The Batman Spoiler Discussion Thread

[OnLeatherWings]

As much as I love Zoe's Catwoman - there's one thing I missed that every version of Catwoman always has...a sense of fun.

Catwoman, no matter how dire her situation is, always is having a twisted sense of fun in what she does.

Anne Hathaway and Michell Pfieffer had that quality alongside their depth.

I'd have just liked the writing to give Zoe a chance to show her Catwoman doesn't just do things out of necessity - in some twisted, adrenaline fueled way - she enjoys it to a degree.

She was just missing that mischievous spring in her step.

 

[Brotherhood]

Sure @BatLobster, I mean the whole idea of it is addressed in those scenes you mentioned and even Selina says it, which is why she decides to leave. But I feel the Joker/Riddler scene is almost a perfect example of show don't tell by comparison when it comes to the future of Gotham, and really hitting the point home. For me anyway.

It could also, for all we know, be Reeves basically saying stop asking me about Joker. Because before Keoghan was even rumoured, so many conversations were being had about the character, so he created a scene that basically says here's your answer now lets move on.

 

[antsman41]

Zoe makes this film seethe with so much fun; between her fighting style - or - her swagger. She sells some of the weightiest dialogue with a flair and intrigue that no other female "hero" / femme fatale is pulling off in the past 10 years of Marvel, F&F, or [SALT/Lucy/Red Sparrow/etc.] films have.

The closest I can think of is two actresses; Haley in Captain America and Ferguson in M:I. But, even here I think Zoe sells a more well-rounded character and has a stronger arc than both of them did due to the plot and Reeves.

 

[BatLobster]

Sure @BatLobster, I mean the whole idea of it is addressed in those scenes you mentioned and even Selina says it, which is why she decides to leave. But I feel the Joker/Riddler scene is almost a perfect example of show don't tell by comparison when it comes to the future of Gotham, and really hitting the point home. For me anyway.

It could also, for all we know, be Reeves basically saying stop asking me about Joker. Because before Keoghan was even rumoured, so many conversations were being had about the character, so he created a scene that basically says here's your answer now lets move on.

That's totally fair. I just wonder if there was a more tasteful, less in your face way to do it. I wonder if a montage of seeing some of the looting and aftermath would've been more effective. Maybe you see one of those gang members from the begining spraypainting a smiley face in the background somewhere. Enough to give a nod without giving the whole shebang. I dunno, just riffing. It's fine, just not my favorite at the moment.

 

[Brotherhood]

That's totally fair. I just wonder if there was a more tasteful, less in your face way to do it. I wonder if a montage of seeing some of the looting and aftermath would've been more effective. Maybe you see one of those gang members from the begining spraypainting a smiley face in the background somewhere. Enough to give a nod without giving the whole shebang. I dunno, just riffing. It's fine, just not my favorite at the moment.

Definitely could've been done in other ways. I will say I agree with Reeves' decision to cut the other scene (although we'll see if we get to see it so we can judge properly) but I'm mainly just glad it wasn't a full reveal and was quite subtle because a full reveal, I think, would have taken away from the ending we had and shifted focus somewhat from that last sequence with Batman and Selina. What we got was enough for me.

 

[Mindreaper21]

I literally just walked out of the theater and I’m blown the hell away! This film is just a totally different kind of beast.

 

[Brother Jack]

Kravitz kind of stole the movie for me. She has the most fleshed-out and well realized arc in the movie and gives Selina a ton of depth and nuance. I love Hathaway and Pfieffer but she might be the best on-screen Catwoman to date.

 

[BatLobster]

Definitely could've been done in other ways. I will say I agree with Reeves' decision to cut the other scene (although we'll see if we get to see it so we can judge properly) but I'm mainly just glad it wasn't a full reveal and was quite subtle because a full reveal, I think, would have taken away from the ending we had and shifted focus somewhat from that last sequence with Batman and Selina. What we got was enough for me.

You just know that once it's out on 4k, fans are going to attempt to brighten that shot. I'm curious how that will look and if it'll reveal a lot more of his appearance.

 

[antsman41]

Kravitz kind of stole the movie for me. She has the most fleshed-out and well realized arc in the movie and gives Selina a ton of depth and nuance. I love Hathaway and Pfieffer but she might be the best on-screen Catwoman to date.

The biggest difference to me is... Zoe was Selina Kyle.

Michelle's Catwoman was/is still mesmerizing. But, she's created whole clothe from Burton.

Anne let me down a bit, a little too much old hat 60's vibes. She killed her "acting" scene though in the bar. Everything is felt like cosplay, especially her being hard/bad.

Zoe's has heart, can kick your ass, comes from a bad background, feels like a true criminal with a conscious (thanks to Bats), yet could always be the occasional twinkle in Batman's eyes.

 

[flygerr5]

You just know that once it's out on 4k, fans are going to attempt to brighten that shot. I'm curious how that will look and if it'll reveal a lot more of his appearance.

