Arrow The Barry Allen/The Flash Thread - Part 1

[Kevin Smith]

How hard it is to understand that you are just in the minority, most people liked the show, period! It's like when you claim that The Flash is the best superhero show ever, when is rated even lower (7,1/10) than the GL series at IMDb.

That's funny, most GL comic fans I know didn't care for the show, and most kids thought it was kind of boring. Kids I know watched episodes of Justice League and JLU on Boomerang over your CGI GL show.

You idealize the past too much, the Timmverse was very good, but far from perfect,

It's the closest to perfect anyone has come, and a hell of a lot closer to it than GL: TAS and Beware The Batman.

too many filler episodes,

Some of the self contained "filler" episodes are the best ones (The Late Mr Kent, Myxyxpyxlated, Almost Got 'Em)....that is okay for them to do you know. Doesn't always have to be Breaking Bad.

too simplistic character designs...

This coming from the guy defending GL: TAS, and I liked the animation designs. I thought most of them were great. The Bruce Timm style of cartooning got me into drawing as a kid.

the best series are more serialized, complex and have better animation, like Avatar:The Last Airbender (9,0/10 at IMDb). Now you're going to say that sucked too!

No, I didn't watch Avatar, didn't have any interest in it...therefore I don't have much of an opinion on it other than there is nothing that has caught my eye about it to interest me enough to form an opinion...on it. I'm also not a fan of animes which you probably prefer. (Next you'll be telling me anime > comic books )

 

[blknrdcllctv]

I was thinking, if they're going to keep things more grounded, then they may take a thing or two from the Kid Flash suit. What!? The traditional cowl doesn't cover his face well enough (unlike Batman's), I know, I know, the psycho-rigid purists are going to whine till the end of time, but the same way Green Arrow's traditional hat and little mask were not believable to conceal his identity (the hood took care of that), Kid Flash's goggles would conceal Barry's identity better, plus it could integrate a communications device, which could be very practical (and justify the wings too). Now let the haters hate!!

Hell yes Kid Flash!

 

[Kevin Smith]

As much as I love JL8, I'd prefer that it stay in its original medium. I think it would lose something moving into animation (just imagine if Calvin and Hobbes was animated).

Though I could see amazing things happen with a scene like this:

I could see that with what you're saying there. I feel that way about a lot of "adapted" stories...they tend to miss little nuances that make the story sometimes, IMO.

However it's still not a bad idea, or a concept similar to it at least. My big thing would be the voices....there's a lot of potential to make them sound really bratty sounding....we all read them differently in our heads I'm sure.

 

[Kevin Smith]

I don't feel like looking for another one and talking about that because it take this thread further off topic.

Was anyone a tad dissapointed Barry didn't have a Bowtie? It's not HUGE but would have been a fun nod.

Would have even looked good with the outfit he wore on the show too actually haha!

I didn't miss it but it would've been cool I guess.

 

[Kevin Smith]

I was thinking, if they're going to keep things more grounded, then they may take a thing or two from the Kid Flash suit. What!? The traditional cowl doesn't cover his face well enough (unlike Batman's),

Yeaaah, because The Flash not having a nose piece on his costume really exposes his identity a lot more than Batman's...



Barry's design covers his identity fine, it's even stated that he purposely designed the cowl the way it is in one story to conceal his identity more instead of doing something like his comic book hero, Jay Garrick.

I know, I know, the psycho-rigid purists are going to whine till the end of time, but the same way Green Arrow's traditional hat and little mask were not believable to conceal his identity (the hood took care of that),

Yeah, because they totally tried the hat and mask route and audiences just didn't buy it, that's why they went for the super edgy "Nolan-y" dark hooded look instead. The hat and mask were never given a chance to be believable, I don't remember there ever being something to compare it to as far as live action goes. And certainly a hat and a mask, in addition to the hood would conceal his identity even better than say....green paint and a hood. (If they really wanted to throw people off they'd have GA sport a goatee in addition to the hat and mask while Ollie goes clean shaven...missed opportunity )

Kid Flash's goggles would conceal Barry's identity better, plus it could integrate a communications device, which could be very practical (and justify the wings too). Now let the haters hate!!

Umm...The Flash has a radio/communication/police scanner device thing built into his ear pieces. It's their primary purpose. So goggles that "communicate" would be kind of pointless then.

