Scream 4!!!!! - Part 4

[Anjow1060]

Its like you missed the point of the movie. This movie is a diss on remakes by appearing to be a remake and yet killing off the new characters and then Sydney saying "don't **** with the original" reinforces that idea that you can't beat the original. This movie isn't a remake. Its a knock against remakes and all the stupidity that can sometimes come with them. So it did exactly what it was supposed to do. It appears some might be letting there hate of remakes effect their judgement of this film. Let me say it again, this film is not a remake. It is taking the ideas of a usual remake and pissing on them. The first film took slasher standards and turned them on there head and showed how crappy the Slasher genre had gotten. The second was a knock against sequels. The third well I haven't quiet figured out that one lol but it was a knock against something. This film followed in the same vein. These films have always been commentaries about what's wrong with the genre and films in general.

Oh I got that. Trust me. But the style in which everything was done was to say "remakes suck." And so in the killers emulating that.....THIS movie sucked.

And aside from the homages to remake rules and such there is still a reality that is a give and take.

I can believe that Billy and Mickey come back for one last scare. Even ____ in 4, but to drag out a knife to the brain for a full minute before death with an atrocious comedy dialogue line..... that's just bad movie making all over and either has Krueger's finger prints on it, or you-know-who said "Well in the other movie I made that was like this one... this is what we did. Can I improv Wes? Can I?"

- Jow

PS: Thank you mclay.

 

[DACrowe]

My dislike of this movie and seeing how so many posters I have always respected on here like Joker and DACrowe loved the series so much inspired me to rewatch the first 2 today on netflix. Man I saw the first when I was 13 and the second at 14 and I will say at 27 both still hold up quite well. Especially the calls. I could see the problem Jow had with the voice. That call to Casey in part 1 and how you can tell just based on the voice inflictions who Billy and Stu are when they alternate and how calm the convo all starts (Billy) out and crescendos into him flipping completely (Stu), stroke of effing genius.

Definitely something this new one sorely lacked with it's aggressiveness from the get go when it came to the voice. I'll concede though that indeed since these were STAB inspired killers that justifies the tone but still that stuff is sorely missed. Also the convo with Randy and the way Kennedy delivers the FU lmao damn. It's comedic but still not over the top like the new comedy and then the way Mrs. Loomis just drags him in and kills the poor guy, so tragic. Perfect balance of horrid death and comedy unlike the death of that one "Bruce Willis" guy. I miss this Wes Craven and Kevin Williamson.

Oh and was I really the only person who completely called that "closet" bit? like seriously how could any slasher fan not see that one coming a mile away. That's another thing there just was no genuine suspense in this one for me. I'm looking at the Casey trying to get to her parents or Elise Neal and Sidney trapped in the car with Ghostface scene and how much tension those have. This new movie had none of that. Maybe I'm just getting too old for the subgenre then again if that were true I wouldn't have enjoyed Cold Prey and My Bloody Valentine 3D so much so...

Glad you enjoyed them. I do think Scream 2 (despite dragging between Randy's death and Dewy's "death") is better than Scream 4. I think fans saying the new one is better....is because it's new. However, Scream 4 is still a good movie, imo, which is more than I can say for Scream 3.

As you noted those films had a bit more of a sense of tragedy and suspense to them because you thought anyone could die anytime (as opposed to telling who was pretty well safe in Scream 4) and the phone chats were just so suspenseful. Randy was also my favorite character in the series so I was so pissed when he died when I first Saw Scream 2 and still am a bit pissed. But his battle of wits with Ghostface is one of the best scenes in the entire series and Mrs. Loomis killed him because she lost and didn't want to hear her boy be put in his place. BTW I think Kirby in Scream 4 is a combination of Randy and Tatum (Rose McGowan's character in Scream) which is why we fans have reacted so well to the new character--more than anyone introduced in Scream 2 or 3, methinks.


