Justice League Ray Fisher - WB Investigation Updates Thread

[Aurakles]

Fisher doesn't seem to believe that all the guilty parties have been held accountable. He's said repeatedly that he wants an apology for what happened. He said Jon Berg called him to apologise near the start of this and he's left Berg alone since then.
Other members of cast and crew, including Jason Momoa have backed Fishers claims, Gal Gadot and Deborah Snyder have also mentioned problems with the reshoots they took to higher ups.
The claim is that once in position, Hamada tried to cover up what happened.
Someone doesn't need to be physically assaulted in order to qualify as abusive, unprofessional behaviour. Just because you aren't a super famous celebrity doesn't mean you shouldn't speak up about problems in the workplace.

 

[MOVIELORD101]

Fisher doesn't seem to believe that all the guilty parties have been held accountable. He's said repeatedly that he wants an apology for what happened. He said Jon Berg called him to apologise near the start of this and he's left Berg alone since then.
Other members of cast and crew, including Jason Momoa have backed Fishers claims, Gal Gadot and Deborah Snyder have also mentioned problems with the reshoots they took to higher ups.
The claim is that once in position, Hamada tried to cover up what happened.
Someone doesn't need to be physically assaulted in order to qualify as abusive, unprofessional behaviour. Just because you aren't a super famous celebrity doesn't mean you shouldn't speak up about problems in the workplace.

That's a fair counterpoint, but again Walter Hamada was not the guy in charge of that movie at the time (he was brought on AFTER JL came out) and the claims against Geoff Johns are dubious at best unless someone else says otherwise. In short, innocent until proven guilty. Plus again, this was all nearly half a decade ago. If this all happened last year, then I wouldn't be complaining. I don't mind Ray speaking out about what happened, but my biggest problem is that he's been going on about all of this for over a freaking year. Again, sue the studio already or move the hell on. He's making himself look like a prima donna at this point. He got his scenes back into the movie, Whedon's been punished, Kevin's gone and Geoff Johns has been shunted elsewhere. What else can WB and DC DO? They've got other **** to worry about right now!

And yes, Gal Gadot has commented on this matter a few times, but it's not like she's CONSTANTLY talking about this on social media or to the press. That's what Ray's doing. He's going on and on about this mess and that's ALL he's talked about! If he's THAT disgruntled, then why not just go over to Marvel Studios and work for them? They treat they're actors better from what I've heard! It's like hearing a friend constantly whine to you about how much they hate their job every day with the exact same complaints. It gets to a point where you just have to go "Dude, I'm sorry you have to put up with that crap, but can you PLEASE talk about something else?"

 

[Aurakles]

One thing WB could do is offer a public apology. I think that would go a long way towards resolving this.

As to why he's still taking about it, from the most recent Hollywood Reporter interview:
"I don't believe some of these people are fit for positions of leadership," says Fisher, who explains he's not looking for anyone to be fired. "I don't want them excommunicated from Hollywood, but I don't think they should be in charge of the hiring and firing of other people." Fisher knows he's not going to win that battle, but he feels a point has been made. "If I can't get accountability," he says, "at least I can make people aware of who they're dealing with."

Ray is working with other studios now, but he should always be free to talk about what happened. If people don't want to hear about this, it isn't too hard to avoid. I'm not interested in Star Wars, so I don't go into Star Wars threads and skip over posts about it when it comes up in other threads.

 

[MOVIELORD101]

One thing WB could do is offer a public apology. I think that would go a long way towards resolving this.

As to why he's still taking about it, from the most recent Hollywood Reporter interview:
"I don't believe some of these people are fit for positions of leadership," says Fisher, who explains he's not looking for anyone to be fired. "I don't want them excommunicated from Hollywood, but I don't think they should be in charge of the hiring and firing of other people." Fisher knows he's not going to win that battle, but he feels a point has been made. "If I can't get accountability," he says, "at least I can make people aware of who they're dealing with."

Ray is working with other studios now, but he should always be free to talk about what happened. If people don't want to hear about this, it isn't too hard to avoid. I'm not interested in Star Wars, so I don't go into Star Wars threads and skip over posts about it when it comes up in other threads.

Fair enough. Again, you make solid points, dude.

 

[super85]

I was reading this thread, then my microwave went "ping!" and I had to leave.

 

[DrexlLookinAss]

The claim is that once in position, Hamada tried to cover up what happened.

He said Hamada was tampering with the investigation but now he's taking that back apparently

 

[DrexlLookinAss]

as for Walter Hamada, he said the Snyder Cut is a Cul de Sac"

Do you have a quote of him saying that because i'm pretty sure that was said to have come from someone at WB that wasn't named, it wasn't confirmed to be Hamada.

