Age of Ultron The Design & Origin of ULTRON

[Just_Human]

Thanks

 

[jaqua99]

you're welcome

 

[Lhûgion]

I really hope Joss will prove me wrong, but at the moment this whole 8ft-liquid-metal-face-Ultron just causes one reaction in my mind:

Spoiler

So maybe I'm lucky and he'll just be there for 5 minutes at the end or will look much cooler as I can imagine from that set foto

 

[JohnnyBlaze]

without a doubt, he will look much cooler as you can imagine from that set foto t:

 

[cherokeesam]

Where is Pepper while this scene (ultron walks into room with avengers) happens?

And where's Nick Fury? Wanda & Pietro....are they still captives of Von Strucker at this point? The sibs have been referred to as "Team Ultron" in the beginning in several interviews --- how would that work if "Team Ultron" is formed "spontaneously" in Tony Stark's lab?

Yeah, it's quite clear that Ultron creates himself. What it seems Tony does is produce the ingredients that spontaneously combust.

May not be as "spontaneous" as you think.
We can confirm, now, that Tony Stark definitely creates Ultron, and he creates Ultron as the AI to control his Iron Legion of "Avengerbots" (just my nickname for them, nobody fly off the handle here). So, if Wanda & Pietro are still "Miracles" in the employ of Von Strucker and HYDRA, how do they join "Team Ultron....?" Or vice versa....?

Consider this scenario. Tony creates his army of Robocops and Skynet to privatize world security and take the workload off The Avengers; that much is official. Now, suppose somebody in HYDRA gets the "crazy" notion to hack into Ultron and take it over. (Let's face it: if some crazy bird-loving Russian like Whiplash can hack Tony's **** and take over an army of drones, you can bet that there's even better hackers in HYDRA's employ that can do even more than that with Stark Tech that's already notoriously buggy as hell.) HYDRA reprograms Ultron to fight the Avengers; Ultron's internal AI takes over and realizes that it's not just "bad guys" or "good guys" that need to be exterminated, but humanity as a whole.

Voila: Tony Stark creates Ultron to fight villains. HYDRA hacks Ultron and reprograms him to fight heroes. Ultron gets a mind of his own and destroys BOTH sides of the "same coin that's no longer currency" --- i.e., humanity.

Sounds to me like a good compromise for our age-old fanboy argument about whether it's better for heroes or villains to have created Ultron. Why not both?

 

[The Endless]

I prefer the idea that Ultron is basically an insane Tony Stark.

From what we understand he at first creates Ultron to be a "supercop" AI. But as with the age old debate about drones, he doesn't have that human instinct, that ability to think outside of box, the morality to figure out wrong from right. Perhaps there is an incident that highlights this inherent flaw with using drones for warfare/police. So Tony thinks he has a solution. He installs his brain patterns to Ultron, to give him a more human outlook, a sense of morality, emotions (perhaps utilizing the tech Pym created to transfer Zola's consciousness into digital form?)

Then Ultron overwhelmed with these "emotions" goes nuts and sees that humanity is not perfect, that isn't worth saving. Not because of some logical conclusion, but because he literally hates humanity.

Ultron should be more Roy Batty than HAL. He should have dreams and real emotions. From what Whedon has said, i think that's what we are getting. His actions are not just dictated by logic, but feelings. That is what will separate Ultron from the countless other self aware AIs we've seen.

 

[jaqua99]

I really hope Joss will prove me wrong, but at the moment this whole 8ft-liquid-metal-face-Ultron just causes one reaction in my mind:

Spoiler

So maybe I'm lucky and he'll just be there for 5 minutes at the end or will look much cooler as I can imagine from that set foto

Nah. The Vile One, or whoever reviewed the trailer said the Ultron we see at the end of it, is the same one in the entertainment weekly cover

And where's Nick Fury? Wanda & Pietro....are they still captives of Von Strucker at this point? The sibs have been referred to as "Team Ultron" in the beginning in several interviews --- how would that work if "Team Ultron" is formed "spontaneously" in Tony Stark's lab?



May not be as "spontaneous" as you think.
We can confirm, now, that Tony Stark definitely creates Ultron, and he creates Ultron as the AI to control his Iron Legion of "Avengerbots" (just my nickname for them, nobody fly off the handle here). So, if Wanda & Pietro are still "Miracles" in the employ of Von Strucker and HYDRA, how do they join "Team Ultron....?" Or vice versa....?

Consider this scenario. Tony creates his army of Robocops and Skynet to privatize world security and take the workload off The Avengers; that much is official. Now, suppose somebody in HYDRA gets the "crazy" notion to hack into Ultron and take it over. (Let's face it: if some crazy bird-loving Russian like Whiplash can hack Tony's **** and take over an army of drones, you can bet that there's even better hackers in HYDRA's employ that can do even more than that with Stark Tech that's already notoriously buggy as hell.) HYDRA reprograms Ultron to fight the Avengers; Ultron's internal AI takes over and realizes that it's not just "bad guys" or "good guys" that need to be exterminated, but humanity as a whole.

