Stop Complaining Please! Is Anybody Else Sick of It?!

[X-Maniac]

That's where you're wrong loyalist one.

X1 didn't deviate so much from the material that it alienated fans. Sure, some fans hated it and didn't like the darker tone, but the majority of fans enjoyed it because it represented the true message of X-Men and told a great emotional story.

Are you kidding? A sobbing Rogue, a weak Storm, a student Iceman, an Iceman/Rogue love interest, Jean Grey as a doctor/geneticist, a ***** Sabretooth with no link to Wolverine... the movie veered away from the comics in many places. But I still enjoyed it, despite my bitter disappointment over some aspects. I also realised that these changes would follow through into any future movies.

The same applies to X2.

Some great moments, but noticeably limited screentime for Cyclops, Deathstrike's limited role, Storm said to be flying (then we find out it's flying a jet, not flying herself on the winds), a very bitty section when they get to the dam including a strange Mastermind/Proteus composite engaging in a wheelchair face-off with Xavier, Rogue seeming to get tougher then ending up exactly the same at the end of the movie. Despite my disappointments, still enjoyed it.

The fans(including myself) didn't get in a uproar because at the end of X2 we thought they would take it in the right direction, and obviously that didn't happen, due to the politics and greediness that is FOX studios.

I thought X3 basically followed on from X2... I was very glad of Angel, Beast, nice to see Danger Room, great to see Storm finally fly, interesting take on the Phoenix (Bryan himself had said it would be mutants vs evolution, and we did get that, though not in the form of his proposed X3 and X4). Disappointments too, especially with poor Cyclops. But I've been used to that for eight years. If some of you wanted a pure Jean Grey story, i don't know if it would have succeeded. With a three-year gap since the last movie, with Magneto's war and the government's intolerance finally to boil over, there were other tales to be told - and the Phoenix was a subplot in X1 and X2 (in fact, subplot is vastly overstating two-second Jean's stare at the Statue of Liberty)

 

[LastSunrise1981]

Hey leave the man alone he's entitled to his opinion.

Some of us just see things with a more proper sense.








I kid, I kid.

Sure you do.

But seriously, I don't hate the movie. It's decent/average at best, I just don't like how people expect us to shut up and move on after waiting three years for this film.

 

[The Original Bamfer]

Sure you do.

But seriously, I don't hate the movie. It's decent/average at best, I just don't like how people expect us to shut up and move on after waiting three years for this film.

Then why do you treat people like **** who liked it but have never asked you to shut up, like myself?

 

[LastSunrise1981]

Are you kidding? A sobbing Rogue, a weak Storm, a student Iceman, an Iceman/Rogue love interest, Jean Grey as a doctor/geneticist, a ***** Sabretooth with no link to Wolverine... the movie veered away from the comics in many places. But I still enjoyed it, despite my bitter disappointment over some aspects. I also realised that these changes would follow through into any future movies.



Some great moments, but noticeably limited screentime for Cyclops, Deathstrike's limited role, Storm said to be flying (then we find out it's flying a jet, not flying herself on the winds), a very bitty section when they get to the dam including a strange Mastermind/Proteus composite engaging in a wheelchair face-off with Xavier, Rogue seeming to get tougher then ending up exactly the same at the end of the movie. Despite my disappointments, still enjoyed it.



I thought X3 basically followed on from X2... I was very glad of Angel, Beast, nice to see Danger Room, great to see Storm finally fly, interesting take on the Phoenix (Bryan himself had said it would be mutants vs evolution, and we did get that, though not in the form of his proposed X3 and X4). Disappointments too, especially with poor Cyclops. But I've been used to that for eight years. If some of you wanted a pure Jean Grey story, i don't know if it would have succeeded. With a three-year gap since the last movie, with Magneto's war and the government's intolerance finally to boil over, there were other tales to be told - and the Phoenix was a subplot in X1 and X2 (in fact, subplot is vastly overstating two-second Jean's stare at the Statue of Liberty)

1) Rogue being insecure about herself was part of her comic book counterpart. She was always afraid of hurting people and afraid of not being accepted because of her powers, so that was kept intact.

