Something We All May Need To Do Post-may 26!

Why not just take a stand and go to Fox? Fox has a big official building, right? Someone use Google Earth and find the place. We'll bring pitchforks, catapults, bazookas, bonfires, whatever. :o We'll start a damn frigging riot!
 
You raised good points Bosef. I'll give the film the benefit of the doubt until I see it. If its good I'll be very pleased, probably see it multiple times at the theatre, and then buy the dvd when it comes out. If it isn't good then I won't see it again at the theatre and I won't buy the dvd.
 
Nell2ThaIzzay said:
I must say, I find this over-reaction to the running time to be nothing short of appauling.

Okay, so first of all, let's all step down off of our pedastals and realize that we are fans, not film makers. Let us also realize that despite what we think we know, in the end, it is just that; what we think we know. We don't know jack **** about how the story arcs in this movie are going to play out. We don't know jack **** about how the different arcs are going to connect together. And, despite contrary belief, we have absolutley no idea how long this movie needs to be.

Now that that is out of the way, how about a little defense for the real film makers... whatever the running time of this movie, it will not be mandated by Fox. Fox did not mandate a certain edit of this film... everything filmed will be in the final release of the movie, save for I believe one 30 second scene. This film isn't being edited down to meet a certain runtime, nor is it being edited down so that Fox has a lot of bonus deleted scenes for a special edition DVD. The script was written, the story was laid out, and it was filmed. And however much film that was is how much film was needed to tell this tale.

X2 was 2.05 without credits. And what people fail to realize, is that about 15 minutes, or so of that, was only added on because of the whole Phoenix arc. If that wasn't added, the X-Men could have just left Alkali Lake after saving Xavier, headed back to the mansion, and it would have probably run around a 1.45 - 1.50 mark. That movie had a lot going on. X-Men 3 isn't the first movie of the franchise to have a lot going on.

Second of all, X-Men 3 has a luxury that X-Men didn't; the characters are already established. Save for a couple characters here or there, no time needs to be spent on development. We already know who these characters are. Would X-Men have been better if it had all those deleted scenes? In my opinion, absolutley. But that movie also had the task of introducing hardcore fans and casual movie-goers alike into this world, and to these characters. X-Men 3 does not have to do that. Our refresher course is going to be the Danger Room sequence. 2 birds with one stone; getting the audience reaquanted with these characters, on top of giving us an amazing action sequence (and adding a feature we've been wanting all along, the Danger Room).

Simon Kinberg even addressed the run time issue in regards to Fantastic 4, stating that it was ultimatley a kid's movie, therefore runtime was a factor. He stated that X-Men 3 would be cut to make the best movie.

There has been no evidence what-so-ever of studio interferance on this project. Only fanboy *****ing and moaning from people like TheVileOne saying "this is the same studio that brought us Daredevil and Fantastic 4" (2 movies that I happened to enjoy, mind you), but they forget to realize that Fox is also the same studio that brought the likes of Titanic, Cast Away, Road to Perdition, Fight Club, Independence Day, and tons of other great films. And even more relevant than examples on either side of the coin, this is the studio responsible for X-Men and X2. ***** and moan all you want about how the studio tried to "sabotage" the movies... they still shelled out the dough to make this movie, in a time when comic book movies weren't at their peak, to say the least, and followed up with a sequel. Fox set a release date about 2 years in advance for X-Men 3, so that would have been before Singer left for Superman Returns, so all the talk about a release date to beat Singer out is just utter garbage. And for something like this, waiting around isn't an option. There are a lot of actors out there, who have lives outside of 'X-Men', who can't just stop everything else in their lives because X-Men 3 is being made now. And waiting too long will kill the interest in the series. People won't care if there is a 5 year gap between movies. They'll think that it's just a desperate attempt to juice some cash off of a name.

This is nothing but over reaction over something petty. We're not the ones in the know about this story, we only assume to know. We're not the professionals being paid the big bucks to tell this story. Fanboys need to step down off their pedastel, and let the professionals do their job. Enjoy the finished product, or don't. But this over-reaction over the running time, of all things, is absurd. And now we're calling for a possible boycott from Fox if things don't go your way? Sorry, I'm not convinced.