I honestly have never got the attraction to the whole goggles thing. In what way does that make ANYTHING more "realistic"? It's a bad fashion statement that clashes with not just the costume design for many of these characters but also the "idealogy" behind many of them as well. I feel like a lot of the people who champion things like the goggles or whatever only get all excited about them because of the sensation of them being something "new", regardless of ho little sense they actually make or how irrational they are (like the whole Superman needed to kill so he could develop an aversion to killing thing, there are people who defend that even though that makes zero sense whatsoever).

What's the mad attraction people have for goggles? They look awful and they break the carnal rule of live-action CB costumes: You can't see the actor's eyes.Hence why Hawkeye didn't wear 'em in the movie and Spidey,always gets his mask torn off.

Yeah, I agree. I don't get the love for slapping goggles on everything, and especially don't get the goggles = "realistic" thing, especially with The Flash. Gimme a break. Maybe give Aquaman a pair of goggles, would suit him better. Unless you're Spidey, DareDevil, or Cyclops, we should be able to see your eyes. Besides, it just doesn't look good on most the suits people suggest adding them to.

The wings/bolts on the side of the mask have pretty much always functioned as two way communicators. Goggles look goofy and the Flash has one of the best and speak costumes in comics so just use it.

^^ Exactly. Thank you.

 

[Crimz]

That's funny, most GL comic fans I know didn't care for the show, and most kids thought it was kind of boring. Kids I know watched episodes of Justice League and JLU on Boomerang over your CGI GL show.



It's the closest to perfect anyone has come, and a hell of a lot closer to it than GL: TAS and Beware The Batman.




Some of the self contained "filler" episodes are the best ones (The Late Mr Kent, Myxyxpyxlated, Almost Got 'Em)....that is okay for them to do you know. Doesn't always have to be Breaking Bad.



This coming from the guy defending GL: TAS, and I liked the animation designs. I thought most of them were great. The Bruce Timm style of cartooning got me into drawing as a kid.




No, I didn't watch Avatar, didn't have any interest in it...therefore I don't have much of an opinion on it other than there is nothing that has caught my eye about it to interest me enough to form an opinion...on it. I'm also not a fan of animes which you probably prefer. (Next you'll be telling me anime > comic books )

What's wrong with anime/manga?

 

[Boy Scout]

I was thinking, if they're going to keep things more grounded, then they may take a thing or two from the Kid Flash suit. What!? The traditional cowl doesn't cover his face well enough (unlike Batman's)...

I'm sorry...what?

 

[Shikamaru]

^ I think he means that Barry's nose + area around his eyes are not covered, unlike Batman.

 

[king666]

I was thinking, if they're going to keep things more grounded, then they may take a thing or two from the Kid Flash suit. What!? The traditional cowl doesn't cover his face well enough (unlike Batman's), I know, I know, the psycho-rigid purists are going to whine till the end of time, but the same way Green Arrow's traditional hat and little mask were not believable to conceal his identity (the hood took care of that), Kid Flash's goggles would conceal Barry's identity better, plus it could integrate a communications device, which could be very practical (and justify the wings too). Now let the haters hate!!

Looks like I'm a "psycho-rigid purist".

plus it could integrate a communications device, which could be very practical (and justify the wings too).

 

[Boy Scout]

^ I think he means that Barry's nose + area around his eyes are not covered, unlike Batman.

No, I know, I just think his argument is ridiculous.

 

[Sub-Zero]

anyone else get the feeling this show will be very spider-man like? like a young hero who cracks wise while he 's fighting crime/has trouble telling the girl he loves how he feels/has trouble with his responsibilities because of his great power/the fact that gustin looks like peter parker... i can see him name all of his villains kinda like how spidey gets all tongue in cheek with them.

 

[Kevin Smith]

What's wrong with anime/manga?

Nothing. I just prefer comics to them and think they are better as a storytelling format.

 

[Lantern Venom]

That's funny, most GL comic fans I know didn't care for the show, and most kids thought it was kind of boring. Kids I know watched episodes of Justice League and JLU on Boomerang over your CGI GL show.

)

Over at the Green Lantern Corps Message Board, which is almost exclusively long-time adult fans, we're still outraged that GL:TAS got only one season. It had so much potential.

