The Batman Spoiler Discussion Thread

[flygerr5]

Hey man do you remember the song that was playing in falcone's office when he was playing pool? I have it stuck in my mind

Dean Martin - Volare
or
I Have But One Heart - from The Godfather soundtrack

It's gotta be one of those. Both of them were listed in the soundtrack for the movie

 

[Lautox]

Dean Martin - Volare
or
I Have But One Heart - from The Godfather soundtrack

It's gotta be one of those. Both of them were listed in the soundtrack for the movie

thanks good night!

 

[Nardz937]

I was rolling my eyes at the Joker reveal. Easily the most disappointing part of this movie.

I'm sure Barry Keoghan can be fine in the role but I just want that character to be given a rest for a good while. Batman has such a great Rogues gallery and they keep having to go back to Batman vs Joker for the millionth time.

 

[weezerspider]

I was rolling my eyes at the Joker reveal. Easily the most disappointing part of this movie.

I'm sure Barry Keoghan can be fine in the role but I just want that character to be given a rest for a good while. Batman has such a great Rogues gallery and they keep having to go back to Batman vs Joker for the millionth time.

It’s been 14 years since Batman and Joker faced each other in a live action film and he’s now arguably as iconic as Batman. It’s a packaged deal at this point. I honestly find it bizarre so many people here don’t seem to get that.

 

[Nardz937]

It’s been 14 years since Batman and Joker faced each other in a live action film and he’s now arguably as iconic as Batman. It’s a packaged deal at this point. I honestly find it bizarre so many people here don’t seem to get that.

I totally get it, dude. You think I don't realize how popular The Joker is? As a fan I just prefer to see new villains be given the shine as the Batman/Joker story has been done to death in live-action.

Also we just got Affleck's Batman and Leto's Joker in Suicide Squad and ZSJL. Not too mention the character got his own entire film a few years ago where the Wayne's were heavily pivotal.

 

[AndyTrevino]

The best way I could describe this Joker's appearance would be heavy burn marks all across the side of his face, burn marks leading up to the side of his head next to his ear. Curly/spiky short hair that is ONLY on the top. Heavy scarring around his mouth but that was the hardest part to see. Thats all I got. Somebody needs to take screenshots and brighten it up so we can get a better look.

The main gist of that is essentially that it looks like an open wound with his teeth exposed, which I guess is their version of the permagrin.

 

[flygerr5]

I was rolling my eyes at the Joker reveal. Easily the most disappointing part of this movie.

I'm sure Barry Keoghan can be fine in the role but I just want that character to be given a rest for a good while. Batman has such a great Rogues gallery and they keep having to go back to Batman vs Joker for the millionth time.

When was the last time Joker was in a solo Batman movie as a lead character? That's right. It's been long enough lol. People need to stop using this excuse. Joker is literally the greatest villain character not only in Batman's mythos but all pop culture history. Just say you don't like the character and move on, no need to make fake excuses like "They always do Batman vs Joker!"

It's literally only happened twice in cinematic history. Nicholson and Ledger

 

[flygerr5]

The main gist of that is essentially that it looks like an open wound with his teeth exposed, which I guess is their version of the permagrin.

I'm wondering what the hell happened to him. How did he terrorize Gotham? How did he get locked up? To what extent is Batman familiar with him..... so many questions

 

[weezerspider]

I totally get it, dude. You think I don't realize how popular The Joker is? As a fan I just prefer to see new villains be given the shine as the Batman/Joker story has been done to death in live-action.

Also we just got Affleck's Batman and Leto's Joker in Suicide Squad and ZSJL. Not too mention the character got his own entire film a few years ago where the Wayne's were heavily pivotal.

Ah yes those 30 seconds in SS and that three minute scene in a movie Not even released in theaters. Those definitely count as proper face offs.

A grown “joker” sharing a scene with a young Bruce Wayne in a bad Scorsese rip off counts too.

You got me.

 

[AndyTrevino]

I'm wondering what the hell happened to him. How did he terrorize Gotham? How did he get locked up? To what extent is Batman familiar with him..... so many questions

I'm gonna guess it's a version of the Red Hood Gang from Zero Year. So basically Batman may have locked him up before he was the actual "Joker"

 

[Nardz937]

When was the last time Joker was in a solo Batman movie as a lead character? That's right. It's been long enough lol. People need to stop using this excuse. Joker is literally the greatest villain character not only in Batman's mythos but all pop culture history. Just say you don't like the character and move on, no need to make fake excuses like "They always do Batman vs Joker"

I like the character a lot but he's been done to death. I realize he's popular in pop culture and that's why he's fast-tracked into everything.

How long has it been since Mr. Freeze was in a solo Batman movie as the lead villain? Even longer. And Clayface and Hugo Strange? Never. How about them instead?

It's literally only happened twice in cinematic history. Nicholson and Ledger

It's literally happened in every iteration outside of Schumacher. You say that like there are five others that didn't do Joker

Ah yes those 30 seconds in SS and that three minute scene in a movie Not even released in theaters. Those definitely count as proper face offs.

