The Amazing Spider-Man: The Game - Part 2

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UltimateWebhead said:
Bottomline, guys, is that Spidey is best suited for a free roam environment. And of course every free roam game is going to have linear styled missions, just like TASM will be featuring indoor stuff too. But you still have the free roam aspect when you're not on a particular mission. I don't care how good a strictly linear game can be, it doesn't fit Spidey as well as an equally good free roam game.

That being said, I think it was a smart move for Beenox to create the linear games that they did. Despite whatever criticism they may have taken for having a linear game and the 'crappiness' that gets associated with them by free roam purists, it was a necessary move IMO. I also understand that people were hating on EoT because of it's lack in quality and although I don't agree with that, I understand where it comes from.

Anyways, ever since the introduction of SM2, you had the notion that every Spidey game MUST be free roam. And while I agree that I prefer the free roam style of game, by the time WoS had been released it was apparent that the free roam games had begun to nosedive and lose their creativity. They became stale. By returning to a linear format, Beenox could channel their creativity in a new direction and for the most part it worked. Now, several years later, it's time to return to free roam. The ideas will be fresh and it feels 'new' again that we'll be free roaming around Manhattan once more.
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After SM2's release and then the years following, the developers in a sense took the novelty out of the free roam experience. It's good to see now that Beenox is trying to strip everything down and start over from scratch. The linear Spider-Man games were serviceable and was a break away from what gamers were use to, but even then, they were missing something. Rockstar IMO is pretty smart about their game development, they're not gonna feed you a GTA every year, they take anywhere from 2-4 years making a sequel to one of their franchises and the work shows when you play the finished product.

Activision is more of a quantity over quality type developer, instead of completely polishing a game and making sure the product delivers on all points, they'll take what worked at one point and keep throwing it out there, Call of Duty is guilty of this.
 
Alchemyst said:
After SM2's release and then the years following, the developers in a sense took the novelty out of the free roam experience. It's good to see now that Beenox is trying to strip everything down and start over from scratch. The linear Spider-Man games were serviceable and was a break away from what gamers were use to, but even then, they were missing something. Rockstar IMO is pretty smart about their game development, they're not gonna feed you a GTA every year, they take anywhere from 2-4 years making a sequel to one of their franchises and the work shows when you play the finished product.

Activision is more of a quantity over quality type developer, instead of completely polishing a game and making sure the product delivers on all points, they'll take what worked at one point and keep throwing it out there, Call of Duty is guilty of this.
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GTA, yes, thank you
Was wondering what other gaming franchise has a different protagonist for each game
 
ProjectPat2280 said:
Thats not a problem with free roam tho, its a problem with s**t developers. I mean after the free roam games, we got one decent linear game and one terrible linear game. Theres a reason EoT sits at a 57 Meta score. Thats more than 10 points lower than WoS. Also, other developers(Rockstar, Sucker Punch, Rocksteady, Ubisoft etc) dont seem to have a problem with the open world environments.
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Sh_t developer or sh_t publisher?? Maybe it's both but with Activision demanding a nearly every year release it's difficult to produce a quality product. Beenox has been working on this game long enough though they should be able to do something good. With those other developers though, as far as I'm aware, they weren't being held to the same bogged down working environment that Activision seems to have over their developers. I still believe in the point that I made though...the free roam Spidey games were getting stale in their ideas. The creativity was dropping and it showed. Also, for example, like with the GTA games, they are not using the same character over and over again. They have more room to create something totally different because they can introduce entirely new stories and characters. I mean, pretty much everyone knows about GG's story in Spider-man. Then again, Beenox is introducing new villains here in TASM, i.e Iguana...there's hope.
 
Alchemyst said:
After SM2's release and then the years following, the developers in a sense took the novelty out of the free roam experience. It's good to see now that Beenox is trying to strip everything down and start over from scratch. The linear Spider-Man games were serviceable and was a break away from what gamers were use to, but even then, they were missing something. Rockstar IMO is pretty smart about their game development, they're not gonna feed you a GTA every year, they take anywhere from 2-4 years making a sequel to one of their franchises and the work shows when you play the finished product.

Activision is more of a quantity over quality type developer, instead of completely polishing a game and making sure the product delivers on all points, they'll take what worked at one point and keep throwing it out there, Call of Duty is guilty of this.
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I agree that Activision deserves blame in this scenario. Like I said before it's difficult to make a top quality product when you're forced to turn out something once a year. That being said I think Beenox is taking the correct approach with TASM and making everything from scratch. They've had 2 years to work on this game and there's a chance they can do something of very good quality.
 