 

[Schlosser85]

The Snyder Cut is a Cul de Sac because it’s not leading to anything more, it was just indulging Snyder and letting him have his own cut. It had nothing to do with Ray Fisher or racism.

 

[MOVIELORD101]

The Snyder Cut is a Cul de Sac because it’s not leading to anything more, it was just indulging Snyder and letting him have his own cut. It had nothing to do with Ray Fisher or racism.

Exactly. No harm in releasing it, but it was never going to lead to anything else. It's a one-off deal and even Snyder acknowledged as such.

 

[obredaan]

I really think this Cocos user is just out to attack and criticize people who don't side with him. Why am I getting called out for saying Fisher should go work for Marvel? I WANT to see him get more work in Hollywood and I thought he was great in the Snyder Cut! Yes the people at WB responsible for these problems need to be exposed and punished accordingly, but that's gonna a lot more than just one actor on Twitter posting a lot about it.

Outside of this, WB has booted actors like Johhny Depp over false accusations and given people like Amber Heard who are violent, lying abusive monsters more work. We need more actors and directors who've worked with this studio whove faced similar issues to come together and campaign to make the studio change their ways. One actor shouldn't have to burden this alone. Sorry if I haven't made this clear.

Based on the fact that Fisher is still talking about this and is basically accusing everyone of racism over every decision made from cutting out characters, Cyborg getting torn in half to simply saying his catchphrase. Its safe to say nobody is going to take on chance on him at this point. He's not helping himself and the fact that everyone in the cast have said very little about the situation only makes it look worse for him. Gadot seemingly dealt with a lot worse and hasn't been as vocal about it. He has to decide whether he wants a career or does he just want to spend the rest of his life complaining about how he was mistreated while filming a movie 4 years ago. Whedon is gone so like move on already.

 

[Aurakles]

I think Fishers belief is that Whedon was only ever a part of the problem. That while he may be gone, the system that enabled him and covered up for him is still in place. That without systemic change, there is nothing to stop other directors from repeating the same behaviour, safe in the knowledge the studio has their back.

 

[Avs21]

Outside of this, WB has booted actors like Johhny Depp over false accusations and given people like Amber Heard who are violent, lying abusive monsters more work. We need more actors and directors who've worked with this studio whove faced similar issues to come together and campaign to make the studio change their ways. One actor shouldn't have to burden this alone. Sorry if I haven't made this clear.

False accusations ??
Not even WB are dumb enough to fire an abused woman.

 

[obredaan]

I think Fishers belief is that Whedon was only ever a part of the problem. That while he may be gone, the system that enabled him and covered up for him is still in place. That without systemic change, there is nothing to stop other directors from repeating the same behaviour, safe in the knowledge the studio has their back.

Systemic change is a bit of a pipe dream at the end of the day. Corporate interests will always come first no matter who's in charge. They can remove everyone involved with the investigation but there's no guarantee that it wouldn't happen again. I understand the importance in fighting systemic racism as I fully support it but nothing that Fisher has provided so far lines up with his accusations of racism. The investigators found no evidence of racism so what more can be done? Do we need another investigation into the previous investigations?

 

[Schlosser85]

Systemic change is a bit of a pipe dream at the end of the day. Corporate interests will always come first no matter who's in charge. They can remove everyone involved with the investigation but there's no guarantee that it wouldn't happen again. I understand the importance in fighting systemic racism as I fully support it but nothing that Fisher has provided so far lines up with his accusations of racism. The investigators found no evidence of racism so what more can be done? Do we need another investigation into the previous investigations?

Didn’t Fisher basically call for investigating the investigators, or at least cast suspicion on them?

 

[heatvision38]

Something I've wanted to write but haven't had the time regarding the nuances of this situation:

I've seen some people here state that Ray just took things the wrong way, that the information he has provided so far doesn't indicate instances of racism. While I can't and won't speak to whether any kind of racism was involved, be it overt or of the more subtle variety, I think it's important to note that it's hard to really get across exactly what went down in a situation for people who weren't there.

We've all used or heard the saying, "I guess you had to be there." Think about retelling a funny story where the person you're telling it to isn't laughing and you realize it's not translating as well because, well, you had to be there. Who here hasn't been in a tough situation where, say, they had issues with their boss or a coworker or something similar, and when they share what the problems are, things said and done over time, others don't fully get what the problem is. Yet, you being in those situations, you see first hand all the nuances, subtleties, timings, facial expressions, all the many things that go into an interpretation of events, including knowing how your other coworkers feel about this person. It all goes into the soup, so to speak.