I was never bothered by Storms depiction. I said it once and I'll say it again, I was never a huge Storm fan when reading the X-Men comics or watching the Animated Series. As a kid I was more into Cyclops, Colossus, Angel, Beast, Rogue, Jean, Iceman, Gambit, Nightcrawler, Juggernaut, Magneto, Apocalypse, and Mr. Sinister.

To some extent Storm was weak as comic book Storm and Animated Storm would've never let Toad get that close to her.

Iceman/Rogue wasn't that big of a deal. Gambit would've happened if Fox hadn't screwed Singer over in terms of budget.

Jean being a doctor/scientist is another thing that wasn't a big deal. Again, it was a minor change, and a change that happened because Fox screwed Singer when he wanted a human Dr. Henry McCoy in the first film and Beast in the second film.

A lot of what you mention at first are minor changes. I do agree with you about Sabretooth, however, Singer did manage to throw a little hint of his past with Logan as he took Logan's dog tags. It was a minor hint/nod to the fans but it was there.

As for Rogue ending up the same? She had never flown a jet before, how about you fly a jet without training and see if you can keep your emotions intact?

Beast, Magneto, Cyclops(what little screen time he had), Phoenix(only because of Famke's performance), and Rogue(only because of Paquin) were the only good things about X3.

 

[gambitfire]

Are you kidding? A sobbing Rogue, a weak Storm, a student Iceman, an Iceman/Rogue love interest, Jean Grey as a doctor/geneticist, a ***** Sabretooth with no link to Wolverine... the movie veered away from the comics in many places. But I still enjoyed it, despite my bitter disappointment over some aspects. I also realised that these changes would follow through into any future movies.

at what point was Rogue weak? Rogue was scared like she first was in the comic books to she didn't understand what was wrong with her. Iceman WAS a student. I hated the love interest yes, BELIEVE ME I HATED IT. Jean Grey being a doctor and geneticist affected no one in anyway. We don't know if there ever was a connection between Wolverine and Sabertooth but you'll find out when he get's his fourth movie.

Some great moments, but noticeably limited screentime for Cyclops, Deathstrike's limited role, Storm said to be flying (then we find out it's flying a jet, not flying herself on the winds), a very bitty section when they get to the dam including a strange Mastermind/Proteus composite engaging in a wheelchair face-off with Xavier, Rogue seeming to get tougher then ending up exactly the same at the end of the movie. Despite my disappointments, still enjoyed it.

Cyclops wasn't ment to be that important to the story so it was understandable that he wasn't front and center. Deathstrike was a dissapointment but the movie was told too well for it too bother me. Storm was alot better this time around she came of somewhat strong (although i still hated Halle's potrayal of her). Rogue got tougher she didn't end up any weaker, she was flying a plane yea she panicked a little but it took balls to do it, hell i didn't see Bobby trying to do it.

I thought X3 basically followed on from X2... I was very glad of Angel, Beast, nice to see Danger Room, great to see Storm finally fly, interesting take on the Phoenix (Bryan himself had said it would be mutants vs evolution, and we did get that, though not in the form of his proposed X3 and X4). Disappointments too, especially with poor Cyclops. But I've been used to that for eight years. If some of you wanted a pure Jean Grey story, i don't know if it would have succeeded. With a three-year gap since the last movie, with Magneto's war and the government's intolerance finally to boil over, there were other tales to be told - and the Phoenix was a subplot in X1 and X2 (in fact, subplot is vastly overstating two-second Jean's stare at the Statue of Liberty)

Angel was just there too look pretty and serve as a bridge in a badly ploted story so as to not have any gaps. Danger Room was too short to enjoy and the head of a Sentinel was but a bad tease the thing felt like a Wolverine Glory fest. Storm flew 2 seconds. Bryan was going to do Phenoix before he went into Dark phoenix. The take on it was good but it was ment for 2 movies not one. It was a couple of months in between you could tell by the way the spoke of it.