 

[HighFivingMF]

I'm a huge Green Lantern fan. I love the comics. I love the movie. I love the show. I love First Flight. I love Emerald Knights. I love the Green Loontern episode of Duck Dodgers. I'm allowed to like a lot of things based on something I love, right?

 

[Loki882]

What part of "he'll be called Flash and have his traditional costume" do some people not understand? How many times to the showrunners, or Geoff Johns, have to say it before some people get the point?

 

[Mikelus]

Over at the Green Lantern Corps Message Board, which is almost exclusively long-time adult fans, we're still outraged that GL:TAS got only one season. It had so much potential.

Don't worry, he thinks he's right against the rest of the world, it doesn't matter it has good reviews and most people liked it.

Funny how the same who are against changing anything from the comics, even the nonsensical stuff (and there's plenty), find the changes... "ridiculous"... yeah, cause a guy fighting crime in spandex is not ridiculous at all. Christopher Nolan changed a lot of things from the comics, so it made sense and was more believable in live action, spandex is just stupid, that's why Batman's body armor is much smarter. Concealing your identity properly is also smarter than exposing your eyes, nose or your face too much, not wanting to change anything just because in the comics "this or that" (no matter how dumb the source material is sometimes), is not very rational when even in the comics they have changed things to make them more plausible.

 

[Kevin Smith]

I'm a huge Green Lantern fan. I love the comics. I love the movie. I love the show. I love First Flight. I love Emerald Knights. I love the Green Loontern episode of Duck Dodgers. I'm allowed to like a lot of things based on something I love, right?

I loved the Duck Dodgers episode.

Kevin Smith actually voices Hal in it I think. (I'd have rather seen a show off that GL than the awfulness of that CGI show - it was actually pretty good, maybe GL:TAS would have been better had it lasted longer - JL got better as it went along but it wasn't nearly as bad as GL was to begin with, what they had of the GL show just wasn't that great...wasted potential in my opinion)

 

[HighFivingMF]

I loved the Duck Dodgers episode.

Kevin Smith actually voices Hal in it I think.

Yep. It was Kev.

 

[Nathan]

Christopher Nolan changed a lot of things from the comics, so it made sense and was more believable in live action, spandex is just stupid, that's why Batman's body armor is much smarter.

This is bull. No one wants spandex and there are enough real world materials that would provide the same protection, even better actually, and still be light weight and flexible. So Nolan's Batman in knight armor was actually less realistic. Especially with him being filthy rich, and owning his own tech department that is supposed to be 10 years ahead of anything that's actually used in the field. He should have been running around in effin bulletproof fabric, and laughed in Talia's face, as she tried to stab him, unable to actually penetrate his costume's fabric.

 

[Kevin Smith]

Don't worry, he thinks he's right against the rest of the world, it doesn't matter it has good reviews and most people liked it.

Funny how the same who are against changing anything from the comics, even the nonsensical stuff (and there's plenty), find the changes... "ridiculous"... yeah, cause a guy fighting crime in spandex is not ridiculous at all.

So let's put some goggles on him to make it un..ridiculous?

Christopher Nolan changed a lot of things from the comics, so it made sense and was more believable in live action, spandex is just stupid, that's why Batman's body armor is much smarter.

Actually it was Burton who did that, but I'll give you that just for conversation's sake, with a human character you can understand how it would make sense for him to wear something that would protect him that is bullet proof or flame proof at least so you get away with that with Batman (and I don't think he needs "armor" like the kind you're a fan of, either, something flexible like what he wears in the comics that is bullet proof, shock proof, and flame ******ent would be just as well, if not better, IMO, so even there your argument is kind of moot - you're just a trendy, and black armor for all, all around is the trend). What you're not understanding is that every character isn't Batman and doesn't need to be looked at through the same lens Batman does.

I.e., The Flash wearing armor is stupid, one because he needs to be fast and it's just a bad look for him, clunky armor (even your precious Nolan armor) and mobility do not mesh, and 2, he has a protective aura around him when he goes into speed mode that protects him from things like burning up when he runs, his bones breaking due to the immense amount of pressure one's body would be under if they actually moved at that speed, etc. It's all explained in the powers...if you give them a chance to be explained, that is, and don't think they're just "stupid" because he's not in black armor.

Concealing your identity properly is also smarter than exposing your eyes, nose or your face too much, not wanting to change anything just because in the comics "this or that" (no matter how dumb the source material is sometimes), is not very rational when even in the comics they have changed things to make them more plausible.