A grown “joker” sharing a scene with a young Bruce Wayne in a bad Scorsese rip off counts too.

You got me.

The Batman/Joker story has been done again in live-action films after TDK. Whether or not they happened in Batman solo movies is irrelevant because the recent iterations still count and are fresh in peoples minds.

 

[BattleAngel]

Seriously? It was that bad to you? I thought it was amazing. Barry is such a good choice. He felt really creepy to me and his laugh was perfect

Seriously. I don’t want a CW feeling Joker in an A+ cinematic Batman. His 2 minutes of cringe, complete with Annabelle cheesy music box theme music ripped me out of this movie.

Joker is too iconic - 2 minute cameo dominates conversation of a 3 hour film about Batman. IMHO it’s just a hugely unnecessary kick to the shins of this movie before it ends. Reeves should have had the discipline to leave it alone - it feels like he was worried he’d never get his shot at Joker so he was going to make sure to nod towards it. Whatever his motivation for the scene, it didn’t feel like it came from a place of confidence in this film. And I can just say my whole audience groaned.

 

[flygerr5]

I like the character a lot but he's been done to death. I realize he's popular in pop culture and that's why he's fast-tracked into everything.

How long has it been since Mr. Freeze was in a solo Batman movie as the lead villain? Even longer. And Clayface and Hugo Strange? Never. How about them instead?



It's literally happened in every iteration outside of Schumacher. You say that like there are five others that didn't do Joker



The Batman/Joker story has been done again in live-action films after TDK. Whether or not they happened in Batman solo movies is irrelevant because the recent iterations still count and are fresh in peoples minds.

I'm talking solely about Joker as a lead character in a Batman centric film. It's only happened twice. The last time being over a decade ago. All of the other ones don't count and aren't very good. Phoenix was good but he's not Joker lol. We didn't see him as Joker. That movie was basically a great character study on mental illness that just so happened to have the name Joker slapped onto it. It's been long enough and it's time for a filmmaker like Matt Reeves to take a crack at the character. I think he will make the definitive version of Joker.

You wanna know why Mr Freeze, Clayface or Hugo Strange aren't used much? Because they aren't Joker lol. They aren't as good. Joker is a complex, multi-layered character and Batman's arch nemesis.

I don't understand how some people really thought a massive Batman fan like Matt Reeves wouldn't eventually adapt Joker. It's inevitable

 

[AndyTrevino]

Seriously. I don’t want a CW feeling Joker in an A+ cinematic Batman. His 2 minutes of cringe, complete with Annabelle cheesy music box theme music ripped me out of this movie.

Joker is too iconic - 2 minute cameo dominates conversation of a 3 hour film about Batman. IMHO it’s just a hugely unnecessary kick to the shins of this movie before it ends. Reeves should have had the discipline to leave it alone - it feels like he was worried he’d never get his shot at Joker so he was going to make sure to nod towards it. Whatever his motivation for the scene, it didn’t feel like it came from a place of confidence in this film. And I can just say my whole audience groaned.

I'm sure they'll have more time to refine his character more in sequels and the Gotham PD/Arkham show.

 

[FunkMiller]

Yeah, Joker was entirely unnecessary.

 

[Nardz937]

I'm talking solely about Joker as a lead character in a Batman centric film. It's only happened twice. The last time being over a decade ago. All of the other ones don't count and aren't very good. Phoenix was good but he's not Joker lol. We didn't see him as Joker. That movie was basically a great character study on mental illness that just so happened to have the name Joker slapped onto it. It's been long enough and it's time for a filmmaker like Matt Reeves to take a crack at the character.

I think he will make the definitive version of Joker.

I'm so glad we can finally get a "definitive" Joker. Because Heath Ledger didn't earn it, I guess

You wanna know why Mr Freeze, Clayface or Hugo Strange aren't used much? Because they aren't Joker lol. They aren't as good. Joker is a complex, multi-layered character and Batman's arch nemesis.

Yes, Mr. Freeze is notoriously a flat, one-dimensional character who is obscure. So much so that the director of this movie is already talking about adapting the character. You sure know your stuff.

I don't understand how some people really thought a massive Batman fan like Matt Reeves wouldn't eventually adapt Joker. It's inevitable

It's more of a matter of how soon it potentially is happening for me.

 

[flygerr5]

I'm so glad we can finally get a "definitive" Joker. Because Heath Ledger didn't earn it, I guess



Yes, Mr. Freeze is notoriously a flat, one-dimensional character who is obscure. So much so that the director of this movie is already talking about adapting the character. You sure know your stuff.



It's more of a matter of how soon it potentially is happening for me.

Heath wasn't a definitive Joker. He was amazing, but there was a lot more that could have been done. Reeves will have multiple films and potentially an entire show to make this character the definitive version.

Never did I say Mr Freeze is a one-dimensional, flat or obscure character. I just compared him to Joker. He's not as good of a character. That statement is the truth. And Matt Reeves hasn't said he will adapt Freeze, he just answered a question stating that it's possible to make a grounded version of Freeze.