Voila: Tony Stark creates Ultron to fight villains. HYDRA hacks Ultron and reprograms him to fight heroes. Ultron gets a mind of his own and destroys BOTH sides of the "same coin that's no longer currency" --- i.e., humanity.

Sounds to me like a good compromise for our age-old fanboy argument about whether it's better for heroes or villains to have created Ultron. Why not both?

he had Jarvis as an AI to control the legion, and he did. Why create another AI besides plot? RDJ even said in in interview that he kind of is like, oh..you stumble onto something, oh that's cool, how is it, here is what I have in mind... implying that he may not create the AI from complete scratch.


Also worth noting. I believe it was spader that said Ultron has a sort of biblical outlook. The viewers say that the scene where the avengers are...you know...and Ultron says, "no strings on me", apparently it looks similar to Thanos' asteroid.

It was also said that Ronan's mission is a sort of religious/holy one...Ronan works for Thanos. If we are getting a glimpse into the future, I am willing to be Ultron WILL know about Thanos. I bet Thanos at minimum will be name dropped.

 

[TheVision]

So movie starts with Avengers wrapping up HYDRA situation. Tony either has already created ULTRON who has been helping them or does it right after so they can take a break from Venging. They have the party. ULTRON secretly becomes self aware, sics the Legion on them. The Avengers fend off the attack. ULTRON splits (stealing JARVIS in the process), chills in his new pimp pad, starts his plans of exterminating The avengers and humanity. Works on upgrading his body, builds his drones and creates VISION. He contacts Quicksilver and SW and has them on his side for awhile until they decide to join the Avengers. VISION too.

 

[jaqua99]

So movie starts with Avengers wrapping up HYDRA situation. Tony either has already created ULTRON who has been helping them or does it right after so they can take a break from Venging. They have the party. ULTRON secretly becomes self aware, sics the Legion on them. The Avengers fend off the attack. ULTRON splits, chills in his new pimp pad, starts his plans of exterminating The avengers and humanity. Works on upgrading his body, builds his drones and creates VISION.

That sounds too typical, and recyclable.

It seems like the movie is just as muchh about developing Ultron as a character, as it is the Avengers.

 

[The Endless]

I don't think Ultron simply becomes self aware. I'm sure i read Tony installs brain patterns into Ultron. I can see him developing real emotions and feelings like a Roy Batty or Sonny from I, Robot.

How many times has a self aware AI gone rogue been done before?

How many times has a AI with real feelings and emotions been done before?

Ultron isn't simply an AI following protocols or logic. He's angry, he's sad, he's vengeful. Real human emotions in a robot.

 

[TheVision]

He breaks the strings Tony has on him. Whatever you want to call it. And ULTRON will definitely be inspired by Roy Batty. He'll be like a mix of HAL 9000 and Roys personality I think. So youll almost feel sorry for him in certain ways. I already got that feeling from the teaser.

jaqua99: Its typical? OK. Im just going by the info Ive seen so far. Maybe its totally wrong.

 

[Tony Stark]

Only Spader specifically says Ultron becomes self aware. We may be picking nits here, I'm not arguing that Tony doesn't do all of the things like uploading his personality and such.

Spader makes it clear that ultron based on the information he has access to and his childlike interpretation of the world decides that the only way to put the world at peace is genocide.

Ultron is "self created" in that he pieces himself together from the scrap bits of the iron legion. He then goes on a quest to constantly upgrade himself.

 

[DrCosmic]

And where's Nick Fury? Wanda & Pietro....are they still captives of Von Strucker at this point? The sibs have been referred to as "Team Ultron" in the beginning in several interviews --- how would that work if "Team Ultron" is formed "spontaneously" in Tony Stark's lab?

May not be as "spontaneous" as you think.
We can confirm, now, that Tony Stark definitely creates Ultron, and he creates Ultron as the AI to control his Iron Legion of "Avengerbots" (just my nickname for them, nobody fly off the handle here). So, if Wanda & Pietro are still "Miracles" in the employ of Von Strucker and HYDRA, how do they join "Team Ultron....?" Or vice versa....?

Consider this scenario. Tony creates his army of Robocops and Skynet to privatize world security and take the workload off The Avengers; that much is official. Now, suppose somebody in HYDRA gets the "crazy" notion to hack into Ultron and take it over. (Let's face it: if some crazy bird-loving Russian like Whiplash can hack Tony's **** and take over an army of drones, you can bet that there's even better hackers in HYDRA's employ that can do even more than that with Stark Tech that's already notoriously buggy as hell.) HYDRA reprograms Ultron to fight the Avengers; Ultron's internal AI takes over and realizes that it's not just "bad guys" or "good guys" that need to be exterminated, but humanity as a whole.

Voila: Tony Stark creates Ultron to fight villains. HYDRA hacks Ultron and reprograms him to fight heroes. Ultron gets a mind of his own and destroys BOTH sides of the "same coin that's no longer currency" --- i.e., humanity.