All fine and good, but fortunately for us The Flash doesn't really need many things changed about him. His suit is fine the way it is. He moves most of the time so it's nearly impossible to get a glimpse of him EVEN IF HIS FACE WAS EXPOSED (even in the Golden Age comics Jay Garrick would vibrate his face so it would appear blurry to people if he had to stop, lol). I'm all for changing the source material if it doesn't work with its own set of rules in its own world and is stupid or too nonsensical - but The Flash, and many of the characters I defend on here, isn't one of them who needs that. So keep your "gritty oh so realistic" shakey cam plastic black armor and goggles shenanigans away from The Flash.

 

[Kevin Smith]

This is bull. No one wants spandex and there are enough real world materials that would provide the same protection, even better actually, and still be light weight and flexible. So Nolan's Batman in knight armor was actually less realistic. Especially with him being filthy rich, and owning his own tech department that is supposed to be 10 years ahead of anything that's actually used in the field. He should have been running around in effin bulletproof fabric, and laughed in Talia's face, as she tried to stab him, unable to actually penetrate his costume's fabric.

Yep. Thank you.

 

[Paradox1]

This is bull. No one wants spandex and there are enough real world materials that would provide the same protection, even better actually, and still be light weight and flexible. So Nolan's Batman in knight armor was actually less realistic. Especially with him being filthy rich, and owning his own tech department that is supposed to be 10 years ahead of anything that's actually used in the field. He should have been running around in effin bulletproof fabric, and laughed in Talia's face, as she tried to stab him, unable to actually penetrate his costume's fabric.

Bullet proof fabric is not good protection against high caliber weaponry.If it were don't you think armies and law enforcement all over would of adopted as standard gear? Bullet proof fabric as your lone protection is a fallacy. The fabric has been proven effective in "informal" testing against 9mm rounds and .45 Automatic colt pistols which puts it at IIa in armor graded by the institute of justice.

 

[Nathan]

Again, his tech department was supposed to be 10 years ahead of everything that's currently used. And even if bulletproof fabric alone isn't sufficient, he could have at least used it as a first layer of defense. Had he worn that in the movie, instead of whatever useless material he did wear, Talia's knife would have done nothing to him. And the 2nd layer, instead of being kevlar plates, could have been thin and flexible armor made out of carbon nanotubes, which would absorb the impact better than any kevlar ever could.

Heck, if he's truly worried about high caliber rounds, might as well ditch everything Lucius came up with, and just buy a Dragon Skin vest. That thing can survive a freaking grenade.

 

[Boy Scout]

Funny how the same who are against changing anything from the comics, even the nonsensical stuff (and there's plenty), find the changes... "ridiculous"... yeah, cause a guy fighting crime in spandex is not ridiculous at all.

1) What is ridiculous is your assertion that Batman does a significantly better job of concealing his secret identity.

2) Adding goggles to the costume will not make the Flash (or what he does) any less ridiculous.

3) I don't think anyone is resistant to change so much as we are resistant to the changes you want them to make.

Christopher Nolan changed a lot of things from the comics, so it made sense and was more believable in live action, spandex is just stupid, that's why Batman's body armor is much smarter.

Bulletproof fabric exists. If Nolan wanted to use it, he would have, and it would have made perfect sense.

Concealing your identity properly is also smarter than exposing your eyes, nose or your face too much

Batman's eyes have always been exposed in live action.

The lower half of Batman's face has always been exposed in live action.

Barry (traditionally) does not have an oddly shaped nose, so its exposure doesn't matter.

 

[Paradox1]

Again, his tech department was supposed to be 10 years ahead of everything that's currently used. And even if bulletproof fabric alone isn't sufficient, he could have at least used it as a first layer of defense. Had he worn that in the movie, instead of whatever useless material he did wear, Talia's knife would have done nothing to him. And the 2nd layer, instead of being kevlar plates, could have been thin and flexible armor made out of carbon nanotubes, which would absorb the impact better than any kevlar ever could.

Heck, if he's truly worried about high caliber rounds, might as well ditch everything Lucius came up, and just buy a Dragon Skin vest. That thing can survive a freaking grenade.

I understand and would of preferred that but writers put stuff in movies all the time that don't make sense. Like why didn't Stark just send his drones to defeat Mandarins men he first attacked.