Contrary to the arguement presented by those who have nothing better to do than to ***** and get after anyone who is the least bit optimistic, Fox is capable of making quality entertainment. In fact, I find an abundance of my TV and movie entertainment to come from Fox, in some way, shape, or form. And I will not boycott over a run time. I will not boycott the good things they do, because of something bad they may have done. And I highly doubt that X-Men 3 is going to be some crap fest of a movie because of a runtime.

I stopped reading when you said Independence Day was a great film...that being said most of us do not have a problem with X-men the Last Stand in and of itself but rather how everyone associated with it is saying it has more drama, more emotion, and more action than the first films yet we come to find out it is the shortest of the three...maybe it will be a good film, maybe not, I agree we should wait to judge the film until we see it, but to say it will be better than the other x-films while be being the shortest is absurd.
 
Avalanche said:
While I command your effort in taking the time in writing up your thoughts, I really hate these essay style posts. You could have said what you needed in a tenth of the word count.


Bosef and Nell always have well thought out posts, and that is awesome. But I agree, with you.

Besides not everyone will read them, and then your opinion/idea/theory doesn't reach people.
 
TheVileOne said:
Even if the running time is inaccurate, bosef still makes a lot of excellent points.

Namely Fantastic Four. The movie did very well opening weekend but had literally NO staying power at the box office in subsequent weekends.

Spider-man and Batman Begins were the exact opposite. They had strong BO performance continuing on the weekends and weekdays which F4 did not.

Basically, as I've feared since Singer left, this is going to be the BAD third movies that most third movies usually are in franchises, BAD AND DISAPPOINTING.

Yeah, but FF made 330 million WW, it was still a success, how is that movie considered a flop!!!:confused:

Also, I agree with the first post!!!:up:
 
IMO the thing with FF was that they marketed the hell out of it, they especially marketed it at young children and so all these small kids went to see it with their families because ff is more family friendly that the x men movies just like spiderman. Only thing is, spiderman is appealing to all ages whereas i thought FF was mediocre at best. Kids tended to enjoy it a lot more than adults did from my experience. I dunno about anyone else
 
bosef982 said:
The premiere of X3: The Last Stand is soon to enter its last month of anticipation. We, as a community of X-Men fans, have debated every detail, analyzed every frame, and gobbled every scrap of information tossed at us. It started with AintItCool.com’s scathing review of – what has now been classified – X3 scriptment. Moriarty, the most cool-headed reviewer on AICN, spared no hate in his review, which included character deaths galore, cures galore, rough sex, horrid action sequences, and contrived plotlines (in theory).

For nearly half-a-year, this scriptment permeated every thread, every post, every word on th X-boards. It scared fans, but not so much in of the actors chosen, nor the overall story crafted, nor the director settled. What scared people the most was the studio, the studio and its “ideas”:

20th Century Fox. (Avi Arad lumped with them).

In the past two years, a bad taste lingered in fans mouths after tasting Fox self-proclaimed successes such as Elektra, Fantastic Four, even Daredevil. Elektra, penned by Zak “never-misses-the-opportunity-to-laud-how-he-would’ve-done-X2” Penn, proved bland, saved only by the animated tattoos of a wasted character and those finding the strong feminism of Jennifer Garner attractive. Daredevil showed how direct-to-movie comic adaptations, or how directorial love, do not make a good movie necessarily. Fantastic Four, perhaps the most monumental failure, exposed the inadequacies of bland direction, the pitfalls of horrid editing, and the overall dishonesty in studio marketing.

Despite this, the trailers released, the pictures shown have all washed away the stain of Fox in any aspect of X3 productions. Brett Ratner’s seemingly humble, yet effective and energetic directing seems to not only unlock new and unique shots for the X-franchise, but simply something a bit more resonating compared to previous films – just from the trailers. Of course, there are still concerns, concerns that will never be satisfied until the movie is finally viewed. A major concern whoever has been length: how long will X3 run?

Recently, it was revealed that X3: The Last Stand will have a running time of 1 hour and 43 minutes, a running time that shocks fans. With so many new characters, so many new stories – one of which is the greatest saga ever to be told in comics – how is this possible? For the first time, we are seeing now unconditional proof of typical Fox decisions coming into this film. Like Fantastic Four, Elektra, and Daredevil, fans are being asked to pay $9 to see a relatively short product. Fantastic Four’s cut credits – almost embarrassing to see – is proof alone of how far studios go to make a movie short.