UltimateWebhead said:
Sh_t developer or sh_t publisher?? Maybe it's both but with Activision demanding a nearly every year release it's difficult to produce a quality product. Beenox has been working on this game long enough though they should be able to do something good. With those other developers though, as far as I'm aware, they weren't being held to the same bogged down working environment that Activision seems to have over their developers. I still believe in the point that I made though...the free roam Spidey games were getting stale in their ideas. The creativity was dropping and it showed. Also, for example, like with the GTA games, they are not using the same character over and over again. They have more room to create something totally different because they can introduce entirely new stories and characters. I mean, pretty much everyone knows about GG's story in Spider-man. Then again, Beenox is introducing new villains here in TASM, i.e Iguana...there's hope.
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Activision just needs to get there head out of their ass and give their games the proper amount of time to be developed. I would much rather wait a couple of years for a Spidey game that has the potential to be great as opposed to getting mediocre ones every year.
 
Alchemyst said:
Activision just needs to get there head out of their ass and give their games the proper amount of time to be developed. I would much rather wait a couple of years for a Spidey game that has the potential to be great as opposed to getting mediocre ones every year.
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Totally agree my man. We just got EoT this past October so in this case with TASM it very much feels like, "WTF? We just got a Spidey game less than a year ago!" However, they've been quietly working on this game in the background for a while until they announced it in mid-October. I love what I've seen so far and come late June, hopefully we'll all be satisfied.
 
UltimateWebhead said:
Totally agree my man. We just got EoT this past October so in this case with TASM it very much feels like, "WTF? We just got a Spidey game less than a year ago!" However, they've been quietly working on this game in the background for a while until they announced it in mid-October. I love what I've seen so far and come late June, hopefully we'll all be satisfied.
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I hope so, I can appreciate Activision for trying to keep Spidey in consoles, but
like I said earlier, it should be "Quality over Quantity".
 
The swinging and acrobatics better be on point, see I'm weird like that, so from time to time I like to re-enact this, or at least try to

[YT]aWpawu0HC_4[/YT]
 
Alchemyst said:
The swinging and acrobatics better be on point, see I'm weird like that, so from time to time I like to re-enact this, or at least try to

[YT]aWpawu0HC_4[/YT]
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Well with the web rush feature it seems that we'll truly be able to take advantage of Spidey's agility and be precise about it. In the Playgroound trailer, at the end he web rushes onto the pole on the Empire State Bldg just like he does in that final swing in SM1.
 
Alchemyst said:
The swinging and acrobatics better be on point, see I'm weird like that, so from time to time I like to re-enact this, or at least try to

[YT]aWpawu0HC_4[/YT]
Click to expand...

Thats such a cool sequence. Im in agreement man, i hope everything looks as smooth as that.
 
 
I think part of the problem with the open world Spider-Man games isn't just that free-roaming gets stale, it's that they're always in Manhattan, which really lends itself to getting repetitive from game to game. That's a tough issue, because Spider-Man is so associated with New York City, so how do you set an open world game anywhere else? Where else has enough skyscrapers in a big enough environment to do justice to a good web swinging system? At least other open world games can use different environments from game to game to help keep things fresh.

Batman faces the same problem since Gotham City is his trademark, but so far Rocksteady has done a great job of starting small and building out. Setting the first game on Arkham Island, then expanding the second one to a walled-off section of the city really gave them the ability to manage the scope of those games but still let them have a hub world. Of course, Batman does better in a small environment than Spider-Man.

After all that, I'm still glad that Beenox made Shattered Dimensions a linear game. Hopefully they were able to learn valuable lessons from it and Edge of Time that they have applied to make Amazing a polished product. I just hope the movement is fast and fluid, because Shattered Dimensions never captured that, and even Web of Shadows was too clunky for my tastes. I still can't believe that there still has not been a Spider-Man game since Spider-Man 2 where gravity continues to accelerate Spidey the longer he falls. USM, SM3, and Web of Shadows all had you falling at pretty much a constant rate, which was ridiculously boring.
 
20glyphs said:
I think part of the problem with the open world Spider-Man games isn't just that free-roaming gets stale, it's that they're always in Manhattan, which really lends itself to getting repetitive from game to game.
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Have you ever been to NYC? I used to live there. It is anything but boring and repetitive. Even within the confines of a sandbox video game I believe that the 'staleness' refers not to the city itself but rather the amount you can do within the city. WoS was horrible at this. The side missions were tiring and overly repetitive. Even after you completed the story mode you couldn't just swing around the city, you had to restart the story mode again. Besides, each version of NYC from one Spidey game to the next has been a little different and this next one appears to have some great detail.


20glyphs said:
After all that, I'm still glad that Beenox made Shattered Dimensions a linear game. Hopefully they were able to learn valuable lessons from it and Edge of Time that they have applied to make Amazing a polished product. I just hope the movement is fast and fluid, because Shattered Dimensions never captured that, and even Web of Shadows was too clunky for my tastes. I still can't believe that there still has not been a Spider-Man game since Spider-Man 2 where gravity continues to accelerate Spidey the longer he falls. USM, SM3, and Web of Shadows all had you falling at pretty much a constant rate, which was ridiculously boring.
Click to expand...


Well, that's what it is all about really. It's about making a progression or an evolution in design if you will. By starting small, creating a couple of linear games, it allows Beenox to learn about Spidey as a character and what mechanics work well for him. Now that they've got that experience under their belt, they can branch out and create a new, fresh free roam game and use what they've learned to their advantage. IMO, had they begun with a free roam game, it probably would have failed.