Sounds to me like a good compromise for our age-old fanboy argument about whether it's better for heroes or villains to have created Ultron. Why not both?

It's not a compromise, you're saying the same thing you always have, but... you're actually on to something. Ultron can get his strings cut by the Staff by Strucker while defeating HYDRA and freeing/recruiting the twins while the Aveners have a party. Viola, all rumors fulfilled and you don't have to pretend Whiplash wasn't Tony-level genius or that Tony doesn't fix technical problems, and all of Ultron's ideas about attacking the Avengers comes from Ultron's character development and the Avengers' actions, not from HYDRA's actions. That's a compromise, the bad guys are involved, but in a throwaway role, they don't have the same influence on Ultron as the Avengers do.

Perhap it's the twins who tell Ultron how murderous the Avengers are. Perhaps it's Wanda who cuts Ultron's strings. Lots of fun options involving the Avengers we know and care about.

Only Spader specifically says Ultron becomes self aware. We may be picking nits here, I'm not arguing that Tony doesn't do all of the things like uploading his personality and such.

Spader makes it clear that ultron based on the information he has access to and his childlike interpretation of the world decides that the only way to put the world at peace is genocide.

Ultron is "self created" in that he pieces himself together from the scrap bits of the iron legion. He then goes on a quest to constantly upgrade himself.

This is a good point. Also note, prior to the party, Ultron doesn't have a body. So whatever attacks HYDRA/recruits the twins is just Avegerbots. Only question is what exactly cuts his strings? AI Singularity? Scarlet Witch? Loki's Staff? Tony's mental imprint? A combination? Hmmm....

 

[TheVision]

I thought it was common in sci fi that the more an AI gets info, they become sentient at some point. Its like youre feeding it info, human ideas, etc etc and somewhere it becomes a thinking being who decides what to do on its own.

I dont think Tony wants ULTRON to become that way, it just occurs because of Tonys brain patterns and the info he gets. As we noted ULTRON basically is like Tonys evil alter ego/child.

 

[CoherentChaos]

Maybe Tony actually realizes after making Ultron that the AI is dangerous and then seeks to contain/destroy it. The difference between Ultron and Jarvis is that Jarvis was based on his dad's butler. Ultron's mind is based off Tony's. Maybe Bruce needs to talk some sense into Tony for him to realize it, but Tony does indeed realize that any bastard son of his will likely turn out bad.

Some HYDRA sabotage releases it, or saves it from the brink, and tries to harness it for their own use. But by then Ultron has already embraced independence, and hates both parties equally. He'll demolish what's left of HYDRA and take the Twins under his wing, hence Team Ultron.

Now where this all fits, before or after the party scene, is beyond my conjecture at this point.

 

[marcvader]

I would love if the staff were the trigger to give Ultron complete sentience.

 

[TheVision]

I dont think HYDRA has anything to do with ULTRON. The scepter: Ehhh I doubt its involved. I think hes purely a Frankenstein monster from Tonys mind.

 

[Ghostcrow13]

I think Ultron will be given set parameters by Tony in order to protect the world and achieve peace, Tony doesn't fully close the loops and Ultron decides using the parameters that humanity needs to be extinct for peace to be truly achieved

 

[TheVision]

Yeah its definitely related to Tony programming ULTRON to be a peacekeeper for the world. Once he realizes that humans are war loving creatures he decides that to really have peace you have to get rid of people.

 

[Just_Human]

I dont think HYDRA has anything to do with ULTRON. The scepter: Ehhh I doubt its involved. I think hes purely a Frankenstein monster from Tonys mind.

I dont think the sceter is involved, but I want to know why they showed it in the SDCC trailer

 

[DrCosmic]

^Sounds like the Scepter's involved somehow...

I dont think HYDRA has anything to do with ULTRON. The scepter: Ehhh I doubt its involved. I think hes purely a Frankenstein monster from Tonys mind.

I think Ultron will be given set parameters by Tony in order to protect the world and achieve peace, Tony doesn't fully close the loops and Ultron decides using the parameters that humanity needs to be extinct for peace to be truly achieved

I don't think Tony would overlook something like "don't kill everyone," after what almost happened to Pepper, and I don't think Tony would program Ultron to cut his own strings. There's got to be something other than programming that frees him.

 

[TheVision]

So you think someone takes the scepter and zaps the computer ULTRON is in? Then he turns evil? lol

Tony writing ULTRONS program: .....OK Rule #1: DONT KILL US PLEASE!

 

[Just_Human]

Perhaps Ultron uses the scepter to weaken Hulk?

Or maybe to power up his suit and his drones ?

 

[The Endless]

Ugh i don't want HYDRA to be involved with Ultron's creation or sentience at all.

I want Ultron to come to the realization himself. Through his own feelings and emotions. That's what separates him from most other rogue AI's. He actually has feelings. Unfortunately for humanity those feelings are mainly anger and hate.

 

[Just_Human]

Ugh i don't want HYDRA to be involved with Ultron's creation or sentience at all.

we all know it won't be the case