becoming a stripper, eh, makes sense, it is the kind of job that would not be difficult to get, and would pay well(in the establishment she was in anyway). For someone on the run, that is a sensible option.
 
- Escape prison planet where you work until you die young. - CHECK!

- Come to Earth to find your maker and have your life extended before you expire.

- Become a stripper. - CHECK!

Hers and the other replicants jobs were to blend in. Roy, Hauers character was a more advanced model who was the clever one of the bunch. He was the one who was going to straighten things out. The others had to just bide their time by blending in and not getting caught.
 
Uh the movie wasn't immensely popular in 1990. Like most cult follow movies, the internet exploded their popularity. Since it seems Blade Runner is a movie you can't critique now...here is my full list of script and movie issues that I remember:

One is a stripper who has days to live and she is the only one who had a job. You would think she would be trying to extend her short life like the others knowing she will die very soon and after barely escaping the prison planet with her life.

There are 6 escaped replicants but only 4 are shown and one is dead.

The police knew what Leon looked like after he killed Holden.

Why is it difficult to tell replicants from humans when they can stick their hands in boiling liquids? You have to give them psych tests?

How did Tyrell know that Rachel ran away to never come back? That was a span of hours.

How did Roy get into Tyrell's office that easily? Anyone can just go up into Tyrell's office? You would think that security would be tighter as Tyrell knew his replicants were coming to see him and that they were very dangerous.

The detective story is muddled with clues to more muddling and it basically comes down to luck for Deckard.

It dealt with human issues with no payoff. Deckard, the replicant killer, hooks up with a replicant. Morality is saved! I had read somewhere that Deckard was a replicant in another script or something...I don't remember. That would have been an amazing revelation.

Apparently they thought the theatrical cut wasn't that great either so a DC was made and another cut or something? I haven't seen any of those. I thought the theatrical release had a poorly written script with a lead that I didn't care about because of the script. Now...Minority Report to me is a vastly superior film that deals with human morality in a future esque landscape. I don't know who wrote the script for BR but Scott did do a good job with the visuals.
 
Uh the movie wasn't immensely popular in 1990. Like most cult follow movies, the internet exploded their popularity.


[...]

Apparently they thought the theatrical cut wasn't that great either so a DC was made and another cut or something? I haven't seen any of those. I thought the theatrical release had a poorly written script with a lead that I didn't care about because of the script. Now...Minority Report to me is a vastly superior film that deals with human morality in a future esque landscape. I don't know who wrote the script for BR but Scott did do a good job with the visuals.

The theatrical had a studio imposed voiceover, that was the main point of contention in regards to the quality of the film. They added overt clues that Dekard was a replicant in the Dc as well, with the unicorn dream.
edit: the theatrical cut was still really frickin good with the vo, some people even prefer it.

It was a very popular cult movie back in 1990, why else do you think the studio thought it fit to release a Director's cut into the cinema, a re-release of a film that flopped on it's initial theatrical release no less?!
 
Hers and the other replicants jobs were to blend in. Roy, Hauers character was a more advanced model who was the clever one of the bunch. He was the one who was going to straighten things out. The others had to just bide their time by blending in and not getting caught.
So stay in that abondoned house they were in. This was a span of a couple of weeks since they escaped...not months....not years. One goes out and gets a night job after a week? One is shown on camera killing another man and he goes wandering around town? Really? Maybe if they could change their appearance or identity but come on...
 
It was a very popular cult movie back in 1990, why else do you think the studio thought it fit to release a Director's cut into the cinema, a re-release of a film that flopped on it's initial theatrical release no less?!
I see what you are saying. There is really no way to gauge that other than at conventions in 1990. Hence why I think when the internet came about the popularity exploded. Then again the DC could have just been released as a way to make money. That happened with another recent Ridley flop I believe...Kingdom of Heaven if I remember right??? That has no cult following.
 
I see what you are saying. There is really no way to gauge that other than at conventions in 1990. Hence why I think when the internet came about the popularity exploded. Then again the DC could have just been released as a way to make money. That happened with another recent Ridley flop I believe...Kingdom of Heaven if I remember right??? That has no cult following.

Aye, but the important point is, they re-released it back into theatres, and that is rare these days for big hits! I can only think of TLOTR being re-released into cinemas with their extended editions.
 
Uh the movie wasn't immensely popular in 1990. Like most cult follow movies, the internet exploded their popularity. Since it seems Blade Runner is a movie you can't critique now...here is my full list of script and movie issues that I remember:

One is a stripper who has days to live and she is the only one who had a job. You would think she would be trying to extend her short life like the others knowing she will die very soon and after barely escaping the prison planet with her life.

IIRC it was only Roy who had a matter of days left. The others were a year younger than him.