The closer camera and over-the-shoulder view along with blurring effects in the environment should make for some dizzying effects. In the xbox article it was stated that even the sound effects provided some great enhancements to the swinging and free falling experiences. It looks great so far and again doesn't really seem to be boring.
 
The "staleness" came from the developers recreating NYC from an architecture standpoint and not putting a lot of effort into the actual life the city has. In Spider-Man games, NYC is not just a city, it's a character itself. The way this new film portrays it, Spider-Man is met with some hostility due to his actions and the fact that no one knows who is behind the mask, that dynamic needs to be translated into the game. Some pedestrians may cheer him on as he fights crime, others may run in fear due to the fact this is a vigilante at large. Alot of what we've been seeing is pedestrians going about normal activities as you battle thugs on the streets, indicating the NPC's really don't give a damn what you're doing.

Now getting on to the linear gameplay of the previous titles, IMO i think those games (mainly Shattered Dimensions) was a test run to see what Beenox was capable of. The game for the most part was successful, and then when TASM film went into production, Beenox had already started laying the ground work for the tie in game, that in itself possibly downplayed the development team that was working on Edge of Time, and that's why that game did not do as well. Seems like right now, Beenox is on the right track, alot of the gaming websites that we frequent have positive things to say about the game, so this could very well be Spider-Man 2 all over again.
 
Alchemyst said:
The "staleness" came from the developers recreating NYC from an architecture standpoint and not putting a lot of effort into the actual life the city has. In Spider-Man games, NYC is not just a city, it's a character itself. The way this new film portrays it, Spider-Man is met with some hostility due to his actions and the fact that no one knows who is behind the mask, that dynamic needs to be translated into the game. Some pedestrians may cheer him on as he fights crime, others may run in fear due to the fact this is a vigilante at large. Alot of what we've been seeing is pedestrians going about normal activities as you battle thugs on the streets, indicating the NPC's really don't give a damn what you're doing.
Click to expand...

Some things that are being included in TASM that may help with the notion of the city coming to life:

* A live twitter style feed in which NYers post their thoughts about you and I'm guessing the goings on in the city
* The weather actually changes in the game based on the overall mood of the city
* As you are swinging around the city you will hear citizens make comments, i.e "that's so cool!" (xbox article)



Alchemyst said:
Now getting on to the linear gameplay of the previous titles, IMO i think those games (mainly Shattered Dimensions) was a test run to see what Beenox was capable of. The game for the most part was successful, and then when TASM film went into production, Beenox had already started laying the ground work for the tie in game, that in itself possibly downplayed the development team that was working on Edge of Time, and that's why that game did not do as well. Seems like right now, Beenox is on the right track, alot of the gaming websites that we frequent have positive things to say about the game, so this could very well be Spider-Man 2 all over again.
Click to expand...

I agree with this.
 
I think a good way to break up possible monotony in a free roam game is by giving the player either a LOT to do in said environment or having really good, well designed interior levels. I mean if you have to scale the city back to create good indoor levels, so be it.

Also, if your game plays well, that can keep some coming back. Iv seen all there is to see in a game like Red Dead Redemption and GTA IV, but i keep coming back because they are well made titles. They're still fun to play.
 
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ProjectPat2280 said:
I think a good way to break up possibly monotony in a free roam game is by giving the player either a LOT to do in said environment or having really good, well designed interior levels. I mean if you have to scale the city back to create good indoor levels, so be it.

Also, if your game plays well, that can keep some coming back. Iv seen all there is to see in a game like Red Dead Redemption and GTA IV, but i keep coming back because they are well made titles. They're still fun to play.
Click to expand...

I agree. We still have a lot to learn about TASM. We do know that there will be side missions along with indoor levels but we don't know how many of each there will be. I hope there is a bunch of side missions. I'd be ok with the amount that was in AC but more would be better. I'm also wondering how many different types of random crimes you'll come across while swinging around. So far, the only one mentioned is a QTE featuring some thugs trying to escape a bank robbery in a get-away car.

But, yeah, the overall gameplay, if it's done very well, can keep bringing you back to the game. RDR is one of my favorite games and I play it often just because of the quality.
 
Beenox just needs to bust their asses to deliver on this game, Arkham City managed to craft a free roam Batman game of sorts all while not taking away from the indoor levels, it all meshed together well. We need that same amount of attention given to Spider-Man. Rockstar has already proved itself, therefore, when they announce a new game, we don't have to worry whether or not it will be something worth playing. I didn't mention this earlier, but back in 2008 when Web of Shadows released, IMO, I feel like Shaba games were trying too hard to go out of their way, the game was free roam, but it suffered from a weak story, some rather insane and downright ridiculous combat for Spidey, and laundry list of other problems, shortly after WoS released, Activision gave Shaba games the boot. Beenox has just a little bit of leg room to work with seeing that they've got one Spidey title under there belt that was accepted pretty well, TASM could very well be the title that grants them a permanent spot.
 
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