But glad you enjoyed them. Both had brilliant endings as well with Billy's "Don't blame the movies, Sid! Movies don't make killers....MOVIES MAKE KILLERS MORE CREATIVE!" as he stabs his best friend. In Scream 2, Mickey's all "I'm going to blame the movies because in the '90s it's all about the trial!....****, the Christian Coalition will pay for my defense!" or something like that.

I think the ending of Scream 4, unlike Scream 3, had an ending that lived up to the biting social commentary of the first two films.

 

[antsman41]

Search: Now Playing Presents in iTunes Podcasts.

The have a podcast dedicated to each of the first 3 films, pretty interesting to hear. Especially the girl who just saw them (thinks SCREAM sucks) for her first time, haha.

 

[DACrowe]

THANK YOU CAIN AND DARK DEFENDER!

I'm not insane and lonely after all!

*group hug*

- Jow

But ask 'em if they thought Scream 3 was better than Scream 4 or on par with the first two? I don't know, but I hope they'd say no.

 

[antsman41]

But glad you enjoyed them. Both had brilliant endings as well with Billy's "Don't blame the movies, Sid! Movies don't make killers....MOVIES MAKE KILLERS MORE CREATIVE!" as he stabs his best friend. In Scream 2, Mickey's all "I'm going to blame the movies because in the '90s it's all about the trial!....****, the Christian Coalition will pay for my defense!" or something like that.

It's funny that the killers of 1, 2, and 4 all misconceive (wrong word, but I'm at a loss what what word I'm thinking of) each others motives/beliefs, even though they all try to be the same creature/villain.

Billy: Movies don't make killers...
Mickey: Movies make killers...
Roman: Killers make movies...
[BLACKOUT]Jill[/BLACKOUT]: Killers make movies out of reality...

 

[Doctor Jones]

The choice of songs in this film was well done too. That song by The Sounds in the title was so ****ing good. It oozed Scream so damn much. When that knife came down and the title went up, the song came on with the cut of the pan down to Woodsboro, I had a huge grin on my face. I was absolutely loving the film so far.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

I don't understand why someone would pay so much money to see a film they hate so many times. If you hate it, can't you just wait to watch it on DVD at least and dissect it. You must have alot of money to spend, or that's all you spend your money on. Which is cool, because I only spend my money on movies.

Exactly! Fans say "I aht this film", but at the same time, they pay money to see it. Fans are fickle.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

But I hate the FT13 franchise. They're mindless, unscary gore and misogyny. The remake while far better directed and made than the original films, only hightened these other factors.

Well, they are fun films in aot of peoples minds. MAybe it's because I love horror movies that i feel this way, but I do. I mean, I hate the Hostel and Saw franchise. To me ,that's mindless blood and gore. Jason? Yeah, there's blood, but there's more character development than Saw. Besides, ca't people just see films to have fun? Does it always have to be a gripping story?

 

[Doctor Jones]

My dislike of this movie and seeing how so many posters I have always respected on here like Joker and DACrowe loved the series so much inspired me to rewatch the first 2 today on netflix. Man I saw the first when I was 13 and the second at 14 and I will say at 27 both still hold up quite well. Especially the calls. I could see the problem Jow had with the voice. That call to Casey in part 1 and how you can tell just based on the voice inflictions who Billy and Stu are when they alternate and how calm the convo all starts (Billy) out and crescendos into him flipping completely (Stu), stroke of effing genius.

Definitely something this new one sorely lacked with it's aggressiveness from the get go when it came to the voice. I'll concede though that indeed since these were STAB inspired killers that justifies the tone but still that stuff is sorely missed. Also the convo with Randy and the way Kennedy delivers the FU lmao damn. It's comedic but still not over the top like the new comedy and then the way Mrs. Loomis just drags him in and kills the poor guy, so tragic. Perfect balance of horrid death and comedy unlike the death of that one "Bruce Willis" guy. I miss this Wes Craven and Kevin Williamson.