And she was a "basic pleasure model". She couldn't extend her life by herself, none of them could. That's why they followed Roy, who was the more advanced version.

There are 6 escaped replicants but only 4 are shown and one is dead.

That's not in all versions of the film. It was changed to 5 in the DC I think.

The police knew what Leon looked like after he killed Holden.

The police knew what they all looked like. They had their details, which were shown to Deckard when he went to the police station. Knowing what they look like and where to find them are different things. That's why they got Deckard back in, because he was the best Blade Runner.

Why is it difficult to tell replicants from humans when they can stick their hands in boiling liquids? You have to give them psych tests?

It wasn't boiling liquid. It was freezing liquid. The only thing strange about Leon putting his hand in the liquid is that it didn't cause him pain.

How did Tyrell know that Rachel ran away to never come back? That was a span of hours.

I guess because he thought that Rachel would feel betrayed after she found out she wasn't a real human. I imagine finding out you're not actually a real human being and your supposed uncle has been lying to you all your life would be a bit traumatising.

How did Roy get into Tyrell's office that easily? Anyone can just go up into Tyrell's office? You would think that security would be tighter as Tyrell knew his replicants were coming to see him and that they were very dangerous.

That's just something you don't think about too much. All films have little flaws like that. Or if you do wanna think about it you could say JF Sebastian has access to a private elevator, for their chess games or whatever.

The detective story is muddled with clues to more muddling and it basically comes down to luck for Deckard.

How so? How he discovered the stripper replicant was pretty clear. He discovered a fake snake scale that had a serial number on it. He found the guy who made it and he pointed him in the direction of the stripper.

It dealt with human issues with no payoff. Deckard, the replicant killer, hooks up with a replicant. Morality is saved! I had read somewhere that Deckard was a replicant in another script or something...I don't remember. That would have been an amazing revelation.

There wasn't supposed to be a pay off. It poses the question, if replicants, these "fake" human beings can feel emotions just like real humans can, what does it mean to be a real human being? What is the difference? And why should the replicants have limited life spans?

Which version did you watch? Because the directors cut heavily implies that Deckard is in fact a replicant with implanted memories, similar to Rachel. But it still leaves it ambiguous for the viewer, which I personally think is a good thing.


I see what you are saying. There is really no way to gauge that other than at conventions in 1990. Hence why I think when the internet came about the popularity exploded. Then again the DC could have just been released as a way to make money. That happened with another recent Ridley flop I believe...Kingdom of Heaven if I remember right??? That has no cult following.

The Directors Cut of Kingdom of Heaven has a cult following. It's about a million times better than the Tom Rothman butchered theatrical cut.
 
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I see what you are saying. There is really no way to gauge that other than at conventions in 1990. Hence why I think when the internet came about the popularity exploded. Then again the DC could have just been released as a way to make money. That happened with another recent Ridley flop I believe...Kingdom of Heaven if I remember right??? That has no cult following.

KOH: DC has a huge fan following. I think it's a great movie, myself.

On some of your complaints about Blade Runner:

-Roy gets into Tyrell's office because Sebastian brought him in with him as Roy was basically holding Sebastian hostage.

-Blade Runners don't burn suspects with molten liquid because if they are human that is a crime.

-The movie intentionally leaves it ambiguous as to whether Deckard is a replicant or not. There is a flash of it in his apartment when Rachel comes over. It also may be why the other detective knew Deckard dreams of unicorns, as he left a tin-foil one outside his apartment (where he chose not to kill Rachel). The real "human" moment of the film is Roy's little speech after he saves Deckard, right before he dies.

Just some clarification.
 
I always thought it was a little wonky that Tyrell wouldn't have a video camera in his lift, considering all of the other security around him. But, y'know, it's just one of those things you have to ignore. haha
 
I don't understand why Fox butchered Kingdom of Heaven. I mean, Scott just made the Oscar winning Gladiator, he wants to make an epic about the Crusades, and Fox make him shave nearly a whole hour off of it?

Madness.

For the record, the DC of Kingdom of Heaven is superior to Gladiator in my opinion.
 
The directors cut of kingdom of heaven is an amazing film. That POS truncated version that was released in theaters isn't Ridley Scott's film and it aggrevates me when people refer to it as such. I don't even listen to others opinion on the film if they haven't seen the directors cut.
 
The directors cut of kingdom of heaven is an amazing film. That POS truncated version that was released in theaters isn't Ridley Scott's film and it aggrevates me when people refer to it as such. I don't even listen to others opinion on the film if they haven't seen the directors cut.

I avoided the theatrical cut for years just based on how terrible everyone made it sound. Finally picked up the DC last year and loved it.

Fox braintrust at work once again.:whatever:
 
I avoided the theatrical cut for years just based on how terrible everyone made it sound. Finally picked up the DC last year and loved it.