But we digress. I suppose, to a degree, the impact of a movie’s length should be explored. The X-Men franchise allows us to see two extremes of this dilemma. X-Men 1 was a good film, a solid start to the entire franchise. It did in 1 hour and 30 minutes what many thought was impossible: introduced an entire universe of 60 years. However, to say that this is justification for X3’s running time is pure fallacy. X1, while good, would have been significantly better had some of the cut scenes (which would’ve pushed the film towards 2 hours) been included. Indeed, the entire franchise would’ve been improved if the scene of Jean Grey in Cerebro, talking Charles Xavier about her growing powers and his role in their lives.

However, X2 is sometimes accused of being too long and indeed, the interspersed Xavier/Cerebro/Locating Humans or Mutants scenes seemed very odd and tedious when paced with the rather riveting, crisp, and fast action of the climax.

Most fans were hoping for 2 hours, a reasonable running time. And quite frankly, a necessary one. Kinberg and Ratner are ultimately bound by the studio though in this degree, why? Money.

Shorter show times allow one to have more showings in a single day. Logic would tell you this’d make you more money. However, logic also tells you that this is a sure-fire way to blow your load to early by having many of the people who want to see the movie only see it in its opening weekend and the – a la Fantastic Four – the movie’s performance at the Box Office can slump quickly and surely. Basically, shorter show times also make for an exhausted box office.

Shorter show times also save money in DVD content, DVD formatting, shipping, printing, etc. Overall, studios make more money by charging us $9 still, and charging us $29 dollars still, for SHORTER PRODUCT. It makes no sense. Which leads us ultimately, to my main point.

Fans swallowed a poor Daredevil by Fox. We endured a pathetic Elektra. We attempted to salvage for ourselves – buying the DVD for X3 – the Fantastic Four debacle and wreck of a piss-poor editing job that movie was. All the while, Avi Arad and Fox are blindly pandering on about how well they did, how groundbreaking their vision was, how nice. And what did we do…?

WE. FOLLOWED. ALONG! WE! BOUGHT! IT!

I will not tolerate Fox destroying the X-Men franchise. This is a entity, a concept, a franchise, and a fanbase that has serviced and lined Fox’s pockets for much good. The X-Men have MORE than proven themselves deserving a decent budgets, great talent, the best scripts, and the best length times.

Why this is a manifest is this – it is an incitation to action. So far, the only significant thing we can say X3 has going against it is this running time. It runs the risk of producing a short farce of a film – X3: The Last Stand (The Abridged Edition) where its decent, and if we as an audience fill in the blanks, it’ll actually become a good story. Recently, Eidos Interactive released Tomb Raider: Legend. The video game’s been lamblasted for being amazing, yet ridiciulously short. Eido’s response: “We take it as a good thing that people want more!”

I, for one, am sick of this pathetic, naive, insulting capitalistic *****slapping of consumers and fans. As if we’re stupid enough to not realize that our money no longer buys us the quantity and quality of product that it did when studios didn’t just care about the bottom line, or at least realized the best bottom line is when you’re consumer buys AND is satisfied.

So, honestly fans, we as fans of X-Men – not Fox, not of these movies, BUT OF X-MEN. Of these character who in many ways have defined and influenced our lives. We as X-Men fans have an obligation come May 26th.

See X-Men 3. It could be amazing. It could be horrible. Viewing will tell. But, if it is another Fantastic Four, if it could’ve been better, if we realize that there were things cut, information scrapped, story sabotaged just to fit it into a shorter time span for studio $$, we must as fans make a decision to let Fox know what we think. *****ing and whining and screaming isn’t enough. If this is the case, I want to know how many of you are fans enough of X-Men to actually NOT PURCAHSE THE DVD. This is when we can speak. We were shamelessly deceived by Avi and Fox with the Fantastic Four DVD, lulled into buying for X3. Let it not be the case this time. If X3 is not up to par with the franchise expectations, if its so short and so stunted that we are just appalled, we need to not settle for the DVD. We need to abstain. You want to hurt Fox, hurt them in their wallets. Hurt them by taking away their DVD, which is one of the major incomes for any movie production.

Want to tell them that we won’t take anymore Fantastic Fours, Elektras, or Daredevils, and now they’ve gone too far by destroying a beloved franchise, then we – all the thousands of us – should NOT by the DVD. That’ll send a statement. That’ll send a warning to Fox.

