The Batman Spoiler Discussion Thread

[PepS]

No he’s not. I was answering a question about the sequel.

Ah, right. Gotcha’.

 

[PepS]

I think it will be for some ppl. And for others on par with TDK.

 

[shauner111]

I know how Reeves would approach the sequel with Poison Ivy. Pay for my patreon to find out!

What if Matt Reeves turns the sequel into the Gotham version of his San Francisco in Dawn of the Planet Apes? More damage to the buildings from the flood, but I'm talking vines everywhere, rats infesting the streets from the flooding. The concrete jungle turns into a partial literal jungle. And the hot summer only makes it worse.

So now imagine Poison Ivy as a anti-Wayne. And even a anti-Nashton. Bruce Wayne wants to fix the city by putting his money into the rebuilding of the city and do what his father wasn't able to achieve. But Pamela Isley is like hell no, this is perfect. Don't fix anything. Stop what you're doing. The flood was the best thing to happen to this filthy corrupted city. Nature is powerful and this is the way it should have always been. Back to basics.

At first i agreed with those who said she'd be another repetitive Riddler motivation waiting to happen because she'd be targeting the elite for their inaction, right? But now I see a way to make her the polar opposite of that. Which makes her much crazier on the surface. There is nobody better for a role like that than Riley Keough right now. And I'm all for it. Although I understand why you guys would prefer the traditional PREY meets STRANGE APPARITIONS plot pitch.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Why are you so big on Riley Keough?

 

[Mindreaper21]

Well with what’s being said, give me Ivy and Scarecrow for the sequel. Scarecrow could use Ivy’s skills to create his fear toxin. With a city taken over by nature and its citizens filled with anxiety, I feel like that would be great way to go.

 

[emielaen]

Throwing Ivy into the mix would keep this fresh and nature overtaking the city after a flood would be a very rich visual departure.

 

[shauner111]

Why are you so big on Riley Keough?

She’s one of my favourite actresses.

She’s good in everything she’s in. She’s friends with Rob (and they dated) as well as Zoe. She’s worked with Zoe (Fury Road) and Jeffrey Wright (Hold The Dark). She’s worked with my top Harvey Dent choice Christopher Abbott (they were a couple in It Comes At Night). She fits the part for a young Pamela. Her resume is similar to Paul Dano in terms of the types of filmmakers she tends to work with from Soderbergh to Andrea Arnold to Saulnier to Von Trier. Oddly enough she appeared in Antoine Fuqua’s The Guilty which Dano was in, and in The Devil All The Time which featured Pattinson. “Zola” is in my top 10 this year. “The Lodge” was in my top 10 last year.

That’s why

 

[Boom]

Meh, not really here for Ivy or Freeze.

Hugo Strange, Joker, Two-Face, maybe even Scarecrow again.

 

[shauner111]

Throwing Ivy into the mix would keep this fresh and nature overtaking the city after a flood would be a very rich visual departure.

Yup! I’d still prefer a winter film set around Christmas but I can wait for a third movie. My current dream is to end the trilogy in a snowy Gotham where it’s like a freak show and the third act takes place inside Arkham. Outside is a blizzard. And the story concludes with Bruce, Alfred and Dick at home by a Christmas tree. Maybe Zoe can join too *steals the ornaments*

 

[Gothamsknight]

A sequel set during christmas with freeze as a villain is still something I'm dying to see. It hasn't been done yet and would be amazing. It's a no brainer for the noir setting.

 

[AndyTrevino]

I really want Scarecrow again. He's my second favorite behind the funny man

 

[C Prometheus]

Meh, not really here for Ivy or Freeze.

Hugo Strange, Joker, Two-Face, maybe even Scarecrow again.

Yeah, I've been desperately rooting for Hugo Strange to show up in a live action Batman film for ages. The guy's been around since before Joker or even Catwoman in the comics, after all.

 

[Mindreaper21]

Ivy could be reinvented as a Botanist/Florist turned serial poisoner. She deserves to be more than just a gimmick villain.

On a different note, if I look at the sequel as a second act, the best scenario would be a story that leads to a mass Arkham breakout. There needs to be an “all hell breaking loose” situation. Maybe Scarecrow is a psychiatrist at Arkham and orchestrates this. As for Penguin, there should be a growing mob war. Harvey Dent probably gets caught up in this and ends up losing half of his face.

 

[emielaen]

Yup! I’d still prefer a winter film set around Christmas but I can wait for a third movie. My current dream is to end the trilogy in a snowy Gotham where it’s like a freak show and the third act takes place inside Arkham. Outside is a blizzard. And the story concludes with Bruce, Alfred and Dick at home by a Christmas tree. Maybe Zoe can join too *steals the ornaments*

The snowy world will be a great look. And I’ve always loved the whole freaks taking over from the mob take. And Reeves reallllly playing Gotham as a character can just make it all feel even more palpable and weighty.

