The Avengers The Avengers: News and Speculation - Part 27A sub-se - - - Part 12

[Herolee10]

In regards to the one shot "The Consultant"; I wonder if Coulson would actually get heat from Fury given the fact that Coulson is the one that told Stark to go and see Ross regarding Blonsky. I mean, it shouldn't be any secret to anyone in SHIELD on what kind of guy Tony Stark is, so the deliberate choice on sending Stark to Ross should cause Fury to raise a eyebrow at coulson's choice.

 

[Mr.T]

OK, am I the only one who came away thinking Blonsky/Abomination was killed a the end of TIH?? At the end of TIH, Hulk steps on his chest, crushes him, then screams at the sky. I'm guessing he just seriously injured him and didn't kill him?

 

[WildcatNC]

OK, am I the only one who came away thinking Blonsky/Abomination was killed a the end of TIH?? At the end of TIH, Hulk steps on his chest, crushes him, then screams at the sky. I'm guessing he just seriously injured him and didn't kill him?

I never got the impression that he was dead, not even a little.

 

[Mr.T]

I never got the impression that he was dead, not even a little.

Even after seeing the Hulk violently move his body to cave his chest in? Not even the sound of Blonsky's cracking chest plate?

 

[Herolee10]

I never got the impression that he was dead, not even a little.

Agreed; heck I think if you look and listen closely, you can hear the Abomination still breathing, albeit roughly.

I think the whole point of Betty yelling for the Hulk to stop was so that the Hulk wouldn't slaughter Blonsky like the animal that her dad has made him out to be.

 

[BobbyCorwin88]

You're obviously not.
*waits for obligatory response explaining how you actually are a Hulk fan*

I'll admit he's not my favorite, but I definitely don't hate him. I don't see how anything in my post suggested I don't like him, but ok.

But since you asked:
* The Hulk is a character. When he is treated as such, you have room for growth and great characterization. Even the oftentimes wrongly stereotyped "Savage Hulk" had deep characterization under the tutelage of the likes of Len Wein, Roger Stern, and Bill Mantlo.

* The Hype (and other places) have tons of people clamoring for the Hulk in Avengers to speak and have more characterization than in his previous live-action appearances. Having him be a plot device would be diametrically opposed to those wishes.

* If the Hulk is simply a plot device, then, really, he could be substituted with any other plot device/generic character. There would be no need for the Hulk, specifically.

* One reason why many cite the two Hulk films as not performing higher in the box office/being more popular and/or endearing with general audiences is because they couldn't identify with the Hulk, himself. Taking away any characterization and making him a simple plot device would only further alienate those audience members.

Great! Thank you! This is us having a conversation!

I see your point as it relates to specific Hulk films, but I don't see him developing like crazy throughout the Avengers. In fact, proper character development is the one thing I'm worried about when it comes to the Avengers. We've got a large cast and I don't know if everyone can get their 2 cents on screen. It's gonna be a huge challenge.

I completely admit to not being well-versed on the Hulk-verse. I don't know every facet of his character. I do believe he's more than a giant vessel of rage that does nothing but mindlessly destroy, but I DO know he doesn't start out that way. And as far as the current line of movies is concerned, he hasn't yet found his balance between Hulk and Banner. We got a hint of it at the end of TIH, but who's to say that Banner was trying to gain control or just trying to understand how to trigger the events? I'm thinking it's the latter and that's why SHIELD wants him. They know he can be an asset, but only if he can gain control first. I just don't see that happening in this film, but certainly in the future films.

I'm not trying to belittle the Hulk by calling him a plot device. It's what I'm most used to seeing him as and it's what I see as the most sensible thing for the first Avengers.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

I don't share the belief people seem to have about there being TOO many characters. One of the best way to develop a character is to force them to be part of a group where they are an outsider. Forcing many, radically different people together is the best way to create character shifts and changes.


Also, regarding the Consultant, I wouldn't be surprised if Fury himself is somehow manipulating Coulson into sending Stark, since, this might be me thinking too much of 616 or Ultimate Fury, but there isn't much he isn't aware of, so the idea that Coulson is just sitting in a Diner discussing it strikes me as odd. Even sending Stark there, as if Fury wouldn't be aware of Starks movements at all times.

