BvS The BvS Rumor/Speculation Discussion Thread! - Part 1

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BatFan1979 said:
Not non-American. I guess maybe what they mean is non-white. That's what I kinda take "ethnic" as anyway.
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It'd be weird in that case because Javier Bardem is Spanish, which is European...which generally is taken as quite white.

Unless we're changing the connotation of "ethnic" to "doesn't look like they eat couscous and require SPF60 sunscreen".
 
I would think the ethnicity would be latino, and Spanish would pertain to nationality (i.e. Spain)
 
BatmanVSuperman said:
I would think the ethnicity would be latino, and Spanish would pertain to nationality (i.e. Spain)
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Eh...I think a lot of Spaniards might have a problem with being called Latino to be honest. People might have a misconception of Spain, not all Spaniards are dark haired and tanned.

Latino generally refers to somebody from Latin America too - which Spain isn't. It's kind of like thinking because Portugal and Brazil share a language their populations look similar. There just seem to be a few terms and connotations being conflated here.
 
DeadPresident said:
It'd be weird in that case because Javier Bardem is Spanish, which is European...which generally is taken as quite white.

Unless we're changing the connotation of "ethnic" to "doesn't look like they eat couscous and require SPF60 sunscreen".
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Well I wasn't saying that Spanish is ethnic specifically, but just clarifying what "ethnic" was to me. I agree that Bardem isn't "ethnic" going by that definition.
 
By American standards... Let's remember that at one time the Irish and Italians were considered an "other" by most European descended Americans.
 
DeadPresident said:
Eh...I think a lot of Spaniards might have a problem with being called Latino to be honest. People might have a misconception of Spain, not all Spaniards are dark haired and tanned.

Latino generally refers to somebody from Latin America too - which Spain isn't. It's kind of like thinking because Portugal and Brazil share a language their populations look similar. There just seem to be a few terms and connotations being conflated here.
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Here's the answer you're looking for. There was a time when "ethnic" literally referred to someone's ethnic background -- not his/her race. For example, a white person's ethnicity could be described as Irish, Italian, Polish, English, German, Russian, etc. Nowadays, things have changed a bit, though. For whatever reason, some people prefer not to use the term race anymore when referring to POC: so, they use the word "ethnic" in place of that.

As for what you said about Latinos, you're correct. Problem is, in the US and other regions, all Spanish-speaking individuals are sort of lumped together as one race when, in fact, most Hispanics (e.g., those residing in Latin America) are an amalgamation of races. For instance, you can have a white Argentinian of wholly European descent; you can have a Mexican of mixed European and indigenous (American Indian) roots; you can have a Panamanian of West African descent. There are even persons of Asian descent in Peru. Alberto Fujimori, a former Peruvian president, is of Japanese descent.

In short, I suppose you could say that many folks are ignorant on the subject. You'll even hear some refer to Gal Gadot as a POC on occasion. lol
 
ArmsHeldOut said:
Here's the answer you're looking for. There was a time when "ethnic" literally referred to someone's ethnic background -- not his/her race. For example, a white person's ethnicity could be described as Irish, Italian, Polish, English, German, Russian, etc. Nowadays, things have changed a bit, though. For whatever reason, some people prefer not to use the term race anymore when referring to POC: so, they use the word "ethnic" in place of that.

As for what you said about Latinos, you're correct. Problem is, in the US and other regions, all Spanish-speaking individuals are sort of lumped together as one race when, in fact, most Hispanics (e.g., those residing in Latin America) are an amalgamation of races. For instance, you can have a white Argentinian of wholly European descent; you can have a Mexican of mixed European and indigenous (American Indian) roots; you can have a Panamanian of West African descent. There are even persons of Asian descent in Peru. Alberto Fujimori, a former Peruvian president, is of Japanese descent.

In short, I suppose you could say that many folks are ignorant on the subject. You'll even hear some refer to Gal Gadot as a POC on occasion. lol
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Yeah, the only problem I'm spotting is with everybody latching onto the diversity topic they're throwing terms around without knowing what the actual definitions are. Ethnic = subdivisions within a larger population. So there can be Americans of Irish ethnicity, African ethnicity, German ethnicity, etc. Bardem is Spanish, Spanish ethnic groups would possibly include Basque, Castilian or Catalan for argument's sake. Importantly, ethnicity is generally applied in relation to nationality, where the country's population is the point of reference.

If people are using "ethnic" to denote non-white that's misuse of the word, or at best a connotative use of the word.