 

[Gothamsknight]

Count me in as wanting Ivy for a sequel as well!

 

[WayneMB]

I'd do anything for a nightmare fuel scarecrow in the sequel.

 

[shauner111]

Well with what’s being said, give me Ivy and Scarecrow for the sequel. Scarecrow could use Ivy’s skills to create his fear toxin. With a city taken over by nature and its citizens filled with anxiety, I feel like that would be great way to go.

The problem with using Scarecrow again so soon or in general is that there's not much variation there. It's basically the same idea of a whacko psychiatrist who tortures patients, spreading fear toxin in the city, ppl hallucinating, is captured and thrown into Arkham. It was all done in Batman Begins. Most of us would agree that it could be done better or creepier whatever. Sure. Age him up or change the costume. But it's still all the same ground covered by Nolan 15 years ago. It's like doing a remix as opposed to a new plot idea.

I doubt Reeves wants to do that. Which is a shame because he fits this universe so well. But what can you do differently that isn't superficial? The only way Crane would work in my eyes is if him or Mad Hatter are used in the intro of a sequel. Batman takes them down in the city and brings their ass to Arkham. Later in the movie Crane is there with other rogues and he's one of the many villains who has his time haunting Batman while he's trapped inside.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Yeah, I've been desperately rooting for Hugo Strange to show up in a live action Batman film for ages. The guy's been around since before Joker or even Catwoman in the comics, after all.

Having the name "Hugo Strange" probably doesn't do the character any favors.

 

[shauner111]

Regardless of whether Matt goes with Poison Ivy or not, the sequel simply needs more women. Gilda Dent? Leslie Thompkins ? Sarah Essen? Silver St Cloud?

Ivy could be reinvented as a Botanist/Florist turned serial poisoner. She deserves to be more than just a gimmick villain.

On a different note, if I look at the sequel as a second act, the best scenario would be a story that leads to a mass Arkham breakout. There needs to be an “all hell breaking loose” situation. Maybe Scarecrow is a psychiatrist at Arkham and orchestrates this. As for Penguin, there should be a growing mob war. Harvey Dent probably gets caught up in this and ends up losing half of his face.

Your description of Ivy sounds like a gimmick villain though. The florist who poisons ppl is just a gimmick type. I’d prefer her as a activist hippie who speaks many truths but her vision of what the world should be is unrealistic and mental.

She wouldn't be turning Gotham into something it's not. Gotham would already be f'd and she just wants it to stay that way. So you're not rehashing a Ras Al Ghul who has the power, the army to pull off a genocide or create mass panic in that classic eco-terrorist villain plot. Or Thanos snapping his finger and now it's a paradise.

What she says about society is right on the money, although what Pamela wants for Gotham is beyond irrational. We have too much communication with the outside world. We can barely access money without technology. The state of Gotham is no way to raise children. People have to work here. This makes her sound like a lunatic who needs help. Even if citizens COULD live like the way she's proposing, you wouldn't want to in disgusting Gotham City lol. You want Bruce to rise to the occasion and help his city.

So who would she target? She'd poison and try to seduce anyone who stands in her way. Batman is number one on that list so she'd have to be smart and use her skillset and natural beauty. She'd have her hippy followers who can disguise themselves well and infiltrate a government building or 1 percenter party and poison someone who wants to get Gotham back on track (Harvey?). Think of Rebecca Ferguson and her hippie cult in Doctor Sleep.

Your second paragraph...we’ve seen Riddler out in the wild. Time to keep him in Arkham. I’d also rather Joker make friends with new patients. Keep it going until the third movie.

 

[shauner111]

Having the name "Hugo Strange" probably doesn't do the character any favors.

Stage name would work here.

 

[cryptic name]

I’d be ecstatic to have Prey as a partial inspiration for a sequel with Rupert Thorne, Hugo Strange, and Silver St. Cloud.
The story element of Gordon being forced to head a Batman Taskforce would be great in a movie.

 

[rocco2216]

Very unlikely (Joker).

Why do you think the Joker is unlikely the main villain for the sequel?

 

[Iceman]

Count me in as wanting Ivy for a sequel as well!

I'm totally ready for a new take on Ivy

 

[Iceman]

Yup! I’d still prefer a winter film set around Christmas but I can wait for a third movie. My current dream is to end the trilogy in a snowy Gotham where it’s like a freak show and the third act takes place inside Arkham. Outside is a blizzard. And the story concludes with Bruce, Alfred and Dick at home by a Christmas tree. Maybe Zoe can join too *steals the ornaments*

I didn't know how much I wanted that till I read this.

 

[Kane52630]

What this series needs is Condiment King played by Conan O'Brien.