 

[Ultra Nolanite]

Seriously. I don’t want a CW feeling Joker in an A+ cinematic Batman. His 2 minutes of cringe, complete with Annabelle cheesy music box theme music ripped me out of this movie.

Joker is too iconic - 2 minute cameo dominates conversation of a 3 hour film about Batman. IMHO it’s just a hugely unnecessary kick to the shins of this movie before it ends. Reeves should have had the discipline to leave it alone - it feels like he was worried he’d never get his shot at Joker so he was going to make sure to nod towards it. Whatever his motivation for the scene, it didn’t feel like it came from a place of confidence in this film. And I can just say my whole audience groaned.

Have to agree here, the Arkham scene at the end felt tacked on and not satisfying. Done more effectively in Batman Begins.

The more I think about this movie the more I like it but that Joker scene was definitely a scene I would've expected Reeves to leave on the cutting room floor after having seen the movie as a whole himself.

I would've traded the Arkham scene for another Bruce and Alfred scene back at Wayne tower/batcave.

 

[blackmidi]

When was the last time Joker was in a solo Batman movie as a lead character? That's right. It's been long enough lol. People need to stop using this excuse. Joker is literally the greatest villain character not only in Batman's mythos but all pop culture history. Just say you don't like the character and move on, no need to make fake excuses like "They always do Batman vs Joker!"

It's literally only happened twice in cinematic history. Nicholson and Ledger

Couldn't agree more with this. I am DYING to see what the joker will do in this universe. If the riddler was this dark....I can't even begin to imagine how psychotically amazing joker will be. And I love the sound of Barry's voice and that laugh!

 

[kolyid]

Some of you just seem way to try hardy and weird about a two minute scene that was great and absolutely fit with the film. Joker is the definitive Batman villain and will be in the next two films. The general public will want it.

Batman has a huge rogue gallery but it’s over blown and only like 5 of them are cool.

 

[flickchick85]

After my 2nd viewing, happy to report it's still just as glorious!

One thing I appreciated more this time around was the through line of the mayor's son. In the beginning when Bruce sees him, he sees his failure to keep another kid from experiencing the trauma he did. When Alfred sees that kid through the eye camera, he sees his own "failure" with Bruce. Both characters look at the boy and see their failure. So it's only fitting then that at the climax, that same boy is the first one to take Batman's hand when he offers it to help. And now the kid represents redemption, as Bruce lets go of vengeance and finds his true calling. And in that sense, he's a sort of redemption for Alfred too, even though he's not there in that moment to see it.

Another thing I didn't catch the first time around was the significance of the seawall. In the opening scene, during the debate on TV, the mayor talks about how the seawall was the flagship accomplishment of the the Renewal Project, which of course we later learn became the cover for this whole corrupt operation after Thomas Wayne died. So the Riddler's plan centering on destroying the sea wall was an even more symbolic gesture than I thought.

 

[FunkMiller]

I VASTLY enjoyed the twist that the Riddler didn’t know Bruce is Batman. Possibly my favourite bit of the film. Pattinson sells the realisation wonderfully, and it’s a great character moment for both. I love that Reeves was canny enough to pitch the Riddler as smart…. but not that smart.

 

[Ultra Nolanite]

Some of you just seem way to try hardy and weird about a two minute scene that was great and absolutely fit with the film. Joker is the definitive Batman villain and will be in the next two films. The general public will want it.

Batman has a huge rogue gallery but it’s over blown and only like 5 of them are cool.

Well, I don't think it's try hard per sé and it doesn't really matter how short a scene you dislike is. It's OK that some people would've liked certain things executed in a different way.

Personally I'm still a little conflicted about the Penguin Rata Alada scene. I loved the scene itself but at the same time I feel like that's something Batman would've figured out himself.

Still a great movie to me.

 

[FunkMiller]

Personally I'm still a little conflicted about the Penguin Rata Alada scene. I loved the scene itself but at the same time I feel like that's something Batman would've figured out himself.
.

I think it works okay as a ‘this is still a Batman in learning phase’ kind of scene. A bit like a detective version of what happens with the wingsuit.

He’s clearly not the complete article yet. An occasional slip is fine.

 

[FunkMiller]

The more I think about the Joker cameo (and I also rewatched it on Twitter) the more I feel like it was the only really big misstep of the whole movie. It feels like something mandated by the studio, rather than something Reeves wanted. It feels so out of place within the context of the movie it’s in. And it’s such a by-the-numbers, rote version of the character. Did we really need the big, forced, repeated laughter? We all know he does it. Couldn’t we have had a much calmer, more monstrous Joker? More ambiguous? It felt like I was watching something from an entirely different movie. A considerably campier one. Poor choice.

Edit: one more thought occurs… does Joker’s inclusion mean those thugs at the beginning were in fact people taking after him? Similar to the Todd Phillip’s movie? Could Reeves be hinting at the makeup style without even showing it on Joker?

Maybe not. Just a thought.