 

[ntcrawler]

Making jean a doctor/Geneticist (like X-maniac pointed out), is actually a good thing. It does not hurt the character. Rather, it gives her depth, it builds up her willpower and strength (to just survive earning something like that is not easy), and ultimately it could have been used to give her more to do in the story, put her skills to good use and help out the team in others ways than combat.

 

[DarknessOfDeath]

I didn't know that Jean wasn't really a doctor in the comics but even though she wasn't but is in the films, it doesn't bother me either way. Although, I kinda missed her wearing her glasses and white dr. coat in x2. I too wish Hank was in X1, he could have been with the team in battle towards the end... we could have had atleast 3 out of 5 of the orginal 5 x-men...damn it.

 

[danoyse]

Unlike you, I don't let an injustice or bad service just slide and "let it be" because there's nothing I can do about it, especially when I KNOW there's something I can do about it. The more you wonder why people don't like the movie, the more you try to discourage people to just sit back and accept the tripe that's being thrown at them, the more you end up encouraging people like me, and the more I put into my effort. We both have agendas. Admit it. They're just on opposite sides of the spectrum. My agenda is to bring forth something from which everyone would ultimately benefit. Your agenda is to get us to sit idly by. And that isn't going to happen.

A movie you didn't like is not "injustice." Not getting the Dark Phoenix movie you wanted or not seeing your favorite characters played to your expectations ranks fairly low on that scale of everything else wrong in the world.

You're writing something that will make it all better for you...great. I hope it goes well and other disappointed fans enjoy it as well. I really mean that.

But it will never change the fact that X3 exists, that it will continue to exist, and that plenty of people either liked it and will continue to discuss it, or if they didn't like it, have moved on with their lives.

After all, it is only a movie.

 

[gambitfire]

to you it's only a movie to us it's something more.

We arn't all you danoyse.

 

[ntcrawler]

No, it's MORE than just a movie. That's why forums like this exist, that's why we're all here.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

No, it's MORE than just a movie. That's why forums like this exist, that's why we're all here.

Actually, it is "just a movie"...

It just so happens that it's based on characters that we're a little more attatched to than your typical movie, so we take it a little more personal.

And despite the fact that this doesn't take away any disappointment caused by these movies, the characters always exist in the source material, outside of the movies, and the world does move on beyond X-Men: The Last Stand.

That's not saying that disappointment shouldn't be felt, or expressed...

It's just saying that the world won't stop revolving because of the outcome of a movie.

 

[gambitfire]

We know that but because we are so attached to these characters and it's not every day they get to the silver screen then that is enough to make it more than just a movie.

If it where just a movie you wouldn't be on here 3 months later defending it so frequently.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

We know that but because we are so attached to these characters and it's not every day they get to the silver screen then that is enough to make it more than just a movie.

If it where just a movie you wouldn't be on here 3 months later defending it so frequently.

Amen. Very well said Gambitfire.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

We know that but because we are so attached to these characters and it's not every day they get to the silver screen then that is enough to make it more than just a movie.

If it where just a movie you wouldn't be on here 3 months later defending it so frequently.

I had hoped that my smiley face at the end would imply that my post wasn't totally serious.

And I did go on in my post about why we look at these movies as "more than just a movie", so even in saying "it is just a movie", I totally backed up your arguement of why it's not.

So nwah!

 

[gambitfire]

ok.........


*coughsWeirdocoughs*




j/k

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Dee dee dee!

 

[The Original Bamfer]

Oh Carlos!

(You people are never on AIM )

 

[gambitfire]

Carlos is awesome but his material has been recycled too much.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Oh Carlos!

(You people are never on AIM )

You talkin' to me, Willis?

I don't think anyone on here has my AIM name... although it's not too hard to figure out, considering it's the same as my SHH name...

 

[ntcrawler]

Here here, agreed. It is more than just a movie because movies like this are extremely rare. We are starving for footage because there just isn't much for our chars. And there is no extended, written universe, at least not one officially sanctioned by the rights holders to exdent the story of the movieverse. So when after only 3 movies 1/2 the cast is killed off or otherwise eliminated and the story dead-ended, of course people are gonna get upset.

Spoiler

Scott: Charles can't bring her back. None of you can!