Also wondering how much more we'll see of him in the second scene that will be released. I'm sure the second scene will reveal even more of his appearance because it sounds like a longer scene than the Riddler one

 

[flygerr5]

If Two-Face happens, it won't be till the third movie I think. Same with Joker, we won't see Joker as the main antagonist till the third movie. The second movie will be something completely different, may even be Batman having to fight through a gauntlet of villains taking advantage of the chaos in Gotham post the flooding with Penguin building his empire at the same time. Everything comes to a head in the third one with Penguin, Joker and maybe a returning Riddler.

Don't be so sure lol. Matt is obviously playing coy right now about whether or not the Joker is in the next film, probably because he hasn't even began writing the script. But I think there's a big chance Joker is one of the many villains featured in the sequel. No chance they wait till the 3rd film after all this teasing in this movie and potentially the GCPD/Arkham show

 

[flygerr5]

I have to say, Matt's take on this Joker is really refreshing and unique. It's better than I could have even imagined. A Joker that was born with disease/scarring and constant laughter.... this Joker is about to be the darkest, most evil iteration of the character we have ever seen

 

[BatLobster]

I think Anne was spot-on as the Selina as the thief who can grift and blend in with high society folk, despite despising them ala BTAS Selina.

Zoe was a pitch perfect version of a Year One style Selina who comes from a really rough background and made it believable that she could mingle with some of the most dangerous people in Gotham. She has the most meat to her role and definitely can see the argument for her being the best.

Michelle I think is still on another level in terms of the sheer acting prowess displayed. She very may well be to Catwoman what Heath is to Joker in that regard.

There is a similarity in Selina's arc in The Batman and Returns though, with her wanting to kill a man who has wronged her for revenge, with Batman trying to stop her.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Lithium]

The Joker will definitely have a big role in the sequel. I doubt he'll be the main antagonist but Reeves clearly has interest and skill in developing a gallery. I'm sure his intention is to fully develop him in the sequel alongside characters like Freeze or whomever he has interest in (in addition to seeing returning members).

 

[Mindreaper21]

Joker looks seriously F’d up. For a second I thought I was looking at Two-Face. Was Not expecting That!

 

[BatLobster]

I think it's pretty awesome that not only do we have both these scenes, but the strobe lights in the clubs are blue/red to reflect the primary colors of their respective films.

 

[flygerr5]

There were 4 classic characters of Batman's rogues gallery in this film, Riddler, Penguin, Catwoman and Joker. Hush and Bane were teased. I think the sequel will add even more villains to the rogues gallery whilst still developing the already existing ones. I want this world to feel like a grounded take on the Arkham games, where all kinds of villains exist in every corner of Gotham

 

[moviedoors]

Seen it twice now. The batmobile revving up in IMAX is the ****.

I love that Gordon repeatedly calls him "man".

 

[Lithium]

Are there other pictures of Joker out there that I've missed? Because it it seemed as if only his hair and upper face outlines were visible, nothing else And from the way Reeves describes him, there should be nothing to him but his perma-smile.

 

[moviedoors]

I was waiting to see it a second time before I weighed in on Joker, but I'm totally into it. 1) Matt Reeves has my complete trust at this point. Whatever he wants to do, I'm there. 2) I love how Barry is underplaying the voice. He's not doing anything overly affected or nasally. He's an actor that is able to play indefinably weird so well. Ex: THE KILLING OF A SACRED DEER and THE GREEN KNIGHT. You can't put your finger on what's so off about him. Judging by how horrifying he must look, he's smartly staying in the pocket of going small. When the make-up is doing that much work, you don't have to go big.

 

[flygerr5]

Are there other pictures of Joker out there that I've missed? Because it it seemed as if only his hair and upper face outlines were visible, nothing else And from the way Reeves describes him, there should be nothing to him but his perma-smile.

If you focus only on his mouth, there's a quick moment where he raises his head a bit and you can make out teeth, but its odd because the teeth are visible from the side, almost like his cheek has been cut open or something

 

[Lithium]

If you focus only on his mouth, there's a quick moment where he raises his head a bit and you can make out teeth, but its odd because the teeth are visible from the side, almost like his cheek has been cut open or something

Reeves said he didn't have scars so maybe it's his wide grin?

 

[The Shape]

The tech house music in the club scenes was awesome. They filmed portions of those scenes at Printworks in London, which is one of the best clubs I've ever been to. So that club really exists and is as crazy as it looked inside.

No "44 Below", though...

 

[Jekecy]

If you focus only on his mouth, there's a quick moment where he raises his head a bit and you can make out teeth, but its odd because the teeth are visible from the side, almost like his cheek has been cut open or something

Ok that’s exactly what I remembered, glad I wasn’t crazy. That damn window grate was obscuring so much.

Now that Reeves has actually described his ailment, I’ll be looking out for this permasmile.