Oh and was I really the only person who completely called that "closet" bit? like seriously how could any slasher fan not see that one coming a mile away. That's another thing there just was no genuine suspense in this one for me. I'm looking at the Casey trying to get to her parents or Elise Neal and Sidney trapped in the car with Ghostface scene and how much tension those have. This new movie had none of that. Maybe I'm just getting too old for the subgenre then again if that were true I wouldn't have enjoyed Cold Prey and My Bloody Valentine 3D so much so...

Man, the first two films are available for you? I have "very long wait" for both.

My brother hasn't watched the second one yet. He's seen the rest (and loved 4) and is eager to see the second.

It's funny that the killers of 1, 2, and 4 all misconceive (wrong word, but I'm at a loss what what word I'm thinking of) each others motives/beliefs, even though they all try to be the same creature/villain.

Billy: Movies don't make killers...
Mickey: Movies make killers...
Roman: Killers make movies...
[BLACKOUT]Jill[/BLACKOUT]: Killers make movies out of reality...

That's a great point there. Though I agree with Billy the most. What I love is how Billy says how movies don't create psychos, movies make psychos more creative and tried to get away with it, then Mickey comes in and tries to disprove what Billy said. Wanting to get caught and the trial. Because the trial thing and cinema violence was becoming more prominent in the 90's. So one would think Mickey could get away with it more than Billy and Stu could have. It just makes you think about the times.

Spoiler

Jill's is spot on too. We've all heard the sayings of what happens in real life you can't make up in the movies. It's what Jill and Charlie tried to do and Roman in a way. But his was more out of jealousy. At least Jill was a legitimate family member.

The funny twist is Roman was jealous and angry about his mother not wanting anything to do with him and barely knowing him while Jill barely knew Sydney and was jealous of her and wanting to be her.

I also love the fact that Jill's "Get away with it and blame it on the others" plan came to fruition. The fact we got to see more of the killer unmasked and doing more after the reveal was a great change. Seeing this little psycho ***** sneak into the hospital room and trying to kill her own cousin was ****ed up.

 

[The Dark Defender]

Woah, woah, WOAH. That is offensive!

....SNL hasn't been this funny in at least, AT LEAST 10 or 12 years, if that.

Yeah, I'll definitely agree with you there.

I think this is probably a more fun film than 3, I still think 3 is a better horror film though.

As what this movie was trying to be, which as far as I could tell was just all out self paordy meant to induce primarily laughs, it was effective enough. I was definitely laughing at alot of it, especially their [/spoiler]Tropic Thunder style false title card opening[/spoiler], I just wish it were more intense.

The deaths in the first two had a feeling of tragedy to them, even minor characters. When Maureen Evans crawls up on stage choking on her own blood and dies in front of a room full of people as they realize this wasn't a publicity stunt and they're watching somoene die horribly in front of them, it's very sad and disturbing.
If she were in this film, she would've staggered up there and made some joke to the audience about how she can't die yet because it's not within the confines of the rules, coughed up some blood, then fell over.

Even S3 wouldn't have characters make silly gags out of their OWN death scenes.

 

[The Joker]

Even S3 wouldn't have characters make silly gags out of their OWN death scenes.

One of them did. Jennifer's death, she shouts at Ghostface right before he kills her; "You can't kill me, I'm the killer in Stab 3. I'M THE KILLER IN STAB 3!!!!".

 

[The Dark Defender]

That wasn't actually WHILE dying though, she was being chased and cornered at the time, but she didn't make that remark AFTER fatal wounds were inflicted while she was bleeding to death.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

^^ It still was comedic.

 

[Doctor Jones]

And she was kind of annoying. I was just waiting for her to die.

 

[Anjow1060]

The choice of songs in this film was well done too. That song by The Sounds in the title was so ****ing good. It oozed Scream so damn much. When that knife came down and the title went up, the song came on with the cut of the pan down to Woodsboro, I had a huge grin on my face. I was absolutely loving the film so far.

I will step back and say I do like this. The opening song and the one at the start of the end credits were PERFECT for a Scream movie.

- Jow

 

[antsman41]

Spidey/Joker/Dark Defender,

-Cotton's "hit" from the bookshelf
-Tyson's fall/trip from the rug
-Patrick Dempsey's ridiculous reactions to objects hitting him

were all 10x worse than "****, Bruce Willis" and "I'm Gay!"