We don’t settle. We’re X-Men fans. Those characters deserve the best. We deserve the best.

But of course, if X-Men 3 rules, buy the DVD. Studios should earn our money, they should not get it based on name alone. Do you really like the image of them saying, “Who cares if it’s good? The fans’ll buy it either way…who cares?”

Studios don’t care about us once we open our wallets. Don’t open your wallet this time. You have a decision to make. Me, personally, if X3 is not up to par, I will not purchase the DVD. I will not make that sacrifice. I will not buy it “just to compelte the trilogy” – I’ll consider the trilogy incomplete and boycott Fox from that point forward.

The degradation in movies is appalling. Its ruined the romance, action, and comedy genres. Don’t let it ruin the superhero one too.

STOP saying u bought F4 dvd just because u r a X3 fan. That is all nonsense. You should have read the reviews for F4 dvd before buying it.

Secondly F4 was by no means a monumental failure. It was just a bit dissapointing.

And honestly i feel sad that they r ruining X3.

Now I am willing to bet u all guyz, X3 opening weekend (3-day) will be atleast 10-20 million lower than X2. That is a guarantee because so many fans are ANGRY about X3 running time including me.

But since I am a TRUE fan of MARVEL not just X3 i will watch it in theatres because i can't tolerate DC beating MARVEL.

Show love to MARVEL who made these comic books. Don't be a biased FAN of just one comic book.
 
Excellent post Bosef.

Also it goes without saying but besides the DVD thing, we should refrain from repeat viewings if the movie's quality doesn't warrant it. As somebody who saw X2 9 times in the theaters but only saw F4 opening day I think that would also make a big impact and make them take notice.
Let's hope for the best.
 
Mr Lex Luthor said:
I prefer the longer one.


Me too

don't see a problem with people expressing their ideas fully
 
Nell2ThaIzzay said:
I must say, I find this over-reaction to the running time to be nothing short of appauling.
...

There has been no evidence what-so-ever of studio interferance on this project.

Hello Nell, how've you been? Long time no chat.

I think you were a little harsh on your post because, for one, Bosef's post wasn't an over-reaction. I think it was rather balanced and it left room open for the possibility that X3 might still be good.
Also as for the second thing I quoted, that's not exactly true. There is evidence of studio interference. For proof go check the Q&A with Simon and Zak and look at a question which asks if Cyclops' role in the Phoenix Saga has been replaced with Wolverine. Look at the writer's answer and read between the lines.
 
First, of all we have no evidence taht this movie is going to be bad. With that being said, I wouldn't buy the DVD if I thought that this would work. But unfortunately it wouldn't, since so many people buy DVDs no madder how much the movie sucks and Fox will probably do a good job marketing the thing. I'd rather complete my collection than do a "strike" that woudn't work.
 
Endeavor said:
Hello Nell, how've you been? Long time no chat.

I think you were a little harsh on your post because, for one, Bosef's post wasn't an over-reaction. I think it was rather balanced and it left room open for the possibility that X3 might still be good.
Also as for the second thing I quoted, that's not exactly true. There is evidence of studio interference. For proof go check the Q&A with Simon and Zak and look at a question which asks if Cyclops' role in the Phoenix Saga has been replaced with Wolverine. Look at the writer's answer and read between the lines.

Well, on these boards, I've been a bit frustrated the past couple days, but other than that, I've been good, thanks!

As far as my response to bosef, well, bosef is an example of he and I having a differing opinion, but at least he's got his reasons, and he's not being negative for the sake of being negative, and not blind to other possibilities.

Unfortunatley, I've found myself to be very frustrated with the runtime issue since long before this 103 minute "confirmation", and this thread, even though a very well thought out, and more open minded post than others, was just kind of the nail in the coffin. My response wasn't so much directed towards bosef personally, but rather the whole runtime over-reaction. This just happened to be the place I vented my frustrations.

Anyways, as far as studio interferance, I haven't seen evidence of any. I think that if Wolverine takes Cyclops' place in the Phoenix Saga (which I don't believe he will), I believe that's not so much studio plotics oriented, but rather the fact that Marsden couldn't shoot a substantial role (what with being on Superman Returns and all), and since they couldn't get Cyclops, they used Wolverine, because he's the face of the franchise.