Fox braintrust at work once again.:whatever:


Quantity over quality is Rothman's philosophy.
 
I am not a fan of Blade Runner. Watched it a couple years back after hearing so many great things about it and it is boring, full of holes, and all of the characters suck. The only amazing thing about that movie was the visuals. I thought the writing was mediocre and I think it's only exploded in recent times due to the following of Ridley Scott, who has made terrific movies and hopefully Prometheus is another one for that list.

Read Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?. I have a feeling you'll enjoy it a lot more.

It has a way more nuanced approach to the themes explored in Blade Runner and then some and the narrative thanks to its format as a novel is much tighter.

For starters Miss Luft isn't just a stripper but an incredibly great opera singer that interferes with Deckards ability to get rid of her because of how moved with her voice he is and begins to wonder more about the morality of the entire thing. How he gets to the conclusion of how she's a replicant is far better not to mention the following part in the book is more exciting than any point in the movie and it also uses the Voight-Kampff test in a way the movie never manages.

Not to mention Deckard is almost a completely different character in the movie and lacks all the great complexity the one in the novel does.
 
I don't understand why Fox butchered Kingdom of Heaven. I mean, Scott just made the Oscar winning Gladiator, he wants to make an epic about the Crusades, and Fox make him shave nearly a whole hour off of it?

Madness.

For the record, the DC of Kingdom of Heaven is superior to Gladiator in my opinion.

I agree. Especially with Galdiator's weak opening.
 
Blade Runner is an amazing movie. It's among my favorites. But, comparing it to Alien is unfair, because while they're both Sci-Fi, it's a different kind of Sci-Fi. Both films work in their own right. Sure, I prefer Blade Runner, but I wouldn't want Alien to be more like Blade Runner.

Also, the DCs of Blade Runner are far superior to the theatrical cut. It makes a HUGE difference.
 
Definitely.

With Blade Runner, the first time I saw it, I was like, "THIS is what people have been praising? I don't get it."

It took me a few more viewings to get it, including the abysmal theatrical cut, and two more viewings of the DC. I still don't love the film, but I can see now the praise it gets. It's pretty layered and subtle, with very good writing. But I've grown to like the film more.
 
Uh the movie wasn't immensely popular in 1990. Like most cult follow movies, the internet exploded their popularity. Since it seems Blade Runner is a movie you can't critique now...here is my full list of script and movie issues that I remember:

One is a stripper who has days to live and she is the only one who had a job. You would think she would be trying to extend her short life like the others knowing she will die very soon and after barely escaping the prison planet with her life.

There are 6 escaped replicants but only 4 are shown and one is dead.

The police knew what Leon looked like after he killed Holden.

Why is it difficult to tell replicants from humans when they can stick their hands in boiling liquids? You have to give them psych tests?

How did Tyrell know that Rachel ran away to never come back? That was a span of hours.

How did Roy get into Tyrell's office that easily? Anyone can just go up into Tyrell's office? You would think that security would be tighter as Tyrell knew his replicants were coming to see him and that they were very dangerous.

The detective story is muddled with clues to more muddling and it basically comes down to luck for Deckard.

It dealt with human issues with no payoff. Deckard, the replicant killer, hooks up with a replicant. Morality is saved! I had read somewhere that Deckard was a replicant in another script or something...I don't remember. That would have been an amazing revelation.

Apparently they thought the theatrical cut wasn't that great either so a DC was made and another cut or something? I haven't seen any of those. I thought the theatrical release had a poorly written script with a lead that I didn't care about because of the script. Now...Minority Report to me is a vastly superior film that deals with human morality in a future esque landscape. I don't know who wrote the script for BR but Scott did do a good job with the visuals.

Roy is the only one concerned with finding out how long the replicants have left, and in the possibility of extending that. *None* of the replicants know how long they have. Deckard, in fact, makes a blatant reference to it in his ending voice-over.

And Roy is able to get into Tyrell through JF, who is Tyrell's mental sparring partner.

And yes, Deckard probably is a replicant. That question has been debated heatedly by BR fans both hardcore and casual for decades.

Yes, decades. BR wasn't a box office success, but it gained an instant cult following that has lasted and grown exponentially since the 80s. And that Ridleyphilia didn't develop retrograde after Gladiator; he had a great critical and cult following in the 80s after Alien and Blade Runner. Most of us in geekdom back then saw him purely as a sci-fi director. We've been patiently waiting for him to return to the genre for 30 years.

And *that's* one of the reasons why Prometheus is getting so much hype....it's like the prodigal son finally coming home after all these years.
 
yeah this notion that Blade Runner has only become popular since the advent of the internet is nonsense.
 
Seems like it'd fit the "giant" being spotted by the SJ chair perfectly. ;)
 
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