It's important that we don't just assume we know all of what's happened or hasn't happened because we weren't there. We only have details recounted after the fact. Did Ray overreact to things or see things through a race prism? It's certainly possible. Did Ray pick up on things he has seen many times over the years as a black man, things that most whites would never pick up on or think to be a big deal? That's also possible. I wasn't there, so I don't know.

I say this because I see a number of people condemning Ray as if he is either just being a drama queen or is just racially oversensitive or is just upset his role was cut (wow, what an unkind reading of his comments), and so on. Maybe all that is true. Maybe it's not. Or maybe it's somewhere in the middle. But I will say, if you are so quick to defend the other guys and critique Ray, if that's been your approach this whole time, ask yourself why that is. Why is that your go-to perspective on events and why do you feel so passionately about defending it? It's okay to be humble about events we just don't fully know of. It's okay to simply say, "I don't know." I promise you, it doesn't hurt and it doesn't make you any less intelligent or your opinions any less meaningful. If anything, it makes them mean more.

At that, I will get off my soapbox.

 

[obredaan]

It's important that we don't just assume we know all of what's happened or hasn't happened because we weren't there.

It's also important to remember that there was an investigation into the accusations of racism. Whatever assumptions will be made of those results will be made.

 

[heatvision38]

It's also important to remember that there was an investigation into the accusations of racism. Whatever assumptions will be made of those results will be made.

Not sure your point here.

 

[DKDetective]

my grammar is not as bad as your "thinking", because im still tryin to find where i said that U support "Whedon" while i make it clear i was talkin about Hamada, But Whatever Man, a 10 years Old would have guessed.right ?

as for Ray fisher ,No he doesn't need to move On, he need to expose them ,and sure He did,
and he clearly said he wanted to make a Point "theses peoples are not right to fit their Postions" and be hold accountable.
"he should go to Marvel Studios,they treat actors better there" u really said that, u really use the Irony , after what happened to the Man and the other POC actors , u really had the Nerve.

Good Look

I just told you guys to quit it with this crap last night on The Batman boards. We have had it with your confrontational attitude, inability to play nice, and the crimes against the English language.

I really think this Cocos user is just out to attack and criticize people who don't side with him. Why am I getting called out for saying Fisher should go work for Marvel? I WANT to see him get more work in Hollywood and I thought he was great in the Snyder Cut! Yes the people at WB responsible for these problems need to be exposed and punished accordingly, but that's gonna a lot more than just one actor on Twitter posting a lot about it.

Outside of this, WB has booted actors like Johhny Depp over false accusations and given people like Amber Heard who are violent, lying abusive monsters more work. We need more actors and directors who've worked with this studio whove faced similar issues to come together and campaign to make the studio change their ways. One actor shouldn't have to burden this alone. Sorry if I haven't made this clear.

You need to cool it too. Stop feeding the trolls. Don't insult them back, just report them. Trolling is not an excuse to flame back. Leave it to the mods.

 

[MOVIELORD101]

You need to cool it too. Stop feeding the trolls. Don't insult them back, just report them. Trolling is not an excuse to flame back. Leave it to the mods.

Fair enough. I shall do that. Btw, love the use of Hell's Kitchen gifs.

 

[The Guard]

Got here late.

In what Ray has now detailed, I see some racial insensitivity, and he kind of presents it as such. Outright abuse? Not so much. And that's the problem with Fisher's narrative. He accused them of abusive behavior. It really does sound like Gadot clashed with Whedon more and received more direct/abusive threats than anyone. Still not a good look for WB, but not at all what they were being accused of. That said, Whedon does start to look like kind of an *******. It's interesting to see Fisher trying the olive branch route now after all his accountability>entertainment, never-work-for-them-again-while-X-person-is-there talk.

 

[MbJ]

 

[Filmfreak]

This is borderline insulting to the director and the rest of the people involved in this production.

 

[Da-Scribe]

Meh, not really. He could've said a lot worse considering they fired him from the project. He's just shading Hamada here and talking about the investigation's participants. Same thing he's been doing for awhile now.

 

[Mani-Man]

I mean i get it, he is upset and feels wronged by Hamada...and of course the bitterness that the movie starts shooting he was supposed to be in.
I get all that, but the way he communicates it...comes off more as a sulking child going "remember me, im upset, pay attention to ME"

It is understandable that he is upset at this, the studio he feels wronged him annoucing the start of the shooting for the movie he was fired from...that of course stings.

 

[Filmfreak]

Meh, not really. He could've said a lot worse considering they fired him from the project. He's just shading Hamada here and talking about the investigation's participants. Same thing he's been doing for awhile now.

When he retweets something that the director shared, who has nothing to do with Hamada and the rest of this behind-the-scenes drama, without even wishing a good luck to the project and the people involved or wait a few days to comment on something that only has indirect connection to his story, then yeah, it seems pretty disrespectful.