However, I don't believe that is the case, I believe that Cyclops will have a very important role in this film, and it won't be his death triggering Jean's transformation to the Phoenix.
 
Sun_Down said:
I'll sum it up in one sentence : Don't buy the DVD if the movie sucks.

Belive me, it won't, at least storm won't anyway,lol!
 
Nell2ThaIzzay said:
Anyways, as far as studio interferance, I haven't seen evidence of any.

I understand your frustration, I see this place is sort of in chaos.

I found the quote I was talking about in my previous post. Go here http://www.thexverse.com/community/showthread.php?t=7&page=11&highlight=blasphemous It's in the list of answers Zak provided at 12:32 PM on 02/24

I will quote part of his answer : "you have to keep in mind that Simon and I do not control the franchise or the actors or the studio. To a certain extent, we have to do the best we can with the pieces we have"

Also check this page http://www.thexverse.com/community/showthread.php?t=7&page=17&highlight=popularity
See there how he admits Wolverine's popularity has to do with it? The importat thing to notice is how he mentions the outcome isn't exactly what they (the writers) wanted.
 
antariksh said:
STOP saying u bought F4 dvd just because u r a X3 fan. That is all nonsense. You should have read the reviews for F4 dvd before buying it.

Secondly F4 was by no means a monumental failure. It was just a bit dissapointing.

And honestly i feel sad that they r ruining X3.

Now I am willing to bet u all guyz, X3 opening weekend (3-day) will be atleast 10-20 million lower than X2. That is a guarantee because so many fans are ANGRY about X3 running time including me.

But since I am a TRUE fan of MARVEL not just X3 i will watch it in theatres because i can't tolerate DC beating MARVEL.

Show love to MARVEL who made these comic books. Don't be a biased FAN of just one comic book.

I disagree with that!!! There are still a lot of people anticipating this movie, not only X-men fans, but regular moviegoers!!!
 
Hey Endeavor's back... good to see you man!!!

Great thread, 'Cudo's' to Bosef for his eloquent selection of terms. I happen to agree with you on this one Bosef, simply because it's already a practice of mine anyway. I stop supporting anything that makes me feel like crap after I watch it. And I applaud you for being bold enough to attempt to make the distinction between loving a character and subsequently (or blindly) loving a crappy movie about the characters.

To Nell, I understand your fustration but I think you are focusing too much on Bosef's illustrations as to why the movie may suck, and not on his overall point. If the movie does suck, for whatever reason, we need to let FOX know. And the only real way to send a message like that to a business entity is through the green!!!
 
If the movie sucks, the movie sucks. I'll only see it seven or eight times.
 
RagingTempest said:
I disagree with that!!! There are still a lot of people anticipating this movie, not only X-men fans, but regular moviegoers!!!

ok it will do $600 million worldwide. HAPPY!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Wow bosef, well said :up: I'm with you, if I don't like the movie I won't get the DVD.
 
RagingTempest said:
I disagree with that!!! There are still a lot of people anticipating this movie, not only X-men fans, but regular moviegoers!!!

no, it will make lower then X2 because you have to look at it realisticly, there are ALLLOOt of people hating on this movie around the world saying that this is a disaster in the making....of course this will make less then x2(at least on opening weekend). you cant deny it. Not JUST because of the running time, but because of the time span, the director and bad word among the internet. Honestly the traielrs and TV spots arnt all that amazing to general audiences. Storm spinning:down :down :o

get out some more away form these boards here, slot of people will end up not seeing this one. But we will see. Thats my prediction and i expect it to be right, if its wrong then ..grand.:up:
 
I never understood why people but DVDs for movies they don't like or haven't seen. What a waste of money.
 
im still buying the dvd:o you guys are the most negative bunch seriously already jumping to conclusions that this movie will sucks just because we have an uncomfirmed running time. Calm down people.
 
Movie still looks good to me. but if it isn't...
Why would someone buy a DVD of a movie they don't like?
WHY?
 
RagingTempest said:
I disagree with that!!! There are still a lot of people anticipating this movie, not only X-men fans, but regular moviegoers!!!
I agree. Regular movie goers don't care if Ratner is directing it. They know the other 2 movies were good and the footage we've got from X3 looks amazing. So I think a LOT of people are really looking forward to it.
 

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