 

[Herolee10]

I see your point as it relates to specific Hulk films, but I don't see him developing like crazy throughout the Avengers. In fact, proper character development is the one thing I'm worried about when it comes to the Avengers. We've got a large cast and I don't know if everyone can get their 2 cents on screen. It's gonna be a huge challenge.

I completely admit to not being well-versed on the Hulk-verse. I don't know every facet of his character. I do believe he's more than a giant vessel of rage that does nothing but mindlessly destroy, but I DO know he doesn't start out that way. And as far as the current line of movies is concerned, he hasn't yet found his balance between Hulk and Banner. We got a hint of it at the end of TIH, but who's to say that Banner was trying to gain control or just trying to understand how to trigger the events? I'm thinking it's the latter and that's why SHIELD wants him. They know he can be an asset, but only if he can gain control first. I just don't see that happening in this film, but certainly in the future films.

I'm not trying to belittle the Hulk by calling him a plot device. It's what I'm most used to seeing him as and it's what I see as the most sensible thing for the first Avengers.

I'd say that if anyone has something to prove in this film, it'll be the Hulk, and not just to his teammates, but to the GA as well.

It's no secret that the Hulk doesn't exactly look like what most would typically consider a "hero" to look like, and it doesn't help that in the MCU, he doesn't have the best reputation by people.

The Avengers could be the Hulk's chance to prove to both the people in the film and out of it that he's not just some green monster looking individual who crushes things, but that he has a personality of his own, along with showing on how the Hulk eventually earns the title of being a "hero" and considered as one as well.

I'd say that going from being a misunderstood Loner to a recognized team player by the end of the film is a great arc for any character to have.

 

[Gamma Goliath]

Agreed; heck I think if you look and listen closely, you can hear the Abomination still breathing, albeit roughly.

I think the whole point of Betty yelling for the Hulk to stop was so that the Hulk wouldn't slaughter Blonsky like the animal that her dad has made him out to be.

Agreed. Blonsky wasn't just breathing but moving as well.

 

[Herolee10]

Also, regarding the Consultant, I wouldn't be surprised if Fury himself is somehow manipulating Coulson into sending Stark, since, this might be me thinking too much of 616 or Ultimate Fury, but there isn't much he isn't aware of, so the idea that Coulson is just sitting in a Diner discussing it strikes me as odd. Even sending Stark there, as if Fury wouldn't be aware of Starks movements at all times.

That would be the twist, course that would raise the question as to why would Fury deliberately sabotage a meeting that deals with releasing Blonsky into his custody?

 

[BobbyCorwin88]

I'd say that if anyone has something to prove in this film, it'll be the Hulk, and not just to his teammates, but to the GA as well.

It's no secret that the Hulk doesn't exactly look like what most would typically consider a "hero" to look like, and it doesn't help that in the MCU, he doesn't have the best reputation by people.

The Avengers could be the Hulk's chance to prove to both the people in the film and out of it that he's not just some green monster looking individual who crushes things, but that he has a personality of his own, along with showing on how the Hulk eventually earns the title of being a "hero" and considered as one as well.

I'd say that going from being a misunderstood Loner to a recognized team player by the end of the film is a great arc for any character to have.

I think that's well said. I'm really hoping we get to see the Avengers fight Hulk (because it would be amazing) and then the Hulk fighting with them by the end. That's actually the most realistic thing I can see happening.

To be completely honest, I enjoyed TIH more than Cap and Thor. The plot was structured well, the action was great and the film looked great to boot. They got a French director for that movie and those guys love to fill the frame with really nice looking scenery. The stuff they got in Brazil was just great. (It was Brazil right?) I was extremely pleased with that movie. It left me wanting more of Hulk. Cap and Thor, though good, felt more like 2 hour intros into who they are and a little about what they do. TIH did a better job in my opinion.

 

[Mr.T]

double post.

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

I agree. TIH is a much better movie than Cap and Thor (and of course IM2). Hell, if they'd kept the original suicide opening along with the 30 minutes that got cut, its actually better than Iron Man. Norton brought a riveting pathos to the character that made Banner's journey fascinating from start to finish. TIH is the one Marvel Studios movie I couldn't wait to see a sequel to. I wish we could continue to get that level of depth and exploration for all the other characters. I was really expecting it from Cap, but again they strived for a light/popcorn tone at the expense of deeper characterization. I've dragged the wife to see all of the MCU movies and she still likes TIH best. Thing is, you really feel for Banner. You want the guy to be human again. I'm really hoping The Avengers will take us back to Iron Man/TIH territory as far as quality goes.