Ororo: Neither can you, Scott.

 

[The Original Bamfer]

You talkin' to me, Willis?

I don't think anyone on here has my AIM name... although it's not too hard to figure out, considering it's the same as my SHH name...

Yes, you. I had something to share.

(Your screen name is listed)

 

[gambitfire]

Ok glad this is settled....


HEY LS OR ANY OTHER MODS OUT THERE!!! THREAD CLOSE!!!!

 

[YJ1]

After watching Ghost Rider, I wonder if any X-fans want to still complain about X3? Now THAT is how to make a bad movie. Ghost Rider is something to complain about, X3 simply isn't. Ghost Rider stuck close to its comic roots but still managed to be quite bad. X3 ranged from its strict comic origins and still delivered a fun and exciting movie. See the difference now?

 

[Spade]

After watching Ghost Rider, I wonder if any X-fans want to still complain about X3? Now THAT is how to make a bad movie. Ghost Rider is something to complain about, X3 simply isn't. Ghost Rider stuck close to its comic roots but still managed to be quite bad. X3 ranged from its strict comic origins and still delivered a fun and exciting movie. See the difference now?

I usually find myself agreeing with you alot YJ1, but I have to speak up on this one. When I walked out of X-Men I was blown away. When I walked out of X2, I wasn't as impressed but was still happy with the final product. When I walked out of The Last Stand, I tried to narrow down my list of disappointments. I hadn't even passed by this board and had the innate feeling just from watching it that it was a rushed product. The script just felt like Penn listlessly wrote up a tale for Wolverine and Storm that just happened to involve the X-Men, the SFX were underwhelming (especially with the ending), and the whole film felt like a race to the box office with no real care for the finished product. Getting the DVD to try and see if a rewatch would change my opinion was the worst mistake I made when it came to this film- if anything, the flaws came into light more on my TV screen than in the theater. The action does not make up for the boring and senseless additions in the film.

I felt no such thing with Ghost Rider. Granted, it's not a perfect product. The Hidden bog down the picture, Blackheart could have been much more involved, the lines bordered between 'okay' and 'terrible' and Cage/ Mendez' acting wasn't the best. But at the end I was happy to have seen it, with no feeling afterwards that I had wasted my cash. It's better than Daredevil, and makes a modest effort to bring a very twisted and fractured history in the comics to the big screen. For me, it all comes down to this- Blackheart not having a true form, just 'Legion', was disappointing. Twentieth Century Fox not having the sense to show the Phoenix as she should be and making The Last Stand 1 hour and 30 minutes of 'a good attempt' was downright infuriating.

I don't usually involve myself in threads like this but this is something I just needed to vent on. I'll come out and say that I'm biased in that I thought Ghost Rider was a good film, but if you're going to compare it to The Last Stand please feel free to explain where The Last Stand has the upper hand.

 

[gambitfire]

After watching Ghost Rider, I wonder if any X-fans want to still complain about X3? Now THAT is how to make a bad movie. Ghost Rider is something to complain about, X3 simply isn't. Ghost Rider stuck close to its comic roots but still managed to be quite bad. X3 ranged from its strict comic origins and still delivered a fun and exciting movie. See the difference now?

First of all i can see you don't understand what being a fan of a DIFFERENT Comic Book title is all about.

Second of all have you heard of difference in opinions?

Third of all What makes you so sure you're right about the matter?

Fourth of all why revive a dead thread to start another flame war?

Fifth of all there have been many justified reasons for disliking the film stated before, if you don't like people complaining then just ignore them.

People disliked the movie and they complain, that's what the boards are here for. What's the big deal. Why does it bother you? Can't people have a different opinion? Not everyone is going to feel the way you feel.

Seriously man, just let it be. This isn't YOUR perfect world people will see things differently. As long as we have freedom of speech we will express that difference. If you want control start your own monarchy for all i care.

I havn't seen it but i'll be my own judge. From what i heard Ghost Rider wasn't as true to the source as some people make it out to be.



Edit- However if you want to debate or this discuss the matter, i'll be happy to do so if you state some GOOD POINTS.