It's a little troublesome when anybody who isn't what some consider typically Caucasian-looking is suddenly defined as "ethnic". I mean, seriously, we're all ethnic because we all identify as part of one or another ethnic group. People thinking Gal Gadot or Javier Bardem are ethnic/ people of color (a questionable term IMO)...eh, can't take that seriously. Just a little skeptical of the terms being used is all. I'm also curious, if Gadot was actually like Janet Ashcroft from Wisconsin, or Javier Bardem was actually Todd Moore from Vancouver, would people still think they looked "ethnic"? ^_-
 
BatmanVSuperman said:
I would think the ethnicity would be latino, and Spanish would pertain to nationality (i.e. Spain)
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BatFan1979 said:
Well I wasn't saying that Spanish is ethnic specifically, but just clarifying what "ethnic" was to me. I agree that Bardem isn't "ethnic" going by that definition.
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I get where you guys were coming from now, I think folks might just be using the words with somewhat malleable definitions. Didn't mean to come off like I was talking down to anyone if that's how it came across.
 
I want to see Eastern European in the DCCU... :) if we are all PC these days....
 
DeadPresident said:
Yeah, the only problem I'm spotting is with everybody latching onto the diversity topic they're throwing terms around without knowing what the actual definitions are. Ethnic = subdivisions within a larger population. So there can be Americans of Irish ethnicity, African ethnicity, German ethnicity, etc. Bardem is Spanish, Spanish ethnic groups would possibly include Basque, Castilian or Catalan for argument's sake. Importantly, ethnicity is generally applied in relation to nationality, where the country's population is the point of reference.

If people are using "ethnic" to denote non-white that's misuse of the word, or at best a connotative use of the word.

It's a little troublesome when anybody who isn't what some consider typically Caucasian-looking is suddenly defined as "ethnic". I mean, seriously, we're all ethnic because we all identify as part of one or another ethnic group. People thinking Gal Gadot or Javier Bardem are ethnic/ people of color (a questionable term IMO)...eh, can't take that seriously. Just a little skeptical of the terms being used is all. I'm also curious, if Gadot was actually like Janet Ashcroft from Wisconsin, or Javier Bardem was actually Todd Moore from Vancouver, would people still think they looked "ethnic"? ^_-
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I agree entirely, DP. Like I said before, many are frankly just ignorant on the subject and unwilling to educate themselves further mostly due to lack of interest. As such, when they're exposed to conversations like this, it pretty much goes through one ear and out the other. The knowledge is out there, though. If they care enough to find it, they will.
 
ArmsHeldOut said:
I agree entirely, DP. Like I said before, many are frankly just ignorant on the subject and unwilling to educate themselves further mostly due to lack of interest. As such, when they're exposed to conversations like this, it pretty much goes through one ear and out the other. The knowledge is out there, though. If they care enough to find it, they will.
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:up:

I suppose by going on this little venture we've at least made some folks aware.
 
^ I also find that some are loathe to acknowledge certain truths when the crux of their argument is essentially based on sophistry.

DeadPresident said:
:up:

I suppose by going on this little venture we've at least made some folks aware.
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Most will forget by tomorrow. lol
 
Ah! Look at the dialogue I've started!

I didn't mean anything condescending with my statement, and I can see why it would be confusing. I said "ethnic," then mentioned Javier Bardem.

I wasn't calling him ethnic, I was just saying he's my choice for Darkseid. He's been my number one for a long time now.

As for my use of "ethnic," I was using it as a placeholder for "having an accent not originating from the US." I'm sure I used it incorrectly, and I apologize.
 
SUPERGRAVE said:
Ah! Look at the dialogue I've started!

I didn't mean anything condescending with my statement, and I can see why it would be confusing. I said "ethnic," then mentioned Javier Bardem.

I wasn't calling him ethnic, I was just saying he's my choice for Darkseid. He's been my number one for a long time now.

As for my use of "ethnic," I was using it as a placeholder for "having an accent not originating from the US." I'm sure I used it incorrectly, and I apologize.
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No blame on you at all or apology necessary, if it came across like I was having a go at you personally that's not what I meant at all. I was just discussing some of the more general tendencies I'd seen on SHH and in other discussions I've heard/seen.
 
Race man....
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I want to see Killer Croc and Will Smiths Deadshot appear in the next new solo Bat film! Batman vs Killer Croc is a must and would be cool to see Affleck&Smith face each other a bit
 
TX85 said:
I want to see Killer Croc and Will Smiths Deadshot appear in the next new solo Bat film! Batman vs Killer Croc is a must and would be cool to see Affleck&Smith face each other a bit
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I agree dude
 
Deadshot is one character thats kinda confusing. yes he kills, but so does punisher, and he comes off as an antihero.
I kinda look at deadshot as a guy who does kill, but he also wouldnt stand by and watch a kid in the street get hit by a car either.

The rest of the squad are just batsheet crazy.
 
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