 

[BigThor]

I really hope we get to see Abomination in action at some point in this film, all this "Blonksy" talk is really getting me interested in him being in this movie.

 

[flickchick85]

I don't really care about Blonsky, so I wouldn't particularly like to see valuable screen-time in this already crowed film wasted (imo) on him. The only TIH character other than Banner that I'd like to see carried over is Thunderbolt Ross.

 

[Herolee10]

I really hope we get to see Abomination in action at some point in this film, all this "Blonksy" talk is really getting me interested in him being in this movie.

I don't think at all that Blonsky will be in this film. Granted, the film's supposed budget is considerably large, but I don't think anyone in Marvel Studios would be interested in spending money on having him appear in the film.lol

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

General Ross should be in the movie. Same goes for Jane.

 

[Herolee10]

On a side note, I just got a good laugh from hearing one of my friends relatives telling me that he thinks the Avengers is going to be a letdown based on what he saw in the teaser at the end of CA.lol

Which got me to thinking, it wasn't the first time that I actually heard that statement before. Needless to say, it's premature to say on how the quality of the film will be based on the teaser. I mean it's like judging on what Thor was going to be like if you were to only have seen HALF of the Comic Con Trailer (since Thor had finished its principal photography by then and had the time to do some graphics), whereas the Avengers is still filming at the time of the trailer's release.lol

 

[LostSon88]

So based on a couple of quick 2 second shots of the heroes standing around, the guy deciphered the movie will be a let down?

Attitudes like that annoy the hell out me.

 

[wobbly]

Even after seeing the Hulk violently move his body to cave his chest in? Not even the sound of Blonsky's cracking chest plate?

You could see he was clearly still breathing when the Hulk kicked him over to Ross's feet, so no

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

The main reason I'm positive about this film, is that we Joss Whedon behind the camera. I was always iffy about Johnston (and as predicted got a by-the-numbers movie), but with Whedon I really don't have many doubts. SERENITY was a solid, quality film that did a wonderful job at distributing screen-time for all the characters as well as actually aspiring to be more than just a generic popcorn sci-fi flick. I'm hoping for the same ambitious and intelligent approach with The Avengers. Hopefully Feige and co. won't compromise that. This really needs to be the best of the bunch.

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

The main reason I'm positive about this film, is that we have Joss Whedon behind the camera. I was always iffy about Johnston (and as predicted got a by-the-numbers movie), but with Whedon I really don't have many doubts. SERENITY was a solid, quality film that did a wonderful job at distributing screen-time for all the characters as well as actually aspiring to be more than just a generic popcorn sci-fi flick. I'm hoping for the same ambitious and intelligent approach with The Avengers. Hopefully Feige and co. won't compromise that. This really needs to be the best of the bunch.

 

[Herolee10]

Well there's no doubt that a lot of pressure is being placed on this film to not only succeed, but meet a lot of expectations. With 5 films having been released to lead into this film, along with it being the first of its kind and having the investment of both fans and audiences alike; yeah, that's a lot to ride on.

With a reported 260 million being invested in the production alone, and a ensemble of characters such as Iron Man, Thor, Hulk and Captain America being in the same film, there's sure to be a lot of memorable moments.

 

[Dark Raven]

With all this talk of Blonsky, I hope that Tim Roth comes back to make at least a cameo appearance in the Avengers.

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

If it were up to me, we'd get cameos from Tim Roth and Liv Tyler, and have Natalie Portman and William Hurt in minimal supporting roles. Maybe have a scene with Roth in chains inside the containment unit Tony built for him (hopefully Blonsky CAN revert back to human form), bookend scenes with Jane (if she is indeed responsible for bringing Thor back) before and after the battle, and an overall presence by General Ross throughout the film. Without the aforementioned players, Thor and Banner pretty much end up staring at the wall. I like the idea of Bruce being allowed to see Betty again now that he's working for the government and its imperative that Thor and Jane reunite when the fight is done.