Hell, Tatum's death was ridiculous. No garage door could lift a 130lbs woman. But, we don't give that ****...

 

[Doctor Jones]

Plus I gotta say, this supporting cast felt so much more well rounded than the supporting cast of the second and third. More developed in personality as well. I mean I still loved the supporting cast in the second, but they didn't get as much compared to the first or this. Derek was the most developed in the second with his suspicion. Mickey even dropped out of it in the beginning of the second act.

 

[The Dark Defender]

^^ It still was comedic.

Yeah, and it was kinda stupid, but I think the death gags in 4 are far more stupid.

 

[Doctor Jones]

I will step back and say I do like this. The opening song and the one at the start of the end credits were PERFECT for a Scream movie.

- Jow

Yeah, they really captured the spirit of the Scream films and didn't do the usual mainstream **** you would usually find here. All within the spirit of them.

Which one was at the end credits. Was it Devils or Bad Karma first?

 

[Anjow1060]

Exactly! Fans say "I aht this film", but at the same time, they pay money to see it. Fans are fickle.

Or... ya know... I wanted to give it another shot. Being one of my favorite franchises and all.

Maybe my mind was wrong the first time around.

So I turned around and saw the very next showing.

Still didn't like it.

Thought.... ok, maybe I'll sleep on it. Went to bed. Woke up the next day. 10 hours on a film set. Went to a nice dinner. Got laid. And went to see it again.

Still didn't like it.

Will go one more time minimum at least next weekend after processing it all week to see if my view changes.

Not to mention - with any Scream movie the first and 2nd viewing are TOTALLY different.

The Dark Defender Re: Scream 4!!!!! - Part 4
That wasn't actually WHILE dying though, she was being chased and cornered at the time, but she didn't make that remark AFTER fatal wounds were inflicted while she was bleeding to death.

This. ^^

The Dark Defender Re: Scream 4!!!!! - Part 4
Quote:
I think this is probably a more fun film than 3, I still think 3 is a better horror film though.

This as well ^^.

- Jow

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

Yeah, and it was kinda stupid, but I think the death gags in 4 are far more stupid.

The comedic stuff in Scream 4 were quick. People still jumped and screamed in my theater. it was still a horror film.

 

[Anjow1060]

Yeah, they really captured the spirit of the Scream films and didn't do the usual mainstream **** you would usually find here. All within the spirit of them.

Which one was at the end credits. Was it Devil or Bad Karma first?

Pretty sure it's Bad Karma.

No matter how much I was pissy about the movie... I left the theatre singing that song all 3 times. lol

- Jow

 

[antsman41]

Plus I gotta say, this supporting cast felt so much more well rounded than the supporting cast of the second and third. More developed in personality as well. I mean I still loved the supporting cast in the second, but they didn't get as much compared to the first or this. Derek was the most developed in the second with his suspicion. Mickey even dropped out of it in the beginning of the second act.

This...

Trevor probably has more screentime than Mickey.

Hallie (I always want to call her Angela because of Boy Meets World), Derek, Sorority Chicks, Cameraman (S2), "Parker Posey", Tyson, Angelina, Tom, and Sarah were all worse/annoying/dumb additions compared to these new kids.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

Spidey/Joker/Dark Defender,

-Cotton's "hit" from the bookshelf
-Tyson's fall/trip from the rug
-Patrick Dempsey's ridiculous reactions to objects hitting him

were all 10x worse than "****, Bruce Willis" and "I'm Gay!"

Hell, Tatum's death was ridiculous. No garage door could lift a 130lbs woman. But, we don't give that ****...

Exactly. Don't get em wrong, I really like Scream 3, but those are obvious "odd" instances. More so than Scream 4, if you ask me.

 

[The Englishman]

Still not seen this movie yet, probably go see it over the easter weekend. Can someone tell me if there are any references to Randy or an appearance by his sister??